Professional Pool Players Stance

[eklypze]

From watching many pool and snooker videos on youtube, I have seen a lot of differences in the way pool players play versus snooker players. I don't claim to be a pro in either but I have played for a bit over a year now, so I do know enough of the basics.

A question I have always wondered is why do professional pool players look so sloppy when they are shooting and feathering? The way a snooker player holds it in comparison is so firm and elegant, don't get me wrong the pool players always manage to play with decent accuracy but the appearance to someone like me who is a beginner or anyone who does not play cue sports just looks horrible.

For example, we can take Ronnie O'Sullivan or Stephen Hendry from snooker and compare the stance to Efren Reyes or Bustamante. There's a huge difference.

Is there a reason for this? Why don't pool players hold a firm/elegant stance like snooker players?

[DandyA]

From watching many pool and snooker videos on youtube, I have seen a lot of differences in the way pool players play versus snooker players. I don't claim to be a pro in either but I have played for a bit over a year now, so I do know enough of the basics.

A question I have always wondered is why do professional pool players look so sloppy when they are shooting and feathering? The way a snooker player holds it in comparison is so firm and elegant, don't get me wrong the pool players always manage to play with decent accuracy but the appearance to someone like me who is a beginner or anyone who does not play cue sports just looks horrible.

For example, we can take Ronnie O'Sullivan or Stephen Hendry from snooker and compare the stance to Efren Reyes or Bustamante. There's a huge difference.

Is there a reason for this? Why don't pool players hold a firm/elegant stance like snooker players?

I think you're talking about American pool on 8" x 4" tables with buckets for pockets ... if so, I think the skill is good positioning on ultra-fast cloths but not in potting - American pool players must have a 10 to 20 degree margin for error on most pots so they don't need to get their chin on the cue or stand very well ...

Snooker players probably have less that a 5 degree margin on most pots hence the better stance - they have to have it or they'll miss (the same doesn't apply to American pool players because of the much bigger margin for error) ...

But that's not to criticise American pool ... you try running a rack of 9-ball and you'll see how jolly difficult it is!

[Terry Davidson]

eklypze:

Most players learning pool or snooker will copy those players they consider to be the best. In snooker it might be Davis, Hendy or O'Sullivan or some other and in pool it just happens to by Bustamonte and the rest of the Phillipino players who have copied them.

DandyA is almost right, a pool table it actually 4.5ft x 9ft with 4.5in pockets and 2-1/8in balls with super fast cloths with no nap. The margin of error is much greater in pool.

But, I wouldn't encourage any player, whether at pool or snooker, to copy that loose, pump-handle, one-foot-behind-the-other stance that Bustamonte has. Just ask yourself this one little question. Steve Davis made the last 16 of the World 9-Ball Championships in Manila with very little practice.

In addition, the American Woman's 9-Ball Tour is DOMINATED by 4 ex-snooker players from Britain (Alison Fisher and Karen Corr for 2 of them) and if you get away from the Phillipino pool pros, you will see pool pros from the rest of the world have a more square stance and a snooker-type cue action.

Check out Darryl Peach, who won the World 9-Ball year before last, He's from England and looks like an ex-snooker player.

It stands to reason a more solid stance and cue action will win the day, even on a pool table although I will admit in 9-Ball there's also a lot of luck involved in any given rack.

Terry

[DandyA]

DandyA is almost right, a pool table it actually 4.5ft x 9ft with 4.5in pockets and 2-1/8in balls with super fast cloths with no nap. The margin of error is much greater in pool.

I stand corrected on table size but are you sure about the balls? I had the idea in my head they were 2 1/4in ...

Anyway, they're certainly big ... only played it once - damn near broke my snooker cue in half hitting the first shot (and more importantly my wrist due to backlash) so I switched to a rack cue ...

Completely different from snooker or UK 8-ball pool but nevertheless enjoyable ... bit like the difference between baseball and cricket - both very good games involving a bat and a ball but totally different ...

[DandyA]

[QUOTE=Terry Davidson;417704Steve Davis made the last 16 of the World 9-Ball Championships in Manila with very little practice.[/QUOTE]

oooh did he? don't suppose anyone has some video links for this on YouTube or whatever ... Steve Davis is my hero ... he's maybe 5 months younger than me and he doesn't cue quite as well as me but he's OK ...

that's a joke peeps!

I did fairly recently watch a YouTube of Ronnie playing a 9-ball tournament from a couple of years back and he got absolutely crucified by his American opponent ... just goes to show you that whilst American pool looks like a stupid game because of the bucket-sized pockets, it isn't - the skill is in the positioning and the ability to "run out" as they call it ...

[Terry Davidson]

DandyA:

You're correct on the ball size as I just measured my own set (I have a pool table in my training facility along with the snooker table). I believe I was thinking of American snooker which is played on 5x10ft tables with really tight pockets and 2-1/8th inch balls.

