Is Stephen Hendry still using his Acuerate cue?

[nrage]

Some cue, how does it do that????

I think what henners was trying to say, is that Hendry has been searching for a cue with the same mechanics (size, weight, deflection) of his old cue which was tragically broken. Not that Acuerate Pro cues are magically coordinated to their user

Whether that is an Acuerate Pro or not, I don't know.

[Terry Davidson]

JP1:

Just a question as you seem to know about the ash. I've recently purchased an LK.T cue with his best ash shaft (Family I) and I presently use a top-of-the-line Trevor White cue and I also have a new Robin Cook cue.

I've been playing snooker on and off for 40 years now and still play in tournaments and am in the century break class plus I do minor cue repairs for a small customer base.

With the 3 cues mentioned above I cannot find any difference between the Family I shaft on the LKT and either the TW or RC cue and I assume LKT for his best shaft would choose to use the better grade of ash you mention above.

Is there some way to really tell is a shaft is a superior one? I've always found it depends on each piece of wood individually and two identical cues from the same cuemaker using the same ash will still hit differently and which one is 'best' is totally a matter of personal taste.

What would you say?

Terry

[Neil Taperell]

Thanks for your very informative reply , great in depth knowledge . Just would like to clear one thing up......you say ' no one in the UK imports coppice grown sporting ash ' .............But then you go onto say ' quite a few UK cuemakers venture to Hamburg Germany to buy their Ash for this very reason ' . So would you be able to specify this Ash from a UK cuemaker ? and if so could you advise who is the best cuemaker who would be able to supply an ash of this quality ?

Also , at no stage have i implied that UK Cuemakers rule . We live in a mulitcultural society and obviously there are exceptional cuemakers in all corners of the World . I just was slightly taken aback about the ash in UK cues not being as good as the Thai makers .

[Izzyfcuk]

I cant help but to reply to this thread regarding JP1's comments about UK cuemakers vs Thai cuemakers.

My thoughts are summed up as below

"Shallow is a verb i use for Depth measurement"

[JP1]

Yes I agree, and the better you get in the game the less of an issue the cue, shaft wood or quality thereof becomes,it's much like Sirloins Steak as opposed to Chuck Steak both are from the same animal both are meat and both will feed you, the difference is your own personal choice, one is rarer then the other hence it cots more.

Ash wood is generally of two types, building type quality and sporting ash quality, the former is quickly kiln dried to no particular moisture content as it is designed for and intended to do a job in the building industry, the other is air dried over a longer period,being coppice grown simply means from replenishable forests and these trees are purpose grown for their density and straightness, they are also heavier, their moisture content is kept at about 5-7% which is ideal for cues or baseball bats.

Anything requiring more care to produce and more care and time to harvest is by necessity going to cost you more, Nagel in Hamburg carried high grade sporting ash for a while I know a few UK cuemakers journeying over there to buy some together with the better quality ebony he sells.

There is no discernible difference how well a cue will perform on a table from either grade, those that want the best will opt for the straightest grain and the nicest shevrons and will pay a lot more for their choice, if you buy from a reputable cuemaker he will know how to treat the ash how to finish, seal and wax it so that you get the best possible playing situation regardless of grain or shevrons.

I have never owned an LK.T cue and I am not aware that they are in the same class for quantity as Master Cue, O Min, LP for example, I know they do very fancy inlay work of which I am not a fan hence I have never bothered to get one of their cues so I don't know what ash they use, or how good their cues are, I know of Trevor White but don't currently own one of his cues I have had two which I sold again, the workmanship and finish was second to none, beautiful to hold,but the balance was not for me, I own a Robin Cook cue which is now a few years old same excellent quality as Trevor's cues the ash on the shaft of mine is a bit wavy and has a small knot about 6" from the splicing tips so I would say the ash shaft is second quality but the cue is one the best I have ever had, so it's staying in my cue cabinet. I have also had a number of antique cues refurbished and resealed by Robin and he does the same excellent job on these. I have an old John Parris one piece with very odd ash grain but again an excellent cue I wont part with, a second JP Ultimate I have in the high 800's has straighter ash but is really just an ordinary mediocre cue, might put that one up for sale on this forum if anyone is interested. My playing cue for the past 12 months has been an LP one piece, I picked up the cue and it just felt very good great balance and very solid through the ball, a bit long at 58" I was going to cut it back to 57" but the length has not bothered me on the contrary so I'll just leave it as it is, as a matter of fact just before writing this I had a hit with it, a line up on my table at home, 8reds/blacks 5reds/pinks 2red/blues and the colors, good fun,I am going to play in the IBSF next month taking that cue.
You have the best wood people right there in your back yard, I was in the US 6 months ago and took the opportunity to visit a few of the sporting good and cue shaft manufacturers, I was very keen to get someone to cut me a dozen or so blanks in their best laminated ash and maple, I need blanks at least 46" in length for the 3/4 and 60" for one piece, all the cue shafts or dowels as they call them are max 32" in length and to set up the machines to do a small number for me they said would cost to much, I'd love to get hold of some blanks with various lamination density's from 12 to 28 rings to experiment with, from a technical point of view they ought to be better then a solid piece of ash, would be interesting to compare the feel you get from either in actual play, if you come across any blanks that suit, email me, I am happy to send you a finished cue so you can try one out yourself.

