R.i.p

[mrbluejay]

I've never bought a Thai cue, done fook all to it apart from add a badge and then sold it more than 3 times the price

From what I hear that isn't strictly true, they are annointed with Whisky and bagpipes are played whilst they are lowered into their uPVC sporrans for shipping x 170 lol

[renzie67]

From what I hear that isn't strictly true, they are annointed with Whisky and bagpipes are played whilst they are lowered into their uPVC sporrans for shipping x 170 lol

Put your sheep to bed now mate .

[mrbluejay]

Put your sheep to bed now mate .

Haha, she is very good looking granted !

[renzie67]

Haha, she is very good looking granted !

More like HE is very good looking.

[mrbluejay]

More like HE is very good looking.

Now, now, don't get touchy because your mate is saying nowt.

[rob s]

No one knows what goes on behind closed doors , apart from the makers
themselves and their confidants.

But with the people I named its not closed doors, you can go to see their workshop and see work in progress at different stages. To a certain degree though you are right mate but that list I posted even said "all these cuemakers STATE they make all their cues in the UK from scratch". I didn't say they do, I said they state, where as other cuemakers avoid the issue on their website and won't answer the question when asked directly. To be honest I think that list is pretty solid and I'm sure the guys in the know will agree

[renzie67]

But with the people I named its not closed doors, you can go to see their workshop and see work in progress at different stages. To a certain degree though you are right mate but that list I posted even said "all these cuemakers STATE they make all their cues in the UK from scratch". I didn't say they do, I said they state, where as other cuemakers avoid the issue on their website and won't answer the question when asked directly. To be honest I think that list is pretty solid and I'm sure the guys in the know will agree

I tend to disagree that you could turn up at their work shop unannounced would be real
interesting if you could.

[arbitrage]

Lol, I'm not bothering with this anymore. Enjoy your tunnel vision chaps.

http://www.jasonowencues.com/questions-and-answers.html

you have an unlikely ally in me with regards to this subject

"handmade" is a subjective term therefore unless there is 0 handiwork involved, it's not dishonest to source shafts from elsewhere (which are mostly hand planed anyway - and thai hands constitute "hand made" too), do the finishing work on it and stamp "handmade" on it. it does not say on any of the cues "100% hand made by mr. xXXx in england", therefore the cuemakers in question are entirely honest and above board

so many ignorant people with 19th century mindsets and cheapskate primadonnas who want pay 400 quid or thereabouts for someone to dedicate 2 years of time to whittling down a block of wood for them. good luck with that - grow up - it's the 21st century

p.s. do they have to grow their own trees too to be considered "handmade" haha

[laverda]

I'm sorry to say that you have missed the point entirely. The issue is finished cues being purchased and REBADGED as handmade by the 'supposed' cue maker selling the cue to joe public as being the handiwork of that same 'supposed' cue maker.

It is not unfinished shafts that are the issue, its the finished Thai cues that get little more than a rub down before being sold as the sellers handiwork... and for that I would not pay an extra couple of hundred dollars for...
Mick

[Samcheung001]

you have an unlikely ally in me with regards to this subject

"handmade" is a subjective term therefore unless there is 0 handiwork involved, it's not dishonest to source shafts from elsewhere (which are mostly hand planed anyway - and thai hands constitute "hand made" too), do the finishing work on it and stamp "handmade" on it. it does not say on any of the cues "100% hand made by mr. xXXx in england", therefore the cuemakers in question are entirely honest and above board

so many ignorant people with 19th century mindsets and cheapskate primadonnas who want pay 400 quid or thereabouts for someone to dedicate 2 years of time to whittling down a block of wood for them. good luck with that - grow up - it's the 21st century

p.s. do they have to grow their own trees too to be considered "handmade" haha

What you said is just like saying you go to the supermarket and see some apples labelled "California apple" but finally you find out the apples were planted in Asia but shipped by a trading company located in California.

It's the 'general' expectation and perception of the word 'handmade' now people are talking about. I don't think it's a 19th century mindset unless it's now 18xx I think.