On Steve Davis playing in the World 9-Ball, I didn't see it on youtube.com, it was on TV here on our sports network (TSN) who don't show any snooker. In fact they're showing the US 9-Ball championships right now. I think it was the year before Darryl Peach won it, so maybe 2 or 3 years ago.

In fact, Steve did better than any of the Canadian pool professionals I think as only one of them made the last 16 or 32.

Terry

[DandyA]

DandyA:

You're correct on the ball size as I just measured my own set (I have a pool table in my training facility along with the snooker table). I believe I was thinking of American snooker which is played on 5x10ft tables with really tight pockets and 2-1/8th inch balls.

On Steve Davis playing in the World 9-Ball, I didn't see it on youtube.com, it was on TV here on our sports network (TSN) who don't show any snooker. In fact they're showing the US 9-Ball championships right now. I think it was the year before Darryl Peach won it, so maybe 2 or 3 years ago.

In fact, Steve did better than any of the Canadian pool professionals I think as only one of them made the last 16 or 32.

Terry

cheers for that Terry ... if anyone does have that video of Steve (either online or on CD/DVD), I'd love to see it

[poolqjunkie]

The Taiwanese pool players have very nice and solid stroke and stance in my opinion. Some pinoy players have forms resemble that of snooker players such as Marlon Manolo and Lee van Corteze.(spelling is probably wrong)

The pinoy players believe in "smoothing" the ball in and they are very loose in appearance, but I do not think they look sloppy. Efren in my opinion has one of the smoothest stroke of all the players alive, and he can move the ball around the table with such precision with very little efforts.

Also, American pool tables are not really buckets. The Diamond pro cut pockets are very unforgiving. The ladies are playing on Brunswick gold crowns which have more forgiving pockets. The US 9 ball Open is played on Diamond tables and they are not buckets for sure. A lot of the tables used in tournaments these days would fit about 1.8 balls. Some money tables only fit 1.5 or a bit more. The cut of the pockets do make shots a bit easier down the cushion, but they are not easy shots when you have to shot them with lots of screw and side to go two or three rails to get position.

In my opinion, I think the major difference is because 9 ball requires very precise cue ball control because you are only playing position on one particular ball, and a lot of "power shots" and "side shots" to get positions on the next ball. A lot of players are trying to use a looser grip to gain better control on the cue ball, and a more sideway stance and longer stroke which allows them to generate more cue power with more follow through. I also think that players like Bustamenta uses his wrist a lot to generate side and power, thus his loose grip and form. They are probabaly all taught that way so they all stand the same way.

Efren goes through the ball very well. If you zoom in at the moment his cue goes through the ball, there is nothing sloppy about that.

The interesting thing I have noticed recently is that 9 ball coaches are teaching their students to keep their elbow up, chin on the cue, and to cue with two pauses, with a compact action more like a snooker player; while snooker coaches are now talking about driving the ball with the elbow, dropping the elbow, and to cue with more follow through.

May be both forms have their own merits?

[ace man]

I have about six years of pool experience, very little experience at snooker. I always use almost snooker like square stance whether I play pool or snooker. You can still be very stable with a stance where two feet are one behind the other, but I never liked it. Square is more stable to me. The only limiting factor is at hard break-off where you might need full body movement...only for that shot I switch to wide pool stance where weight balance is more forward...
Also, average pool table can be up to about 10cm lower than a snooker table, so that alone will dictate stance style, especially if you're a little bit taller. Best pool player from my country stands with his both legs bent. My goodness it is dreadful to watch, but it works for him obviously...

[vucko117]

I have about six years of pool experience, very little experience at snooker. I always use almost snooker like square stance whether I play pool or snooker. You can still be very stable with a stance where two feet are one behind the other, but I never liked it. Square is more stable to me. The only limiting factor is at hard break-off where you might need full body movement...only for that shot I switch to wide pool stance where weight balance is more forward...
Also, average pool table can be up to about 10cm lower than a snooker table, so that alone will dictate stance style, especially if you're a little bit taller. Best pool player from my country stands with his both legs bent. My goodness it is dreadful to watch, but it works for him obviously...

Ace man, who is the best player in Croatia? Is it Ivica Putnik?

[ace man]

Ace man, who is the best player in Croatia? Is it Ivica Putnik?

Yep, it's him although some may argue.

[vucko117]

well I have heard only good things about him. Heard that he is a great player and great person too

[poolqjunkie]

Ivica Putnik is a great player, a young man who always has a smile on his face off the table.

[vucko117]

how many players do you know from Croatia,or Serbia?

[matoski]

My oppinion is that the difference between the stance in pool and snooker is because snooker players start practicing very young, with a coach who makes them spend a lot of time practicing the basic techniques (including stance). Pool players start playing rather old, without any coaching, or practicing the techniques. They find out on their own the best stance which suits them better. I play pool with snooker stance, which comes very natural to me because of watching milions of snooker matches on eurosport in my life.