14mm Talisman Tips

[edd147]

Over here in Germany I can order direct from Talisman Germany (and even pay with paypal) the Talisman tips in both WB and pigskin. The hardness is no problem either but for some reason they only do 14mm.

http://www.talismanbilliards.de/cue_tips_PRO.htm

http://www.talismanbilliards.de/cue_tips_WB.htm

Sorry about the links being in German, but when you scroll down and buy the tips you can get a good deal if you buy more. (you even get some thrown in free)

so now my questions:

1. Is there a big problem in delaminating with the bigger tip?

2. Is the quality the same as say the 11mm?

3. Are they taller or do they have more layers?

[screwball]

Go to www.talismanbilliards.com

[edd147]

Thanks for the reply, I was on that site before, I didn't click through to the "shopping cart" stage where you can choose 11mm (not available on the german site.

Does anyone know the score on export/import costs? or don't they apply?

[BITTER]

Has a thumb rule add 20% to cost for importing costs.

[edd147]

I went ahead and ordered direct from www.talismanbilliards.com

For info there is no extra costs as the following is at the bottom of the invoice (not even postal costs) :

"It is hereby certified that this invoice shows the actual price of the goods
described, and that all particulars are true and correct to the best of our
knowledge. These goods, technology or software were exported from the
United States in accordance with all applicable U.S. laws and regulations.
Diversion contrary to U.S. law is prohibited. No exports or re-exports of
these items, or related services and technologies, will be made to
individuals, entities, or countries prohibited by U.S. laws and regulations."

[bongo]

Are you buying 14mm for Snooker?!!, They are more like pillows on a Snooker Cue!!!

[ADR147]

14mm are no good they seperate when you cut them down - there is a good reason why we only buy 11mm !!!!

[poolqjunkie]

Over here in Germany I can order direct from Talisman Germany (and even pay with paypal) the Talisman tips in both WB and pigskin. The hardness is no problem either but for some reason they only do 14mm.

http://www.talismanbilliards.de/cue_tips_PRO.htm

http://www.talismanbilliards.de/cue_tips_WB.htm

Sorry about the links being in German, but when you scroll down and buy the tips you can get a good deal if you buy more. (you even get some thrown in free)

so now my questions:

1. Is there a big problem in delaminating with the bigger tip?

2. Is the quality the same as say the 11mm?

3. Are they taller or do they have more layers?

1. If you install the tip by cutting it upward(away from the ferrule) by hand with a knife or something like that, you could seperate the layers if you cannot cut the tip cleanly with single cuts. You should invest in some nice glues, give the glue sufficient time to cure and set, and use a very sharp new blade. May be you can cut the tip in about 3/4 the original thickness. Anyway, it is a very tricky business.
If you install your tip on a lathe, I would still recommend cutting the tip smaller before turning it, since the heat generated from the turning can also cause delamination if it is excessive. Also, sometimes the leather may "fray" if you turn it too much due to a dull cutter or something like that. By cutting it down a bit will reduce this chance. You can cut it by mounting the shaft on the chuck and then sort of use the blade to "peel" off the excess like you would peeling an apple. If you hav very sharp cutting tool, you may be able to just turn it down in a few passes with no problem though.
If you can get 11mm, I am sure it will be much easier to install.

2. The 11mm and the 14mm should be the same. If anything, Talisman probably sells a lot more 14mm than 11mm. Does that mean 14mm may be "fresher" I am not sure.

I have done Moori, Talisman, and some other layers and one piece tips many times both by lathe and by hand. I have noticed that with Moori, if the tip mushrooms too much and is too small, it sometimes chips after a power shot such as a draw shot. I am not sure if these are just isolated incidents. I have seen more happened especially on the harder tips.

[ADR147]

sorry but this is drivel, i can't imagine anyone would question my ability to fit a tip and i am not sure its relevant anyway, if a tip delaminates because of the way you fit it then it was going to fall apart after a few minutes anyway.

I was the first and the i am pretty sure the largest retailer of talisman tips in the uk i supply to a number of the top cue makers, cue doctors and snooker / pool professionals. the 14mm tips without question do delaminate more easily and more often than the 11mm - the reason we buy 11 mm is that they don't cut 10mm acuerately enough for us so 11mm is the smallest they can do without a compromise in quality, i have even had top players ask are you sure its the 11mm not the 10mm. as for the rate of delaminating on thousends per month i can say the 11mm will have approx 1 per 1000 not up to standard whereas beforehand when only 14mm was avaliable the rate was more like 50 per 1000.

As to freshness they are made to order for us when we call them.

[poolqjunkie]

sorry but this is drivel, i can't imagine anyone would question my ability to fit a tip and i am not sure its relevant anyway, if a tip delaminates because of the way you fit it then it was going to fall apart after a few minutes anyway.

Who questioned your ability to fit a tip? I hope you dont think I did cos that is not how I feel about you or what I tried to say. My previous post was directed to the person who started this thread. May be I misunderstood your post?

[ADR147]

i was pointing out that this is my area. by the way the number of people in the uk who would have a lathe that can take a 1.5m cue would be about 10 so tip fitting by lathe is not common here.

[cocked hat]

Talisman size

Calm down guys,have a laugh at my method instead.

I've fitted a lot of tips over the years even with wafers,superglue coming along was brilliant.The only time consuming bit was the trimming and shaping that you are discussing.
I stick the tip on as you're suggesting but then I bob it off on the bench grinder.It takes seconds,and produces a great finish.I know you folks will criticise it for being too severe but it really isn't as drastic as it sounds and can be carefully controlled against the side of the finer grit wheel.A tiny tad of final finishing by paper is needed obviously.
The heat generated is not great and I've always reasoned that it's better to have a tip fail at the fitting stage than on the table,although this is very rare with this method.
I've not used any Talisman yet,in fact I'm going hotfoot to ADR's shop to try some and see what all the fuss is about,Im sure I can fit one without it de laminating.

[poolqjunkie]

I am sorry ADR147. I did not know you would take my post the way you did. it was not meant to be.
Speaking of delamination, sometimes it has nothing to do with installation. Some tips are know to delaminate easier than others. I think it has to do with the glue, how stable it is against moisture, hest and such, and the way the layers were pressed. Moori has a very good reputation against delamination.
But if the glue used between layers does not take chalk very well, then the tip may be more prone to miscueing and would require lots of tip piking and such.

[The Doctor]

Ive used Talisman for 4 years now and i love them. i use the hard tip. However as Andrew will confirm, the Hercules H2 tip is also a very nice tip, takes chalk very well too.

[ADR147]

yes they are great tips - takes more skill to fit one well though