Again about cues

[vucko117]

First I want to say something. I have become a member of this forum for couple of reasons. The main reason was that I wanted to buy a cue and I was in a need for some good advices. After I bought that cue I was thinking that I will never buy a cue again because there is no need for that. But now... I am addicted I have two Robin Cook cues. One of these is still at Robin's workshop as I am going to pick it up in person in October.. And I want another one This one is going to be for 9 ball pool. And I am asking again for some advice. The question is next: which cue maker to choose? I have two options one is Keith Josey he is based in US and I have only heard great things about his cues,of course he is making pool cues. And the other option is,believe it or not,Robin Cook Great cue maker,great person,and he told me that he can make a 9 ball pool cue without any problems,he can taper it as a pool cue,he is even having white material for the ferule... The price of the cue is going to be almost the same so that is not an issue,waiting time is also the same... So I am not sure is it choose Josey as he is a great pool cue maker,or to choose Robin as I am already playing with his cue and I am sure that he can make a perfect pool cue? What would you do..

[poolqjunkie]

I think it would be cool if you have Robin Cook to build you an extra 9 ball maple shaft for your snooker cue.

For 9 ball cues a lot of players are really concerned about the joint, and most people do not like a brass to brass contact. Is Robin Cook going to be using the same standard snooker joint on this cue?

For myself, I think Keith Josey is a top notch cue maker in every sense of the word, and a great value for the money. Mike Capone also builds a heck of a cue without too high a price tag. But Keith offers better service and is more easy to talk to and deal with in my opinion. This could be important if you ever have any problem and you are located far away.

If you ever want to get a 314 or any of the after market shaft, having a snooker joint may prove to be a big problem. Keith and Mike both use radial pins on their cues and are easy to match a shaft with (even a used shaft on ebay could fit).

Also, if you ever want to get an extra shaft for your Robin Cook, will he be able to do it without you sending the butt back to him? I know Keith Josey will be able to do that, as his shafts are all cut by CNC and are interchangable. Again, for someone who is quite far away, this could be important, as this involves shipping charges and so on.

I have no experience with Robin Cook 9 ball cue so I cannot comment on them.

[bkpaul]

Not knocking any cue makers out there whatsoever but I always hear the same things, "oh his cues are great", "don't go there his cues are rubbish" etc etc.

Isn't the bottom line "does the cue suit YOU", and how can people by a cue say over the internet without never feeling it.

Yes it may be the same spec (same tip size, length weight, thickness etc etc) but 2 same spec cues may well (and often do) play compeltely differently.

I personally have only ever had 3 cues and all 3 were changed for length reasons as I got older and bigger, one cost me £10, one cost me £25 and my current cue cost me £125, I still prefer the £10 one albeit all 3 are ok.

Also people by a cue and then change it a week later because they don't like it.... it can take months if not years to settle with a cue, to know every millimeter of the cue, every response etc, you cannot learn that about a cue in such a short space of time.

I have hit big breaks with cues out of the club rack, I have hit them with friends cues but one common factor exists when I do that, I play my shots conservatively, I don't play big screw shots or lots of side or indeed touch shots as these extremes are what you learn from your cue over time and it is those shots that define how good a player is.

its like a relationship be it a friend or a partner, you may get on but you only really understand each other after years of being together, you become almost psychic to your friend / partner as you do to your cue and your cue to you.

This is of cause why you see rewards offered for the safe return of cues when they go missing, usually far in excess of their actual retail value.

[KeithinFrance]

First I want to say something. I have become a member of this forum for couple of reasons. The main reason was that I wanted to buy a cue and I was in a need for some good advices. After I bought that cue I was thinking that I will never buy a cue again because there is no need for that. But now... I am addicted I have two Robin Cook cues. One of these is still at Robin's workshop as I am going to pick it up in person in October.. And I want another one This one is going to be for 9 ball pool. And I am asking again for some advice. The question is next: which cue maker to choose? I have two options one is Keith Josey he is based in US and I have only heard great things about his cues,of course he is making pool cues. And the other option is,believe it or not,Robin Cook Great cue maker,great person,and he told me that he can make a 9 ball pool cue without any problems,he can taper it as a pool cue,he is even having white material for the ferule... The price of the cue is going to be almost the same so that is not an issue,waiting time is also the same... So I am not sure is it choose Josey as he is a great pool cue maker,or to choose Robin as I am already playing with his cue and I am sure that he can make a perfect pool cue? What would you do..

