Shifting the balance point

[cazmac1]

I'm curious to know if anyone knows the relationship of the cue balance point and weight.
What I mean is if I wanted to shift the balance point forward by an inch how much weight would have to be removed from from the but end, for example if you removed say 0.5 of an oz from the very back of a cue how much would the balance point move forward.

Also can someone tell me what are heaviest and lightest butt materials
IE: starting with the heaviest to the lightest

Ebony ?
?
?

[Gerry Armstrong]

As most cues have artificial weight added after manufacture you can usually move the balance backwards or forwards at the same time as adding or reducing weight.

And as the cue is drilled out and the weight placed deep inside (as deep as required) it is also possible to alter the balance point by simply moving the weights so in many cases the overall weight of the cue would remain the same while the balance point is moved as desired.

[cazmac1]

I did ask for my current cue to be made with no weight added and am waiting for conformation of this. If I do decide to move the balance point I would farther do this with four lower splices of a light butt material, what is a good light wood that I could use for this.

[cazmac1]

PS
does any one have a video link to weight being added to a cue when it is being made. I seen plenty of vids of cue's being made but never seen any showing a weight added.

[trevs1]

As most cues have artificial weight added after manufacture you can usually move the balance backwards or forwards at the same time as adding or reducing weight.

And as the cue is drilled out and the weight placed deep inside (as deep as required) it is also possible to alter the balance point by simply moving the weights so in many cases the overall weight of the cue would remain the same while the balance point is moved as desired.

It really isn't as simple as that Gerry. If only it was.

[trevs1]

I did ask for my current cue to be made with no weight added and am waiting for conformation of this. If I do decide to move the balance point I would farther do this with four lower splices of a light butt material, what is a good light wood that I could use for this.

Peter, what is the weight of your cue as it is.?

Oh, and also..... is it a one piece or jointed at all.?.... And.... can you describe the design and specs of it.?

[DWOT]

Oh Peter, you little tinkerer you!

[cazmac1]

Peter, what is the weight of your cue as it is.?

Oh, and also..... is it a one piece or jointed at all.?.... And.... can you describe the design and specs of it.?

Hi trev Merry Xmas it's nice to hear from you.
The cue is a one piece with a balance point of 17. The problem I have is that when I shorten the cue I feel the cue is a bit butt heavy. I play with my bridge arm quite bent which means that when I shorten the cue there is a lot of cue over hanging the back of my cue hand and I feel it's costing me a few shots. I tried straightening my bridge arm but this throws out my alinement.
I am think of moving the balance point up to 18.5 or 19

[trevs1]

Hi Peter,

You are certainly not going to be able to realistically move the balance "that" far forward, without some major alteration to the cue.
Any cue within a "more or less" standard spec is perhaps going to have a balance point of between 16" to 18" (dependng on cue design, and some other factors obviously) A cue with a balance of over 18" from the butt end is getting pretty forward weighted, with 19" very forward weighted. Whether your cue is what people refer to as "naturally weighted" I couldn't say, but, if it's anything over 17oz's, it's unlikely, because most one piece cues will not get anywhere near that weight with just the material parts alone....i.e.... the timber used to make it, along with ferrule, tip, badges and base joint to accommodate extensions. There is NO ADVANTAGE either to cues which have no added weight to those which have. None whatsoever, fact.

In pure technical terms, there's no reason why a cue should cost a player shots simply because "that" shot dictates you need to move your grip hand further forwards. I say that because "most" shots where you would do this are usually not shots over any great distance, and as such, require less backswing / power. It's usually the case that player are more likely to miss shots over distance, or, when perhaps striking off centre white to create the cueball control they're looking for. Simple bread and butter stun/screw/run-through's over short to mid distance are far less demanding, and as a consequence, are likely to be due to poor concentration / effort / or application of good routines. Clearly, if you are cueing off the rail, then moving your grip hand forward is to be expected, and this is where players can find they feel the front of a shaft has a bit of a light feel to it, especially if the cue has a bit of a backward balance to the weight (less than 16" from the butt end in most cues).

Without banging on any more than I already have, and for fear of bringing everyone to tears. The bottom line is that with ANY cue, if a player can perform to a good average or better (for their own standard of play that is) with a particular cue, then there's no reason that cannot be repeated on any other day. The one element that changes most of all for any player is the player themselves. Cues are inanimate objects, and do not really change (different tips excluded), and so are not going to be THE SOLE cause of a good performace one day and a bad one the next. The very best way for a player who has performed well with a particular cue, to achieve any further progress, is to first look inwards at themselves, and not look at external aspects, which are in all probability not THE major cause for concern.

I think altering your cue might give you a temporary feeling of comfort with the cue (maybe not also), but, whether it actually improves the way "that" cue performs is another matter. The problem is, that once the alterations start, players don't tend to feel quite the same about cues afterwards, and always seem to end up wondering what if this, or what if that. That often leads them into the wilderness, and doesn't help at all long term.

Stick at it as it is would be my view, but that, along with everything else I've said above, is only my view based on the experience I've had over many years, of playing and dealing with people who have gone through these things hundreds of times.

Good luck with it.

[damienlch]

...The problem I have is that when I shorten the cue I feel the cue is a bit butt heavy. I play with my bridge arm quite bent which means that when I shorten the cue there is a lot of cue over hanging the back of my cue hand...

Hi Caz, by shifting the balance point forward, cue might get too front heavy when you play your normal shot. Might be better to try out someone else's cue which is more forward weighted, if possible and see how that feels.

[poolqjunkie]

agreed with everything Trevor said.
Is that your new Mastercraft cue you are talking about? May be you can talk to Dave about it?