What do you think about the LK.T cue compared to your others?

Cheers
Joe

JP1:

Just a question as you seem to know about the ash. I've recently purchased an LK.T cue with his best ash shaft (Family I) and I presently use a top-of-the-line Trevor White cue and I also have a new Robin Cook cue.

I've been playing snooker on and off for 40 years now and still play in tournaments and am in the century break class plus I do minor cue repairs for a small customer base.

With the 3 cues mentioned above I cannot find any difference between the Family I shaft on the LKT and either the TW or RC cue and I assume LKT for his best shaft would choose to use the better grade of ash you mention above.

Is there some way to really tell is a shaft is a superior one? I've always found it depends on each piece of wood individually and two identical cues from the same cuemaker using the same ash will still hit differently and which one is 'best' is totally a matter of personal taste.

What would you say?

Terry

[damienlch]

I cant help but to reply to this thread regarding JP1's comments about UK cuemakers vs Thai cuemakers.

My thoughts are summed up as below

"Shallow is a verb i use for Depth measurement"

Dude, too deep for me... elaborate?

[JP1]

This is a question you should put to your cuemaker; Would you really know when you received your cue what ash it has and where it came from ??? If you are really selective or pedantic about your cue why don't you do what many have done before you, go and find your own piece of ash one that appeals to you and take it to your cue maker. I know a few who did this and they are extremely happy with their cues, after it was their selection of the ash, you know that beauty is in the eye of the beholder.

Thanks for your very informative reply , great in depth knowledge . Just would like to clear one thing up......you say ' no one in the UK imports coppice grown sporting ash ' .............But then you go onto say ' quite a few UK cuemakers venture to Hamburg Germany to buy their Ash for this very reason ' . So would you be able to specify this Ash from a UK cuemaker ? and if so could you advise who is the best cuemaker who would be able to supply an ash of this quality ?

Also , at no stage have i implied that UK Cuemakers rule . We live in a mulitcultural society and obviously there are exceptional cuemakers in all corners of the World . I just was slightly taken aback about the ash in UK cues not being as good as the Thai makers .

[khizzy]

http://178.63.93.9/acueratedemo.swf

any forum members who have used acuerate cues, please post if this really works or not.

[trevs1]

Hi Joe (JP1),

Some good posting and some very valid points.

To clarify.......

I have never used any timber from HDL for cue shafts, though I am well aware they used to sell it in serious quantities. I have bought ebony from them yes, but that has to be going on for 15 years ago now. Anyone doubting this can call and ask to speak with Simon Marsden who I'm sure would be happy to allow anyone to knock themselves out asking him what they have sold me in the last 10 years plus........nothing.

The ash I select and use is in board form and is usually in thicknesses between 1.25" or 1.5" and varies from 3" to 12" wide, in lengths of 10 foot if I can get it, as this reduces waste. It is very very well dried to between 6% to 7% (and yes, I ALWAYS check it with a meter) and is never outside that range. This is timber used by numerous industries, such as shop fitting, furniture manufacture or whatever. It's true that much of it is just not up to the standard required for good cues, but, this will be the case for a LOT of ash sourced from a LOT of places. It always needs careful selection to get the better stuff, but what I use is, and will be, as good as anything anywhere....fact. The secret, as you rightly point out Joe, is in quantity, and if enough is bought, then some of it will be good and some will be great, but some will not be so great at all. The same rule applies to more or less any other timber. Ebony for example is not always of the sort of quality for the very best guitar fingerboards, just as European walnut is not always the sort of quality for the very best gunstock blanks which go into the sort of shotguns made by Holland and Holland or the like. Inspection by trained eyes is everything, and will always be necessary in the selection process of something as anomalous as timber

The Germany thing....... I am certainly not one for making trips to Hamburg to buy ash.....no point.