I think you've already answered the question yourself, Mark. If you trust a cuemaker and are sure he can make exactly what you want, then why change?
I know of Keith Josey, and yes, he has a good reputation, but, have you ever seen, held or played with one of his cues? If not, then how can you be sure his cues will suit you? It's a gamble.
When I gamble, I like my bet to be on a sure thing, as then I can't lose. If you bet on Robin, it's a sure thing; you can't lose.

[poolqjunkie]

Not knocking any cue makers out there whatsoever but I always hear the same things, "oh his cues are great", "don't go there his cues are rubbish" etc etc.

Isn't the bottom line "does the cue suit YOU", and how can people by a cue say over the internet without never feeling it.

Yes it may be the same spec (same tip size, length weight, thickness etc etc) but 2 same spec cues may well (and often do) play compeltely differently.

I personally have only ever had 3 cues and all 3 were changed for length reasons as I got older and bigger, one cost me £10, one cost me £25 and my current cue cost me £125, I still prefer the £10 one albeit all 3 are ok.

Also people by a cue and then change it a week later because they don't like it.... it can take months if not years to settle with a cue, to know every millimeter of the cue, every response etc, you cannot learn that about a cue in such a short space of time.

I have hit big breaks with cues out of the club rack, I have hit them with friends cues but one common factor exists when I do that, I play my shots conservatively, I don't play big screw shots or lots of side or indeed touch shots as these extremes are what you learn from your cue over time and it is those shots that define how good a player is.

its like a relationship be it a friend or a partner, you may get on but you only really understand each other after years of being together, you become almost psychic to your friend / partner as you do to your cue and your cue to you.

This is of cause why you see rewards offered for the safe return of cues when they go missing, usually far in excess of their actual retail value.

I am not disagree with what you are saying, and I think you have made a very good point.

I just want to respectfully point out that 9 ball cues and snooker cues are a bit different. Most 9 ball players, if not all, can switch to another cue and still mentain the same level of play. I am not sure what it is, but snooker cues are more personal in that sense.
I suspect it is because more machinery and computerized equipment are involved in the making of 9 ball cues, that they are somehow more predictable in terms of playability.

I have played with quite a few cues from Keith Josey, and they all hit very similiar. Workmanshipwise, they are all very precise and well executed. Price wise, he is cheaper than a lot of other makers with the same amount of inlays and works. So, if I see a Josey on ebay, and the cue looks decent in the pictures, and the spec are not too far off from what I like, I will consider buying it. My experience has been that I will 99% likely like it.

Somehow, snooker cue does not work that way for me. I have purchased a few cues from the cue maker direct and on ebay and they were not as good as I expected, but the main point is they all played differently even though they were from the same maker.
With 9 ball cues, you can specify many things, such as the weight of the shaft, the length of the ferrule, the taper measurement, the type of joint, material of joint pin, ferrule material, wrap material, how the cue is spliced, balance point...etc. You can be as specific as you like, and if you knwo what you want, you will likely get what you are looking for.

With snooker cue, most of the time it is just a few basic dimensions such as tip size, butt diameter, balance point and length. Without actually trying the cue, I cannot really know if I will like the cue based on these few data.

I dont really know what it is, we have heard that certain snooker players cannot win or cannot play well after losing his cue; but 9 ball players are not like that with their cues.

[vucko117]

Thanks guys I agree with all of you. I am not sure about joints Robin's is going to use,but does it really matters I can always make it as a one piece cue I also agree with bkpaul. It is the most important thing that cue suits you. To be honest one of the best playing cues I have was 30$ BCE cue. I also agree with Keith,I am having huge confidence in Robin and his craftmanship(is that correct word?) I must admit I have only had his cue and I have never tried any of other cue makers but honestly I don't like to change something that suits me.Also I agree that it takes months and months to find out does some cue suits you. BTW my new cue is going to have cocobolo butt

[bkpaul]

I just want to respectfully point out that 9 ball cues and snooker cues are a bit different.