[arbitrage]

I'm sorry to say that you have missed the point entirely. The issue is finished cues being purchased and REBADGED as handmade by the 'supposed' cue maker selling the cue to joe public as being the handiwork of that same 'supposed' cue maker.

It is not unfinished shafts that are the issue, its the finished Thai cues that get little more than a rub down before being sold as the sellers handiwork... and for that I would not pay an extra couple of hundred dollars for...
Mick

firstly, you have no idea how much of the cue was done in thailand and how much of it was done by the cuemaker in england e.g. splice work etc. until you know exactly, you are just guessing and of course don't have much of a point

in any case, unless there is a legal infringement e.g. false marketing then you still don't have much of a point even if most of the cue is made elsewhere as it's within the law for them to market this way. try taking your argument to a court and see how far you get. otherwise, your opinion of whether the cue is worth "an extra couple of hundred dollars" is entirely subjective. i can tell you that there are people in china who would shell out "an extra couple of hundred or even thousands of dollars" premium just to move up the queue at JP, not even inclusive of the purchase

[arbitrage]

What you said is just like saying you go to the supermarket and see some apples labelled "California apple" but finally you find out the apples were planted in Asia but shipped by a trading company located in California.

It's the 'general' expectation and perception of the word 'handmade' now people are talking about. I don't think it's a 19th century mindset unless it's now 18xx I think.

given that you are from hong kong, you should have seen labels in china which say "styled in france" etc. these are marketing gimmicks and if you are stupid enough to believe that "styled in france" is "made 100% in france" then you deserve to overpay. in any case, all food labeling in hong kong indicates not only origin but nutritional facts by LAW so that consumers have the necessary information to judge - so your example is not very applicable

[laverda]

firstly, you have no idea how much of the cue was done in thailand and how much of it was done by the cuemaker in england e.g. splice work etc. until you know exactly, you are just guessing and of course don't have much of a point at all

Actually, I know exactly how much of my cue was done in Thailand and how much was done in the UK as I have already discussed this with the maker... I was expecting 100% UK but that is not what I got... to his credit he explained the reasons for his choice AND I admitted my naivety in not ascertaining the exact source of the shaft and we are all good so I suggest to you that I do indeed have a point after all...

But please feel free to maintain your opinion,
Mick

[DeanH]

firstly, you have no idea how much of the cue was done in thailand and how much of it was done by the cuemaker in england e.g. splice work etc. until you know exactly, you are just guessing and of course don't have much of a point

in any case, unless there is a legal infringement e.g. false marketing then you still don't have much of a point even if most of the cue is made elsewhere as it's within the law for them to market this way. try taking your argument to a court and see how far you get. otherwise, your opinion of whether the cue is worth "an extra couple of hundred dollars" is entirely subjective. i can tell you that there are people in china who would shell out "an extra couple of hundred or even thousands of dollars" premium just to move up the queue at JP, not even inclusive of the purchase

I think many on TSF do know how much of the cue was done in Thailand, as (repeated from many other posts) the whole point of the CJs first thread and this thread, is that completed cues - shafts with butt splices, i.e. cues that can be used by a player; are being imported, possibly front-spliced, and rebadged as being handmade in UK.
sorry for repeating this again

[laverda]

in any case, unless there is a legal infringement e.g. false marketing then you still don't have much of a point even if most of the cue is made elsewhere as it's within the law for them to market this way. try taking your argument to a court and see how far you get. otherwise, your opinion of whether the cue is worth "an extra couple of hundred dollars" is entirely subjective. i can tell you that there are people in china who would shell out "an extra couple of hundred or even thousands of dollars" premium just to move up the queue at JP, not even inclusive of the purchase

given that you are from hong kong, you should have seen labels in china which say "styled in france" etc. these are marketing gimmicks and if you are stupid enough to believe that "styled in france" is "made 100% in france" then you deserve to overpay. in any case, all food labeling in hong kong indicates not only origin but nutritional facts by LAW so that consumers have the necessary information to judge - so your example is not very applicable

Lets be clear, the LAW in Australia is different to the LAW in Hong Kong which is different to the LAW in the UK and if you think we should all just role over and accept that these practices are OK because they work in whatever unregulated market you propose is the benchmark then I'm sorry but you are mistaken
Mick