Can't get used to Ash

[Stick]

I have been going through a stage where I have been trying a number of different cues (after not playing snooker for many years) to re-determine what I like and what suits me best.

Once I have sorted through the dimensions (height, weight, etc) that I am comfortable with it soon became apparant that that I can not get along with an ash cue.

The grain lines are distracting to me, I dislike the "natural" feel of the ash and the slight imperfections thereof (bumps, dings, etc) seems to constantly work on my mind distracting me from concentrating on the pot.

So for me and my perfectionist ways it seems that maple is the preferred choice as it is smooth, of a constant colour and without a prominent grain.

Would be nice to hear from others whether I am a nutcase or whether people prefer maple for the same (or different) reasons than I do.

[DeanH]

These are my own feelings towards Ash shafts.
The look (although very pleasing sometimes) is off-putting when down on the shot and the feel is very annoying.
I have tried out many of my friend's ash cues and have not found one that matches my maple (and other maple cues I have tried).
As always this is a very personal choice and preference, and neither view is right or wrong, as with may factors in snooker/billiards/pool/etc. :-)
All the best
DeanH

[Bigmeek]

Stick Don't think you're a nutcase at all. I feel exactly the same as you and have had the same experiences. I played with a centre-jointed Maple cue all my life and last year decided to experiment and at the same time "modernise" my cue. I first bought a cheapy 3/4 Ash cue to try and then upgraded to a £170 Ash Craftsman. I'm happy enough with Ash but I think on balance I prefer Maple. The grain is a bit distracting and I'm always fiddling to get the grain pointing the same way for every shot. More importantly though I find "the hit" is better, ie more solid, with Maple. Not sure why this is but maybe cos Maple is a denser wood.
I think the most important thing I've learnt over the last year is that buying a cue "blind" over the internet is a bit of a lottery. Just because you specify weight, length, tip etc doesn't mean that the cue will suit you. The only way to buy a cue is to hold it in your hands and have a hit with it.

[nrage]

I have always used ash, however my cue is a cheap varnished one - so it's smooth to the touch. I really must try a nice maple some time. I don't currently/conciously find the markings of the ash distracting. I don't think I conciously 'see' them when I am playing a shot.

What sometimes bothers me, but in a good way, is the have a piece of tape I have on the top of the shaft to remind me where my bridge should be. It serves as a reminder to shorten my grip when playing with a short bridge (on the edge of the table). Eventually I wont need the reminder and I'll take it off. But, occasionally my hand brushes it, and I momentarily think what's that

[Stick]

Stick Don't think you're a nutcase at all. I feel exactly the same as you and have had the same experiences. I played with a centre-jointed Maple cue all my life and last year decided to experiment and at the same time "modernise" my cue. I first bought a cheapy 3/4 Ash cue to try and then upgraded to a £170 Ash Craftsman. I'm happy enough with Ash but I think on balance I prefer Maple. The grain is a bit distracting and I'm always fiddling to get the grain pointing the same way for every shot. More importantly though I find "the hit" is better, ie more solid, with Maple. Not sure why this is but maybe cos Maple is a denser wood.
I think the most important thing I've learnt over the last year is that buying a cue "blind" over the internet is a bit of a lottery. Just because you specify weight, length, tip etc doesn't mean that the cue will suit you. The only way to buy a cue is to hold it in your hands and have a hit with it.

Bigmeek, I agree with you 100% on the cue buying as well. Bought a fair number of cues "blind" recently. I mean how much can you really gather by holding it at a shop or just hitting a few practice shots with it on the oke's pool table?

It was only after trying to play with such a cue for a number of days that I could decide whether it works for me or not. Of the 5-odd cues I bought recently, the only one I felt comfortable with is a old Joe Davis one piece maple club cue.

I am always drooling over the beautiful and expensive hand-made cues on this site, but will probably never buy one because I think, realistically, the cue that is perfect for you is not the one that was "ordered and made to spec by so-and-so", but but the one that was "discovered to be right" whilst playing with it.

A costly excercise still the same

[Terry Davidson]

stick:

Just to let you know, most of the good cuemakers are now making the ash feel just as smooth as maple. I tried a Trevor White cue and was amazed at how smooth his finish was.