No problem, as I am sure you can tell I am no 9 ball player, not really a pool player at all and hence I was talking as you rightly point out primarily about snooker cues but what I cannot accept is if you have 2 matched 9 ball cues they will play the same, even if they are taken from the same piece of wood.

What I am saying in reality is its impossible to make 2 perfectly identical cues and as such there will always be that slight difference, or in some cases not so slight!.

I appreciate what you are saying in that you can play well with the cue but there is a world of difference between "well" and "your best" and often that difference is the difference between winning an losing.

It also depends on the standard of the player, the average player will hardly notice any difference however the top amateur and pro players will almost certainly feel a world of difference.

I don't really even think its case of choosing the right cue for you, its a case of in some respects the cue choosing you, I know this sounds daft as its you who goes out and buys the cue but when I choose a cue I may play a few shots with hundreds of cues and still not buy one.

The feeling I am looking for is very hard to describe, its like how do you choose a partner.... no not the lustfull sort... the partner you want to spend your life with!.... that unfortunately is the only help I can give there.

Of course the basics have to be right, tip, weight, diameter etc etc but the rest is feel, intuition, response, etc and those things unfortunately don't have a measurable spec and each cue will react differently to the player using it.

The cue I used at my best was a friends cue, I used it to play a frame when my tip came off once and at the end of the frame I just turned to him and said please sell me you cue, the bond with the cue was instant and he sold me it... no I didn't hit a break in the frame (well ok 2 20 something's but of cause thats nothing) but it just felt so right.

I went on the win many a comp and compile probably 400-500 100+ breaks in 4 or 5 years so as you can see there is something to my ramblings.

A cue is a very personal item!

[vucko117]

I have also start noticing huge difference between cues once I have started playing really seriously. Before that I didn't care am I playing with club cue or with 10000$ cue,my game was the same

[bkpaul]

That's a good sign!, it means you have more of a feel for the game and your cue.

I would say given the spec of a cue is equal you should be able to pick yours out from several when blindfolded.

I don't recommend you marry your cue but it will become your mistress!

[vucko117]

that would be really interesting! That part with picking the cue blindfolded I am now experimenting with specs. My current cue is 20oz and 10mm tip,and my new cue is 18oz and 9.5mm. I have a feeling that new cue is going to suit me even better. Don't know why...

[bkpaul]

Interesting change of spec, why such a large difference, 0.5mm and 2oz that's massive!

My cue is 9.4mm & 17.75 oz, it originally was 9.5mm and 17.25 oz.

I think if I ever play competatively again I will reduce it to 17.5 oz primarily due to age and wear and tear on my shoulder, .25oz may not sound a lot bit it is in reality.

[vucko117]

well I have start noticing that sometimes I cannot control the cue because it is a bit heavy. Does that make sense to you? And my first cue was 9.5 and I changed to 10mm because I used that cue for both games snooker and US pool( I know I am na idiot but it is actuallt quite good to play pool with snooker cue).. But now I am going to play just snooker and I am much more comfortable with 9.5.

[bkpaul]

Yes it makes more sense now!... you had a cue that was jack of all trades and master of none... a happy inbetween...

Your new spec is one I would be much more happy with as a snooker player as 20oz is pretty heavy (some people like heavy cues though!).

Anyway good luck with your new mistress! I hope you two have a long and fruitful relationship

[vucko117]

exactly I was in between the two games. Because snooker is not popular in Serbia... But I just love to play snooker and I have decided that it is better to just concentrate on snooker then to be good pool player and average snooker player. 20oz is way too heavy for snooker... Maybe when I order this pool cue I will probably go for that weight maybe 19...

[vucko117]

Anyway good luck with your new mistress! I hope you two have a long and fruitful relationship

Thanks for the nice wishes