Bling - are Vaneers a Bad Idea?

[Master Blaster]

Splices of ebony and other very hardwoods are added to cues to stop them from cracking and denting during use. A plain ash or maple cue wouldn't survive much rough treatment and they'd wear faster in the hand as well. Ebony is a very hard and strong hardwood, and it looks a nice contrast against the shaftwood, hence it's use. It was also plentiful back in the day and not nearly as expensive as now.

So, the reduced feedback in the hand (given the splices are foreign to the shaft and merely glued on) is offset by the usefulness of the splice. Fine. What we have now is the classic Steve Davis cue. And given how well he played with one is anymore needed?

I love 2v's JPU design but are vaneers a good idea?

http://s827.photobucket.com/user/2v1...qhbhf.png.html

They're a nice bit of bling and that is a stunning design and a quick way to impress your friends but what about playability? We often doubt the worth of glue layers in laminated tips (well most pros do) so why would lots of bits of wood vaneers being glued onto the splices be a good idea? Surely it results in less feedback again? Do more splices and more vaneers mean less shaft wood making it to the end and less feedback? Does the best cue simply have no vaneers at all. Ronnie has just the one on his JP.

[DeanH]

I am not sure whether having butt splices (ebony/rosewood/etc) are detrimental to playability of a cue . If they did then I am sure many years ago the makers would have stopped making cues with them.
Same with veneers, if they are detrimental to playability, they would have stopped doing it in the past, would they not have?
A friend has an ALL ash cue (Cannon, 1980s probably) which is very nice, with light grain colouring, it is also in pretty good condition and (to me) hits very well. But the shaft is more stiff than my cue, I think the stiffness of the shaft has a definite affect and factor to the playability than "the bling"

[sanman]

Just for your info ebony has a tendency to crack more easily than ash or maple>>>>

Splices of ebony and other very hardwoods are added to cues to stop them from cracking and denting during use. A plain ash or maple cue wouldn't survive much rough treatment and they'd wear faster in the hand as well. Ebony is a very hard and strong hardwood, and it looks a nice contrast against the shaftwood, hence it's use. It was also plentiful back in the day and not nearly as expensive as now.

So, the reduced feedback in the hand (given the splices are foreign to the shaft and merely glued on) is offset by the usefulness of the splice. Fine. What we have now is the classic Steve Davis cue. And given how well he played with one is anymore needed?

I love 2v's JPU design but are vaneers a good idea?

http://s827.photobucket.com/user/2v1...qhbhf.png.html

They're a nice bit of bling and that is a stunning design and a quick way to impress your friends but what about playability? We often doubt the worth of glue layers in laminated tips (well most pros do) so why would lots of bits of wood vaneers being glued onto the splices be a good idea? Surely it results in less feedback again? Do more splices and more vaneers mean less shaft wood making it to the end and less feedback? Does the best cue simply have no vaneers at all. Ronnie has just the one on his JP.

[trevs1]

Splices of ebony and other very hardwoods are added to cues to stop them from cracking and denting during use. A plain ash or maple cue wouldn't survive much rough treatment and they'd wear faster in the hand as well. Ebony is a very hard and strong hardwood, and it looks a nice contrast against the shaftwood, hence it's use. It was also plentiful back in the day and not nearly as expensive as now.

So, the reduced feedback in the hand (given the splices are foreign to the shaft and merely glued on) is offset by the usefulness of the splice. Fine. What we have now is the classic Steve Davis cue. And given how well he played with one is anymore needed?

I love 2v's JPU design but are vaneers a good idea?

http://s827.photobucket.com/user/2v1...qhbhf.png.html

They're a nice bit of bling and that is a stunning design and a quick way to impress your friends but what about playability? We often doubt the worth of glue layers in laminated tips (well most pros do) so why would lots of bits of wood vaneers being glued onto the splices be a good idea? Surely it results in less feedback again? Do more splices and more vaneers mean less shaft wood making it to the end and less feedback? Does the best cue simply have no vaneers at all. Ronnie has just the one on his JP.

Yep, I totally agree. A cue with no decorative butt timbers at all would be best

Better still, players looking to improve their game could get themselves a palm sized piece of wood (same timber as the shaft of course) surgically grafted onto the grip hand. That way, they could ensure a true wood to wood bond and maximise the feedback through the cue.

Sorted.