Now a coaching point...what are you guys doing looking at your cue when you are down on the shot?????

The ONLY way you should be able to 'see' the grain in an ash cue is via your peripheral vision as your eyes should only check the cue (and that's the line of the cue only) when the bridge hand first hits the table and possibly a very quick check at the front pause position just before the final backswing. Surely these very short checks shouldn't 'throw you off due to seeing the grain'.

I could understand if when standing behind the shot and forming your final grip you happened to check the cue and try and line up the chevrons, however THAT IS WHAT THE FLAT PART OF THE BUTT IS FOR!!! You don't have to actually look at the cue at all when you're standing behind the shot as your eyes should be focused on the OBJECT BALL only

Terry

[sanman]

I prefer ash over maple although I played with maple more than with ash
I am now sticking with ash

love the grain especially if its even and prominent

[ace man]

I use a maple cue and two of my club mates use ash cues. All three cues are top quality Trevor White, no cheap stuff.

My maple is a little smoother than mate's ash, but it has to be said that Trevor's ash feel is almost as smooth as maple, very very close. All three feel and play the same, nothing to choose between them really.

If you hold the cue at exactly the same place with respect to flat part of the butt, maple will develop slightly different colour where it slides on the bridge hand as opposed to where it never makes contact with the skin. Small dents and dings can be spotted more easily with maple. Of course, holding the cue at exactly the same place might produce uneven tip wear, does not matter if it's maple or ash. As a converted 9ball pool player, I found this uneven tip wear to be most shocking. I never had to deal with it previously as I had the freedom to turn the cue any way I wanted.

This is why I believe that ideal maple snooker cue should be produced with a round butt. Flat part of butt makes sense with ash and chevrons...am I making any sense? Opinions?

[hotpot]

Ace man , B Ds and elks both had the problem of wearing down on one side , usually the bottom . Since i,ve switched to laminated tips it is no longer a problem as once their played in they tend to keep their shape .

[KeithinFrance]

stick:

Just to let you know, most of the good cuemakers are now making the ash feel just as smooth as maple. I tried a Trevor White cue and was amazed at how smooth his finish was.

Now a coaching point...what are you guys doing looking at your cue when you are down on the shot?????

The ONLY way you should be able to 'see' the grain in an ash cue is via your peripheral vision as your eyes should only check the cue (and that's the line of the cue only) when the bridge hand first hits the table and possibly a very quick check at the front pause position just before the final backswing. Surely these very short checks shouldn't 'throw you off due to seeing the grain'.

I could understand if when standing behind the shot and forming your final grip you happened to check the cue and try and line up the chevrons, however THAT IS WHAT THE FLAT PART OF THE BUTT IS FOR!!! You don't have to actually look at the cue at all when you're standing behind the shot as your eyes should be focused on the OBJECT BALL only

Terry

Terry is absolutely 100% right in what he's said, especially about the being distracted by the grain - it should never happen. You should use the butt section of the cue to make sure you always hold the cue the same way, if that's what pleases you.

About the smoothness of ash vs maple: it's true that some cuemakers have such a good finish now that ash can feel just as smooth as maple, but it is still very unusual. Most ash cues will always have a slightly uneven feel because of the differences in density between the dark and light parts of the wood, whereas a piece of maple has a much more consistent feel to it.

I've tried ash and maple, but also greenheart, pear, hickory, oak, hornbeam and bird's eye maple too. Pear is the smoothest, but it's difficult to find a piece stiff enough to make a good player; hickory and oak are smoother than ash in general, but it depends on the finish, they are also too stiff to make good players and aesthetically speaking not too pretty; hornbeam can be very nice, and is very smooth, but again I find it too stiff; greenheart, which was used a lot during the 2nd World War, plays well, and looks nice too; bird's eye maple looks stunning, is as smooth as maple, and plays like it too, in my experience. Then we come back to ash and maple - generally, a good piece of maple is denser and has a 'meatier' feel than ash, but a good heavy piece of ash can be very dense too. Personally, I like a cue with a lot of spring in it, and I've found it easier to get what I want with ash than maple, but every piece of wood is different, and you have to know what sort of characteristics you're looking for in a cue to decide what kind of shaft you need/want.

