Is Robert Osborne Right?

[cazmac1]

RO told me how much he got for the last batch of cue's I won't put it on here just lets say it was a fair amount of cash.
Gerry stop trying to put words in to my mouth I have never said that RO was a bad cue maker.

[Gerry Armstrong]

RO told me how much he got for the last batch of cue's I won't put it on here just lets say it was a fair amount of cash.
Gerry stop trying to put words in to my mouth I have never said that RO was a bad cue maker.

Of course it was a fair amount of cash, no doubt for a fair amount of cues and no doubt LESS than the RRP of 1 cue X the number of cues in the batch.

So what are you saying?

[cazmac1]

Many of you may know that Robert Osborne is no longer taking orders for custom made cues because he say's that it is too much hassle dealing with snooker players constantly making last minute changes to there spec's, wanting shafts the look a certain way and of course ordering cues and then not paying the balance. Robert is now happy to take bulk orders from china with a standard spec then ship them out with no contact with the end user. Now Robert is trying to make a living just like the rest of us but some how I feel he's lost his way. Making cues is more than just machining bits of wood and making money (IMO) and it just seems to me that once a cue maker goes down this road a bit of his cue making soul is lost forever.
Amen

Thought I try and get some more ppl on board here by posting the original question.

[Gerry Armstrong]

Many of you may know that Robert Osborne is no longer taking orders for custom made cues because he say's that it is too much hassle dealing with snooker players constantly making last minute changes to there spec's, wanting shafts the look a certain way and of course ordering cues and then not paying the balance. Robert is now happy to take bulk orders from china with a standard spec then ship them out with no contact with the end user. Now Robert is trying to make a living just like the rest of us but some how I feel he's lost his way. Making cues is more than just machining bits of wood and making money (IMO) and it just seems to me that once a cue maker goes down this road a bit of his cue making soul is lost forever.
Amen

Yes he's right.

[poolqjunkie]

I dont think Cazmac is saying Robert is a bad cue maker. I get the feeling he is feeling a bit like "why?" as in "he is such a good maker...why did he do that?" kind of way. So, essentially he is saying Robert is a great cue maker which is why he does not want to see him going down this route...(hope I am right, but I have been wrong before so whatever..:-))
I am not sure what Will Hunt and Robert Osborne are doing but I have seen their cues and they are very well crafted cues with great playability.
The market place is changing and when cues are mostly going to China he may just feel that he needs to make some changes. Who knows, may be he was offered the chance of an exclusive with one or a few Chinese dealers and the deal was too good to say no to...
He may not even have to sell at a lower price if they are jacking up the price by so much in China.
My guess is perhaps the dealer(s) in China want his cue to be a very exclusive thing that no one could buy but through the dealer(s). If Robert starts selling to the public in the UK or wherever then it would not really serve the purpose of an exclusive.
And...if the Chinese have ordered tones of cues and have already maxed out his full capability he simply wont be able to make any more cues for anyone else anyway.
I suspect it might not be a decision he makes solely on his own...may be he was offered such an option which was too good to say no to...
I dont know...just my guess...:-)

[cazmac1]

I dont think Cazmac is saying Robert is a bad cue maker. I get the feeling he is feeling a bit like "why?" as in "he is such a good maker...why did he do that?" kind of way. So, essentially he is saying Robert is a great cue maker which is why he does not want to see him going down this route...(hope I am right, but I have been wrong before so whatever..:-))
I am not sure what Will Hunt and Robert Osborne are doing but I have seen their cues and they are very well crafted cues with great playability.
The market place is changing and when cues are mostly going to China he may just feel that he needs to make some changes. Who knows, may be he was offered the chance of an exclusive with one or a few Chinese dealers and the deal was too good to say no to...
He may not even have to sell at a lower price if they are jacking up the price by so much in China.
My guess is perhaps the dealer(s) in China want his cue to be a very exclusive thing that no one could buy but through the dealer(s). If Robert starts selling to the public in the UK or wherever then it would not really serve the purpose of an exclusive.
And...if the Chinese have ordered tones of cues and have already maxed out his full capability he simply wont be able to make any more cues for anyone else anyway.
I suspect it might not be a decision he makes solely on his own...may be he was offered such an option which was too good to say no to...
I dont know...just my guess...:-)

Thank you for jumping in here pooljunkie, your spot on with your assessment and I would imagine your also right about the exclusivity and pricing. someone just put up a post and then removed it. It said that RO cue's are selling through this dealer for as much as £3100?