As for the ebony Nagel sells, yes, many makers have, and still do use it, not because it's necessarily better than other ebony, but they did (and to some extent still do) have a bit of a stranglehold on the trade of it. It's not always the most brilliant quality either, and over the years has become more patchy, with the ratio in A grade to B grade getting ever more favourable to the merchant than to the end user, while the price keeps going up and up.

There are many other things I could add to the above, but I'll pass on it and will save boring everyone to sleep.

Be interesting to hear more of your views on UK makers bringing cues into the UK from the far east though Joe. You want to share.???

[eaoin11]

So the point is not so much how it's imported, but how well it's selected, and that suggests to me a big advantage in ordering cues from smaller-scale operators. The high turnover companies might be able to sift through a lot of wood but as a regular customer, how can you ever be guaranteed that yours was selected and made by their most experienced people? Of course it's different if you're Stephen Hendry.

[poolqjunkie]

Hi Joe (JP1),

Some good posting and some very valid points.

To clarify.......

I have never used any timber from HDL for cue shafts, though I am well aware they used to sell it in serious quantities. I have bought ebony from them yes, but that has to be going on for 15 years ago now. Anyone doubting this can call and ask to speak with Simon Marsden who I'm sure would be happy to allow anyone to knock themselves out asking him what they have sold me in the last 10 years plus........nothing.

The ash I select and use is in board form and is usually in thicknesses between 1.25" or 1.5" and varies from 3" to 12" wide, in lengths of 10 foot if I can get it, as this reduces waste. It is very very well dried to between 6% to 7% (and yes, I ALWAYS check it with a meter) and is never outside that range. This is timber used by numerous industries, such as shop fitting, furniture manufacture or whatever. It's true that much of it is just not up to the standard required for good cues, but, this will be the case for a LOT of ash sourced from a LOT of places. It always needs careful selection to get the better stuff, but what I use is, and will be, as good as anything anywhere....fact. The secret, as you rightly point out Joe, is in quantity, and if enough is bought, then some of it will be good and some will be great, but some will not be so great at all. The same rule applies to more or less any other timber. Ebony for example is not always of the sort of quality for the very best guitar fingerboards, just as European walnut is not always the sort of quality for the very best gunstock blanks which go into the sort of shotguns made by Holland and Holland or the like. Inspection by trained eyes is everything, and will always be necessary in the selection process of something as anomalous as timber

The Germany thing....... I am certainly not one for making trips to Hamburg to buy ash.....no point.

As for the ebony Nagel sells, yes, many makers have, and still do use it, not because it's necessarily better than other ebony, but they did (and to some extent still do) have a bit of a stranglehold on the trade of it. It's not always the most brilliant quality either, and over the years has become more patchy, with the ratio in A grade to B grade getting ever more favourable to the merchant than to the end user, while the price keeps going up and up.

There are many other things I could add to the above, but I'll pass on it and will save boring everyone to sleep.

Be interesting to hear more of your views on UK makers bringing cues into the UK from the far east though Joe. You want to share.???

Hi Trevor,
Do you believe coppice grown is better and if so, what is the benefit in your opinion?

[JP1]

It's really not up to me to name names Trev, I am quite sure that you already know who they are, besides I dont begrudge them the business they do, as you would know better then anyone it is not that brilliant anyway, What I have to say on the subject is this, that I do feel a bit for the niche cue maker like yourself, they put in a lot of effort not just in making the cue but sourcing the material, besides everyone wants the very best there is, I am sure you get your fair share of orders for the tightest of grain,straight arrows / shevron's call them what you will, 5, 6 or 7 on the shafts they want. It's a bit easier for the guys just buying in from the Far East and sticking their logos on the butt. Let me think about it maybe I will put out a list of who buys what from whom.

Hi Joe (JP1),

Some good posting and some very valid points.

To clarify.......

I have never used any timber from HDL for cue shafts, though I am well aware they used to sell it in serious quantities. I have bought ebony from them yes, but that has to be going on for 15 years ago now. Anyone doubting this can call and ask to speak with Simon Marsden who I'm sure would be happy to allow anyone to knock themselves out asking him what they have sold me in the last 10 years plus........nothing.