In the UK it's easier to get an ash cue, and generally less expensive too, which is why a lot of people play with ash, and not for any other reason. If you're used to playing with a certain kind of wood, you're probably better off sticking with the same for your next cue, unless you're not happy with it. As usual, "if it ain't broke, don't fix it."

Some players have a sort of fixation about the chevron pattern on their cues, and will only buy a cue with a certain number of arrows, or with evenly spaced chevrons, but in my experience that has absolutely no effect on the way the cue plays, which is the most important thing! The most important things in a cue are the 'feel' of the shaft, the balance point and the build quality of the cue.

BigMeek said that he's fed up "buying blind" and he wants to try out a cue next time before buying, and I reckon that's the way to go. You are the one buying the cue, you're the only one who knows the sort of 'feel' you're looking for in a cue, and it's very, very difficult to successfully explain to another person - hence the number of 'custom made' cues for sale...

[Stick]

stick:

Just to let you know, most of the good cuemakers are now making the ash feel just as smooth as maple. I tried a Trevor White cue and was amazed at how smooth his finish was.

Now a coaching point...what are you guys doing looking at your cue when you are down on the shot?????

The ONLY way you should be able to 'see' the grain in an ash cue is via your peripheral vision as your eyes should only check the cue (and that's the line of the cue only) when the bridge hand first hits the table and possibly a very quick check at the front pause position just before the final backswing. Surely these very short checks shouldn't 'throw you off due to seeing the grain'.

I could understand if when standing behind the shot and forming your final grip you happened to check the cue and try and line up the chevrons, however THAT IS WHAT THE FLAT PART OF THE BUTT IS FOR!!! You don't have to actually look at the cue at all when you're standing behind the shot as your eyes should be focused on the OBJECT BALL only

Terry

It seems that I am indeed looking down the shaft instead of only doing a quick check because one cue I tried had a small blemish on the shaft about halfway between by bridgehand and face and that drove me absolutely mad

You (yet again) give me reason to contemplate and to spend some more time on the table

Some very interesting replies from the other guys as well, thanks for that.

[888]

stick:

Just to let you know, most of the good cuemakers are now making the ash feel just as smooth as maple. I tried a Trevor White cue and was amazed at how smooth his finish was.

Now a coaching point...what are you guys doing looking at your cue when you are down on the shot?????

The ONLY way you should be able to 'see' the grain in an ash cue is via your peripheral vision as your eyes should only check the cue (and that's the line of the cue only) when the bridge hand first hits the table and possibly a very quick check at the front pause position just before the final backswing. Surely these very short checks shouldn't 'throw you off due to seeing the grain'.

I could understand if when standing behind the shot and forming your final grip you happened to check the cue and try and line up the chevrons, however THAT IS WHAT THE FLAT PART OF THE BUTT IS FOR!!! You don't have to actually look at the cue at all when you're standing behind the shot as your eyes should be focused on the OBJECT BALL only

Terry

Yap, very important of the part, focused on the OBJECT BALL only.

[888]

I heard almost snooker player choosing ''ASH'' rather than ''MAPLE'' they claim that ash apply more spins than maple and maple are more to pool, sorry correct me if i'm wrong, thanks.. what i think is ''SKILL'' are most important, no matter you using ash or maple to apply crazy spins shots, so far i have seen some people in my club, they using a very cheap house cue and they can spin the ball very nice, deep screw full table from long distance shots! amazing..

[BoBnoGG!n]

i think yo trippin man. 'cant get use to ash'? pfft 0_o wat r u on?

LOL jk i kid i kid! hahaha think everyone knows here the suttle differences in both woods. we all hav preferences. im sorta digging the idea of maple for pool but ash for snooker lol dunno why -_-

[ace man]

I heard almost snooker player choosing ''ASH'' rather than ''MAPLE'' they claim that ash apply more spins than maple and maple are more to pool, sorry correct me if i'm wrong, thanks..

Utter and complete nonsense. Proof? Well, Stephen Hendry plays with a maple cue.