Brexit, in or out.

[Leo]

I talk to many people Gav who want to come out of the EU who can write well, and put it across well like yourself, and would have answers to everything you've just wrote, this is obviously the advantage you seem to have on here.
Unfortunately I'm not bright enough to put it into words like yourself, so Youre always going to look like your way is the right way, just unfortunate there wasn't someone more literate then myself on here Who can come back at you properly regarding the EU and put it into words rather then you thinking you know all the answers.

[ADR147]

I talk to many people Gav who want to come out of the EU who can write well, and put it across well like yourself, and would have answers to everything you've just wrote, this is obviously the advantage you seem to have on here.
Unfortunately I'm not bright enough to put it into words like yourself, so Youre always going to look like your way is the right way, just unfortunate there wasn't someone more literate then myself on here Who can come back at you properly regarding the EU and put it into words rather then you thinking you know all the answers.

Most people I know who want to leave the EU essentially when their argument is examined just don't like foreigners........

[Hello, Mr Big Shot]

Most people I know who want to leave the EU essentially when their argument is examined just don't like foreigners........

What's not to like about foreigners? The ONLY fit women around my way are foreigners.

It's about control. Is it unreasonable for a citizenry to ask its government to control who comes to the country? No good can come from any system of government that cannot control its borders. Priority numero uno, mush.

[ADR147]

What's not to like about foreigners? The ONLY fit women around my way are foreigners.

It's about control. Is it unreasonable for a citizenry to ask its government to control who comes to the country? No good can come from any system of government that cannot control its borders. Priority numero uno, mush.

There is no connnection - we are not in the free movement zone.

[Leo]

Most people I know who want to leave the EU essentially when their argument is examined just don't like foreigners........

Typical left wing agenda that ADR and rather silly to say they don't like foreigners, unless they've physically told you or they're generally worried about high levels of immigration and maybe you've took it upon yourself to say they hate foreigners, I've got a group of around 20 proper pals, 2 Indians yet they are worried about high levels of immigration from the EU and pretty sure they don't hate foreigners because that's quite a strong word, oh and my neighbour but one is Kurdish who was round for a BBQ last weekend.

Don't put us all in the same bracket please.

[Cannonball]

Most people I know who want to leave the EU essentially when their argument is examined just don't like foreigners........

That is usually the under-current, at least most of the time. I've heard a few of these UKIPs/brexiters use the N word in pubs, tis the modus operandi of ya knuckle draggers. And generally, you'll hear foreign muck this, foreign muck that. They rarely have any friends who ain't white. The odd ones do.

Now, having said all this, there are actually some honourable folk on the left, pro-Labour who certainly aren't racist and wish to leave for sovereignty reasons, the CAP, fisheries policy, net-imports reasons, etc. But these are the minority. The majority of the brexiters do tend to be somewhat xenophobic if not racist as well. So it's a bit of a surprise to find someone like Johnson who was mayor of a very mixed city, who hosted the Olympics, wishing to leave, after all the better off together stuff he preached.

[ADR147]

Typical left wing agenda that ADR and rather silly to say they don't like foreigners, unless they've physically told you or they're generally worried about high levels of immigration and maybe you've took it upon yourself to say they hate foreigners, I've got a group of around 20 proper pals, 2 Indians yet they are worried about high levels of immigration from the EU and pretty sure they don't hate foreigners because that's quite a strong word, oh and my neighbour but one is Kurdish who was round for a BBQ last weekend.

Don't put us all in the same bracket please.

I am sorry you feel you are tarred with the same brush however it is my experience. The levels of EU immigration have never been an issue.

[gavpowell]

I talk to many people Gav who want to come out of the EU who can write well, and put it across well like yourself, and would have answers to everything you've just wrote, this is obviously the advantage you seem to have on here.
Unfortunately I'm not bright enough to put it into words like yourself, so Youre always going to look like your way is the right way, just unfortunate there wasn't someone more literate then myself on here Who can come back at you properly regarding the EU and put it into words rather then you thinking you know all the answers.