[arbitrage]

Thought I try and get some more ppl on board here by posting the original question.

robert osborne like will hunt is a shrewd businessman and they have hit upon the optimum business model. why waste time on the indentured 99% in the west? there is a massive market in asia (particularly china) where customers will pay through the nose for their stock cues and they can deal with a few agents instead of a mass of nitpicking retail customers. due to the premium paid for their cues in asian markets, even after the trade cut, their margins won't be affected by much, particularly if you take into account the time wastage involved in dealing with individual customers.

[cazmac1]

It's a fair point. But my point is being a cue maker is about more then money. Yes when ordering a cue we can all be a pain in the ass but is this not what part of being a cue maker is about. Every cue slightly different made Especially for the individual and who knows a potential world champion. Someone could win the WC with RO cue and he wouldn't even know unless he spotted his badge on the cue during the final or sadly at the prices there selling for I doubt very much you'll see a world champion with an exported RO cue.

[Gerry Armstrong]

Yes when ordering a cue we can all be a pain in the ass but is this not what part of being a cue maker is about.

Not for Robert.

[arbitrage]

It's a fair point. But my point is being a cue maker is about more then money. Yes when ordering a cue we can all be a pain in the ass but is this not what part of being a cue maker is about. Every cue slightly different made Especially for the individual and who knows a potential world champion. Someone could win the WC with RO cue and he wouldn't even know unless he spotted his badge on the cue during the final or sadly at the prices there selling for I doubt very much you'll see a world champion with an exported RO cue.

Think about it this way - maybe prices for custom cues are too low at the moment for it to be justifiable for cue makers to be focusing on these orders. If you want a "work of art", you should be prepared to pay for it, no? Not speaking on behalf of Robert Osborne, but I would be surprised if he didn't take a custom order from you if you offered him a significant amount of money - let's say 3k or 5k?

[Gerry Armstrong]

And I'm sure if Ronnie, John, or Stephen for example wanted a cue he would make them one too. Wasn't Ronnie playing with an Ozzy for a while not too long ago?

[cazmac1]

And I'm sure if Ronnie, John, or Stephen for example wanted a cue he would make them one too. Wasn't Ronnie playing with an Ozzy for a while not too long ago?

God you just have to have the last word OK Gerry your right I'm wrong

[mattyshinobi22]

well taking steve davis and stephen hendry into consideration, Not having a custom cue didnt do them any harm!

To be a cue maker i know of no requirement that they have to be on beck and call from a customer, also have to agree with mike wooldridge that he prohibits people visiting his workshop.
and to be far if people want to keep ringing cue makers up after ordering a cue then, dont think they should be ordering one at all. prob wasting their money.

if robert osborne is just making cues for trade, well fair play to him his choice.

in the old days of burroughes and watts cues were just made and people played with them, not all this today where shaft doesnt look right.......or its doesnt feel right etc. send back to be altered or buy another.

being a cue maker isnt a special calling like a doctor or a priest. but a business like any other

maybe there will be a world champion with a will hunt or osborne cue, who knows, but for sure champions are less picky about cues, and more concerned with potting balls

[jrc750]

Well hopefully as they will become very scarce on the 2nd hand market, the value of my recently bought early Osborne cue will go up

[cazmac1]

I agree with 90% of your post with the exception of the last two lines. Most if not all recent world champions have had alterations made to there cue's or changed them altogether. These include JH, RO, SD, and SH after his original cue got smashed, I think he had five cues made by JP.