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[hotpot]

Whoever suggest getting rid of unions should read theories of Karl Marx and Friedrich Hegels views on capitalism and marxism , if it wer,nt for trade unions fighting for workers right then we,d still be nothing but slaves .

FACT .

[gem]

I agree you need to have something in place to keep workers safer and have some kind of voice but the unions of today only look to fill their own greedy pockets.
Many companies operate fine without any union at all.Current legislation easily copes without the need for the outdated unions to make their outrageous demands.
They call strikes when they feel it will cause the most harm to the public as they know it might get them their wishes.
I feel that you should not be able to go on strike for salary or pension reasons, only if working conditions are dangerous.
If you don't like the money then move job like the rest of us have to.
The unions of today will not listen to anyone and want impossible wage and pension limits that the country can't cope with.

I would like to see the government withdraw any offers on the table and just change the pensions to a more manageable level.

I would rather see better terms for temp. workers and give them more rights. These people have no voice and this is a bigger issue than pension levels.

[arbitrage]

banana, mix and passion are the 3 nightspots to go to.

I'd happily pay nurses and firemen more, alot more infact, its the thousands of useless pen pushers that are the problem and tehy are the ones that complain the most!

Im not a Tory supporter no, but its quite evident savings need to be made an final salary pensions are an obvious problem to name but one!

Ive not had a pay rise for 3 years but you wont see me on strike as i'll be out on my ear with no job at all. Just got to put up with it unfortunately.

As for your assumption im in a 'good job like clarkson'...i sell insurance. Go me. Off to Beijing tomorrow for a meeting, sorry no, thats Barking. Oh the joys.

[hotpot]

Actually Gem strikes are quite rare , thats why they hit the headflines when they happen . You,re right about better rights for temps but their right have improved slowly over the years and will continue to do so thanks to trade unions . Bosses never gave you these rights on a plate and fight vigirously to deny them .


I dont think the demands are outrageous considering the outrageous amount of money mp,s have claimed for things like toilet seats , wallpaper etc .

Why dont they alter their pensions and give up their second homes , or pay for their booze in the house of commons , their pure hipocrits .
Dont do as i do do as i say .

[jim evans]

Actually Gem strikes are quite rare , thats why they hit the headflines when they happen . You,re right about better rights for temps but their right have improved slowly over the years and will continue to do so thanks to trade unions . Bosses never gave you these rights on a plate and fight vigirously to deny them .


I dont think the demands are outrageous considering the outrageous amount of money mp,s have claimed for things like toilet seats , wallpaper etc .

Why dont they alter their pensions and give up their second homes , or pay for their booze in the house of commons , their pure hipocrits .
Dont do as i do do as i say .

hear,hear hotpot why should maggie ,blair and co retire with 200 thousand pensionsclarkson is a yuppie like boris johnson and cameron,is idea of a joke is running your gran down in is new 200.000 thousand car what does 8 mile to gallon cos e dont give a fk

[garysnooker]

hi jim you talk a lot of sense you got my vote

[MikeWooldridge]

i'm with jim. they're all c*nts.

[hotpot]

For those of you who are interested , you should read some articles on Karl Marx . He spells it out plain and simple . On one hand you have the bourgeoisie and on the other you have the proletariat .

[jim evans]

well ime not a marxist ,communist,ime just a bloke who lets things carry on same as most,i tried to explain to my niece and the only way i can express it is based on a pyramid it used to be from top 1 person then 2 people and so on, the pyramid as changed shape now theres 100 on top then 200 and so on til you get towards the bottom, so the pyramid is now shaped like a hexigon ,eventually it will totally change back to a upside down pyramid and will topple

[gem]

There really should be no argument here. The country is short of money so anyone employed by it needs to take a hit. Can't be more simple than that.

Unrealistic demands by bullyboy tactics will never get my vote.

The rest of the country is struggling to get by and many, like me, don't even have a pension so I can never side with people that have beter hours, wages and job security than the normal working class person.

Quite a large amount of the striking workers in recent years don't actually agree with strike action because they know they have very good wages and conditions but they feel they have no choice but to strike due to the unhealthy pressure and threats put on them by union bosses.

[jim evans]

come on then gem tell me why the country is short of money,i have my ideas whats yours

[gem]

well ime not a marxist ,communist,ime just a bloke who lets things carry on same as most,i tried to explain to my niece and the only way i can express it is based on a pyramid it used to be from top 1 person then 2 people and so on, the pyramid as changed shape now theres 100 on top then 200 and so on til you get towards the bottom, so the pyramid is now shaped like a hexigon ,eventually it will totally change back to a upside down pyramid and will topple

This is why the government must be strong over the public sector demands and redress the balance. There are far too many employed by the government now and this is a huge drain on the taxpayer. This has to be addressed and the unions do not seem to care about this at all and are still intent on pushing for totally unrealistic pension and salary levels.
This will lead to the 'pyramid toppling' as you say.

[gem]

come on then gem tell me why the country is short of money,i have my ideas whats yours

Labour government!

[s.h442]

Whoever suggest getting rid of unions should read theories of Karl Marx and Friedrich Hegels views on capitalism and marxism , if it wer,nt for trade unions fighting for workers right then we,d still be nothing but slaves .

FACT .

I think we are all still slaves- to the money itself. It doesn't matter capitalism/ socialism/ communism ect its all the same all the power in the hands of a few people.

[gem]

I think we are all still slaves- to the money itself. It doesn't matter capitalism/ socialism/ communism ect its all the same all the power in the hands of a few people.

I agree.
unions in principle are great and have led to a better workplace but over the years they have moved away from just fair terms and conditions to being greedy and not caring for the employers.
The recent BA strike is a good example of this where they were already better paid than rival companies and still wanted more even though BA were operating at a loss.

Everyone ends up greedy for more money.