[jim evans]

Hi Peter,

You are certainly not going to be able to realistically move the balance "that" far forward, without some major alteration to the cue.
Any cue within a "more or less" standard spec is perhaps going to have a balance point of between 16" to 18" (dependng on cue design, and some other factors obviously) A cue with a balance of over 18" from the butt end is getting pretty forward weighted, with 19" very forward weighted. Whether your cue is what people refer to as "naturally weighted" I couldn't say, but, if it's anything over 17oz's, it's unlikely, because most one piece cues will not get anywhere near that weight with just the material parts alone....i.e.... the timber used to make it, along with ferrule, tip, badges and base joint to accommodate extensions. There is NO ADVANTAGE either to cues which have no added weight to those which have. None whatsoever, fact.

In pure technical terms, there's no reason why a cue should cost a player shots simply because "that" shot dictates you need to move your grip hand further forwards. I say that because "most" shots where you would do this are usually not shots over any great distance, and as such, require less backswing / power. It's usually the case that player are more likely to miss shots over distance, or, when perhaps striking off centre white to create the cueball control they're looking for. Simple bread and butter stun/screw/run-through's over short to mid distance are far less demanding, and as a consequence, are likely to be due to poor concentration / effort / or application of good routines. Clearly, if you are cueing off the rail, then moving your grip hand forward is to be expected, and this is where players can find they feel the front of a shaft has a bit of a light feel to it, especially if the cue has a bit of a backward balance to the weight (less than 16" from the butt end in most cues).

Without banging on any more than I already have, and for fear of bringing everyone to tears. The bottom line is that with ANY cue, if a player can perform to a good average or better (for their own standard of play that is) with a particular cue, then there's no reason that cannot be repeated on any other day. The one element that changes most of all for any player is the player themselves. Cues are inanimate objects, and do not really change (different tips excluded), and so are not going to be THE SOLE cause of a good performace one day and a bad one the next. The very best way for a player who has performed well with a particular cue, to achieve any further progress, is to first look inwards at themselves, and not look at external aspects, which are in all probability not THE major cause for concern.

I think altering your cue might give you a temporary feeling of comfort with the cue (maybe not also), but, whether it actually improves the way "that" cue performs is another matter. The problem is, that once the alterations start, players don't tend to feel quite the same about cues afterwards, and always seem to end up wondering what if this, or what if that. That often leads them into the wilderness, and doesn't help at all long term.

Stick at it as it is would be my view, but that, along with everything else I've said above, is only my view based on the experience I've had over many years, of playing and dealing with people who have gone through these things hundreds of times.

Good luck with it.

hi all this is along the lines of 1 of my very first posts but mine wernt as explanetry remember peter lol long time ago now

[the nugget]

Hi Peter,

You are certainly not going to be able to realistically move the balance "that" far forward, without some major alteration to the cue.
Any cue within a "more or less" standard spec is perhaps going to have a balance point of between 16" to 18" (dependng on cue design, and some other factors obviously) A cue with a balance of over 18" from the butt end is getting pretty forward weighted, with 19" very forward weighted. Whether your cue is what people refer to as "naturally weighted" I couldn't say, but, if it's anything over 17oz's, it's unlikely, because most one piece cues will not get anywhere near that weight with just the material parts alone....i.e.... the timber used to make it, along with ferrule, tip, badges and base joint to accommodate extensions. There is NO ADVANTAGE either to cues which have no added weight to those which have. None whatsoever, fact.

In pure technical terms, there's no reason why a cue should cost a player shots simply because "that" shot dictates you need to move your grip hand further forwards. I say that because "most" shots where you would do this are usually not shots over any great distance, and as such, require less backswing / power. It's usually the case that player are more likely to miss shots over distance, or, when perhaps striking off centre white to create the cueball control they're looking for. Simple bread and butter stun/screw/run-through's over short to mid distance are far less demanding, and as a consequence, are likely to be due to poor concentration / effort / or application of good routines. Clearly, if you are cueing off the rail, then moving your grip hand forward is to be expected, and this is where players can find they feel the front of a shaft has a bit of a light feel to it, especially if the cue has a bit of a backward balance to the weight (less than 16" from the butt end in most cues).

Without banging on any more than I already have, and for fear of bringing everyone to tears. The bottom line is that with ANY cue, if a player can perform to a good average or better (for their own standard of play that is) with a particular cue, then there's no reason that cannot be repeated on any other day. The one element that changes most of all for any player is the player themselves. Cues are inanimate objects, and do not really change (different tips excluded), and so are not going to be THE SOLE cause of a good performace one day and a bad one the next. The very best way for a player who has performed well with a particular cue, to achieve any further progress, is to first look inwards at themselves, and not look at external aspects, which are in all probability not THE major cause for concern.

I think altering your cue might give you a temporary feeling of comfort with the cue (maybe not also), but, whether it actually improves the way "that" cue performs is another matter. The problem is, that once the alterations start, players don't tend to feel quite the same about cues afterwards, and always seem to end up wondering what if this, or what if that. That often leads them into the wilderness, and doesn't help at all long term.

Stick at it as it is would be my view, but that, along with everything else I've said above, is only my view based on the experience I've had over many years, of playing and dealing with people who have gone through these things hundreds of times.

Good luck with it.

Hi Trev dont think youre boring too many of us with this, as far as im concerned any info like this is priceless from the people who know best ,Merry Christmas to you anyways!

[Neil Taperell]

Very interesting and informative replies .

If a joint on a 3/4 cue is above the top splice , would this affect the balance point ?

[jrc750]

Very interesting and informative replies .

If a joint on a 3/4 cue is above the top splice , would this affect the balance point ?

I would say definitely The joint can weigh up to an ounce, so if its positioned above splice ala Mark Williams its got to shift balance point further forward