Hang on, this is getting needlessly personal - yesterday you said "Gav has lost the plot" and today you're effectively accusing me of bamboozling people with words. To my mind, the people who make out they have all the answers are people who are adamant we should come out or adamant we should stay in, until their arguments are put under scrutiny and quite large question marks appear.

All I've done is put counter-arguments or ask questions - I'm not out to persuade anyone to "my side". It seems reasonable to me that if you make statements that might influence other people, you actually have some evidence.

I barely even have a side and if anything I'm actively looking to be persuaded one way or the other, it's just my innate suspicion of the political class in this country pushes me slightly towards a dilution of their power, at least until they are properly accountable. But that's a terrible reason to say "Yeah, let's stay in and carry on." so I'll likely not vote at this rate.

Vote in, vote out, don't vote, all good options as far as I'm concerned, but please don't get personal just because I ask you to provide evidence for something you said.

[Cannonball]

Hilarious, this whole nonsense vote was set up to save Cameron's bacon and save the Tory party from warfare. These towries supposedly hate waste but are quite happy to spend 500 cancer treatments on a pointless vote that will achieve nothing and not heal a single wound in their own party; it certainly won't close the issue, just as the huge waste of money hasn't closed Scots indy. They routinely have huge expenses claims as well, yep, the chancellor himself was caught with his pants down conning the public coffers with non-existent expenses. Quality.

[gavpowell]

Most people I know who want to leave the EU essentially when their argument is examined just don't like foreigners........

I know you're talking from your own experience rather than directly suggesting "everyone" but it does seem to imply it, which is extremely unfair.

[Leo]

Hang on, this is getting needlessly personal - yesterday you said "Gav has lost the plot" and today you're effectively accusing me of bamboozling people with words. To my mind, the people who make out they have all the answers are people who are adamant we should come out or adamant we should stay in, until their arguments are put under scrutiny and quite large question marks appear.

All I've done is put counter-arguments or ask questions - I'm not out to persuade anyone to "my side". It seems reasonable to me that if you make statements that might influence other people, you actually have some evidence.

I barely even have a side and if anything I'm actively looking to be persuaded one way or the other, it's just my innate suspicion of the political class in this country pushes me slightly towards a dilution of their power, at least until they are properly accountable. But that's a terrible reason to say "Yeah, let's stay in and carry on." so I'll likely not vote at this rate.

Vote in, vote out, don't vote, all good options as far as I'm concerned, but please don't get personal just because I ask you to provide evidence for something you said.

I'm not getting personal at all and apologies if you think I am, the Gav lost the plot was a bit tongue & cheek.

My point I tried but probably failed in my post is you seem a bright fella and coming up against me you'll always win the the written exam, I was trying to point out that if a proper eurosceptic was on here not me who knows the ins and out of the EU you probably wouldn't get such an easy ride if you see where I'm trying to come from.

Once again nothing against you whatsoever Gav, I've always frustrated myself as I've always suffered from brain type freeze where my mind kind of go blank when I think to much hence why I'll never be good at putting a decent argument across when writing.

[ADR147]

I know you're talking from your own experience rather than directly suggesting "everyone" but it does seem to imply it, which is extremely unfair.

I can't, or at least shouldn't, be held accountable for the literacy of others.

[ADR147]

I'm not getting personal at all and apologies if you think I am, the Gav lost the plot was a bit tongue & cheek.

My point I tried but probably failed in my post is you seem a bright fella and coming up against me you'll always win the the written exam, I was trying to point out that if a proper eurosceptic was on here not me who knows the ins and out of the EU you probably wouldn't get such an easy ride if you see where I'm trying to come from.

Once again nothing against you whatsoever Gav, I've always frustrated myself as I've always suffered from brain type freeze where my mind kind of go blank when I think to much hence why I'll never be good at putting a decent argument across when writing.

There are tricks to that. Jot down each point as it occurs to you, both for and against whatever the subject is, and then review your notes later.

[gavpowell]

I can't, or at least shouldn't, be held accountable for the literacy of others.

Well the secretary of state for education's no bleedin' good at it, so I picked you

[ADR147]

Well the secretary of state for education's no bleedin' good at it, so I picked you

lol - you would be amazed how often that happens!