The ash I select and use is in board form and is usually in thicknesses between 1.25" or 1.5" and varies from 3" to 12" wide, in lengths of 10 foot if I can get it, as this reduces waste. It is very very well dried to between 6% to 7% (and yes, I ALWAYS check it with a meter) and is never outside that range. This is timber used by numerous industries, such as shop fitting, furniture manufacture or whatever. It's true that much of it is just not up to the standard required for good cues, but, this will be the case for a LOT of ash sourced from a LOT of places. It always needs careful selection to get the better stuff, but what I use is, and will be, as good as anything anywhere....fact. The secret, as you rightly point out Joe, is in quantity, and if enough is bought, then some of it will be good and some will be great, but some will not be so great at all. The same rule applies to more or less any other timber. Ebony for example is not always of the sort of quality for the very best guitar fingerboards, just as European walnut is not always the sort of quality for the very best gunstock blanks which go into the sort of shotguns made by Holland and Holland or the like. Inspection by trained eyes is everything, and will always be necessary in the selection process of something as anomalous as timber

The Germany thing....... I am certainly not one for making trips to Hamburg to buy ash.....no point.

As for the ebony Nagel sells, yes, many makers have, and still do use it, not because it's necessarily better than other ebony, but they did (and to some extent still do) have a bit of a stranglehold on the trade of it. It's not always the most brilliant quality either, and over the years has become more patchy, with the ratio in A grade to B grade getting ever more favourable to the merchant than to the end user, while the price keeps going up and up.

There are many other things I could add to the above, but I'll pass on it and will save boring everyone to sleep.

Be interesting to hear more of your views on UK makers bringing cues into the UK from the far east though Joe. You want to share.???

[JP1]

You just had Stephen Hendry in your neck of the woods, did you go??He does not mind at all to answer a few questions from aspiring players, you could have asked him about his cue there and then? Hendry does not use a special magical cue, it's the same cue you can buy, what he does have over you is a bit more ability on how to use that cue (no offence, I am sure you are top player yourself) One of the nicest cues that appealed to me is the new cue used by Graham Dodd, I recall someone on here being friendly with Graham confirmed it was made by Hunt & Osborne in London to replace his Andy Gibb cue that got eaten by woodworms, it's just a plain ebony butt ash shafted cue, but it looks very solid, Mark Williams new cue likewise looks very nice as does Ali Carters. So long as YOU are happy with whatever it is you use.

So the point is not so much how it's imported, but how well it's selected, and that suggests to me a big advantage in ordering cues from smaller-scale operators. The high turnover companies might be able to sift through a lot of wood but as a regular customer, how can you ever be guaranteed that yours was selected and made by their most experienced people? Of course it's different if you're Stephen Hendry.

[eaoin11]

You just had Stephen Hendry in your neck of the woods, did you go??He does not mind at all to answer a few questions from aspiring players, you could have asked him about his cue there and then? Hendry does not use a special magical cue, it's the same cue you can buy, what he does have over you is a bit more ability on how to use that cue (no offence, I am sure you are top player yourself) One of the nicest cues that appealed to me is the new cue used by Graham Dodd, I recall someone on here being friendly with Graham confirmed it was made by Hunt & Osborne in London to replace his Andy Gibb cue that got eaten by woodworms, it's just a plain ebony butt ash shafted cue, but it looks very solid, Mark Williams new cue likewise looks very nice as does Ali Carters. So long as YOU are happy with whatever it is you use.

I couldn't this time unfortunately. But I did manage to see him play at the 2006 China open in Beijing. They call him 'the Emperor' and that seems appropriate with the presence he has.

I know what you mean but cues vary a lot in terms of how well they hit and I think most players agree on which cues hit well, and which cues don't regardless of preferred specifications.

[JP1]

Good post on YouTube look it up, http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dNNnA...eature=related You can clearly see the four palm wood lower butt splices over the thick maple veneer, as well as the two strips LP uses, on the cue Stephen plays with, instead of the round logo discs used by Acurate. Low deflection rubbish, the better player laughs about these claims anyway, what happens with the Acurate cue when you want and need side on your cue ball ??? """Sorry this is a low deflection pro cue no side allowed.""" as they say you can fool of all of the people some of the time and some of the people all of the time but you cant fool all of the people all of the time.

If this low deflection "invention" was so revolutionary in the game would you contract a Chinese manufacturer to produce them for you?? And if they were any good the Chinese would have flooded the market with their own copies like they did with their earlier cues, Lou Pei copied the style John Parris was producing until he got to a stage where he found his own style, Master Cue of Thailand did the same, O Min copied the early Will Hunt cues.

It's the NEW Acuerate Low Deflection Pro Cue