[sanman]

Oh Trevor. It must be airdried or else it would feel like glass or carbon.

Yep, I totally agree. A cue with no decorative butt timbers at all would be best

Better still, players looking to improve their game could get themselves a palm sized piece of wood (same timber as the shaft of course) surgically grafted onto the grip hand. That way, they could ensure a true wood to wood bond and maximise the feedback through the cue.

Sorted.

[trevs1]

Oh Trevor. It must be airdried or else it would feel like glass or carbon.

Yep, I'm starting to think maybe I am getting it wrong by using timber kilned to 6% - 7% moisture for shafts.

I am considering placing all my shaft timber in a bath of water for a month, so as to re-hydrate them fully. That way I will be able to air dry them over the following three to five years, which, I am led to believe, makes them play so much better.

I might write to a few newspaper agony aunt's to glean some opinions on whether this is a wise move or not.

Just can't decide at present.

[Master Blaster]

Yep, I'm starting to think maybe I am getting it wrong by using timber kilned to 6% - 7% moisture for shafts.

I am considering placing all my shaft timber in a bath of water for a month, so as to re-hydrate them fully. That way I will be able to air dry them over the following three to five years, which, I am led to believe, makes them play so much better.

I might write to a few newspaper agony aunt's to glean some opinions on whether this is a wise move or not.

Just can't decide at present.

No point, the wood is already dead having been dried to 7%. Did you know that Powerglide used to air dry their timber for 12-24 years? It's true, in the good old days. Then again, demand was less then and ash was plentiful. Now, the trees come down and the timber is in a cue in 3mths. A lot of cabinet makers also swear by air dried timber as well because it's not as brittle or glassy and it doesn't chip under a plane.

You may be interested in this, as I know you're a bright spark and will understand it:
http://www.stonesriverhardwoods.com/air-dried-wood

ps - The greatest and most revered furniture and woodwork in general was made hundreds of years ago with no kilns in sight. It's still around today, uncracked and solid. This stuff is of far greater craft than mere cues with glued on splices/vaneers, rolled on a lathe and yet, it was all air dried. IKEA on the other hand...............

[ADR147]

somebody got a good discount on crack pipes.

[ADW147CUEMAN]

somebody got a good discount on crack pipes.

mines just split Andrew , and i threw my ladders in the pond nice heavy and solid again for a few weeks lol :snooker::biggrin-new:

[bolton-cueman]

drivel from the mouthpiece

[ADR147]

drivel from the mouthpiece

the mouthpiece not a mouthpiece says a lot!

[DandyA]

the mouthpiece not a mouthpiece says a lot!

I've tried putting the above into Google Translate using "Scottish to English" and then selecting the option "half a bottle of single malt or more" but Google can't work it out ... what the hell do you mean LOL!

[ADR147]

I've tried putting the above into Google Translate using "Scottish to English" and then selecting the option "half a bottle of single malt or more" but Google can't work it out ... what the hell do you mean LOL!

lost a mate today to cancer that might be effecting my typing he is the highest of many.

[golferson123]

So when rex williams set up poweglide they had to wait 20 years before they made a cue

[trevs1]

No point, the wood is already dead having been dried to 7%. Did you know that Powerglide used to air dry their timber for 12-24 years? It's true, in the good old days. Then again, demand was less then and ash was plentiful. Now, the trees come down and the timber is in a cue in 3mths. A lot of cabinet makers also swear by air dried timber as well because it's not as brittle or glassy and it doesn't chip under a plane.

You may be interested in this, as I know you're a bright spark and will understand it:
http://www.stonesriverhardwoods.com/air-dried-wood

ps - The greatest and most revered furniture and woodwork in general was made hundreds of years ago with no kilns in sight. It's still around today, uncracked and solid. This stuff is of far greater craft than mere cues with glued on splices/vaneers, rolled on a lathe and yet, it was all air dried. IKEA on the other hand...............

Thanks for the lesson on timber, simply inspirational.

I'd rather not get into discussing this subject, because it's pretty pointless and fairly boring. However, suffice to say that if a dozen cues were put in front of various players, six made from KD timber and six from AD timber, you'd not be able to tell the difference. That's not just a spurious claim either, it's a fact. There are way too many variables involved to be able to make such a judgement based on drying process alone.

Really, this is true, whether you wish to take it in or not.