JP Unique cue

[trevs1]

I'd wager that a whole host of players, from rank novice's to top level professionals wouldn't have a clue if a weight fitted to a cue butt was part bonded in with bloody marmalade.

There is so much assumption made as to what people can "definitely" feel that it's laughable.

The variation in performance of different cues is so enormous, that it's just not realistic for anyone to claim they can
attribute those variations to construction "methods" or "materials" alone. Anyone making such claims is not really worth taking too seriously at all. Whether cues are made from ash, maple, jointed, one piece, air dried timber, kiln dried timber or whatever, they can be poor, average or simply outstanding.

It's just not that a precise a science, and, if ANYONE tells you differently, you need to be highly sceptical.

[Andy Travis]

If its a dowelled or full length shaft don't forget that when the cue is spliced it needs drilling for the weight to be added resulting in nearly all the dowel removed, also if its a full shaft, when the weight is added there will be a dowel to fill the hole

[Byrom]

This is a moot point for me and you buddy! I do believe a single piece of ash offers more feel than a split shaft 1 piece. But that could be down to the Thai cues (I've tried) being made out of kiln not air angel as well. Maybe if I found a split shaft air angel I could verify your point. lol Or maybe a Ton Praram cue, maybe they use a full length 60" square. Perhaps Jack can tell us.

I have previously said I prefer the one piece cues that I have owned as these have had a better feel to them but this was just because they where better cues rather than being anything else - I just generally preferred them to the 3 quarter ones I have owned - although I have had one or two good 3/4 ones too but someone once said to me and they are probably right I think that if you blindfolded me and handed me a few cues to take a shot with I doubt if I could tell the difference and I doubt you would either - its just maybe the placebo effect telling you there is a difference I think.

[Master Blaster]

I'd wager that a whole host of players, from rank novice's to top level professionals wouldn't have a clue if a weight fitted to a cue butt was part bonded in with bloody marmalade.

There is so much assumption made as to what people can "definitely" feel that it's laughable.

The variation in performance of different cues is so enormous, that it's just not realistic for anyone to claim they can
attribute those variations to construction "methods" or "materials" alone. Anyone making such claims is not really worth taking too seriously at all. Whether cues are made from ash, maple, jointed, one piece, air dried timber, kiln dried timber or whatever, they can be poor, average or simply outstanding.

It's just not that a precise a science, and, if ANYONE tells you differently, you need to be highly sceptical.

We may as well all buy some cheap Thai split shaft cues then. Let's say we buy ten for the price of a custom, at least one is gonna be as good as the custom because cue making isn't science. We can then sell the other 9 and have a cue as good as anything for £600 for a fraction. Or maybe just go to Stu and try his split shaft cues cuz the good un in the group will be as good as a bespoke custom because cue making isn't a science. Luckily, Parris disagrees and devotes a great deal of time in getting the right board for the right feel.

[golferson123]

JP Unique cue

nobody said cue makers are not using the best timbers they can source its about how they make them,if you had a nice plank at 100 inches why not make two out of each length. instead of one,just because someone who does not make or understand cue making says they should!

[EZ_4_U_OK]

We may as well all buy some cheap Thai split shaft cues then. Let's say we buy ten for the price of a custom, at least one is gonna be as good as the custom because cue making isn't science. We can then sell the other 9 and have a cue as good as anything for £600 for a fraction. Or maybe just go to Stu and try his split shaft cues cuz the good un in the group will be as good as a bespoke custom because cue making isn't a science. Luckily, Parris disagrees and devotes a great deal of time in getting the right board for the right feel.

MB you need to follow the message in your own avatar and row back a bit mate !

Trevor and Andy have both made some very valid points. Cue making isn't a precise science, as there are so many variables in both the materials used and construction methods. It's quite possible to sand down a broom stick and knock in some big breaks, yet how long before the broom stick starts to warp because the grain is wavy or because it doesn't have an adequate finish/protection barrier against drying out and the cue ends up as tat?!

The truth is there are some materials and construction methods that are better than others, and do help to promote the "feel" of the cue. In the old days when they made lots of billiard cues it was all about "feel" of the cue, as they had to play both long power shots using some very heavy balls, and the most delicate of finely weighted cannon shots.
Although it didn't always guarantee success, they mainly achieved this through making the cue in one long piece to the end of the butt and cutting the square quite large, meaning the butt splices were stuck on to the cue more like thin veneers. This allowed the natural spring and vibration to travel further down the shaft towards the butt end, and give a better more accurate feedback response or "feel" in the grip when striking the cue ball.
This in part is why some of the older cues still to this day have a better balanced feel to them, than a lot of the so called modern cues.

Andy is also correct, in that because the butts splices are cut at a steeper angle these days, which results in the end square being smaller, drilling up into the cue for weight placement etc, will often result in that central shaft core being removed. So, effectively you have a cue with a butt stuck half on the shaft and half off.

Generally, unless you use a 1 piece cue made in the traditional methods and correctly balanced and weighted to around 16oz, you will have no sense or clue what a cue really "feels" like at all. Chances are you just know what it feels like with 5-6 ounces of lead stuck up the chuff !

Having said that, I once played with the most ridiculously balanced cheap Chinese 3/4 cue that weighed 19.5oz and had horrible thick varnish on the shaft and after 30 mins was having 90 breaks with it, so sometimes it's about how the good the player is in adapting to a cue/conditions, and not how good the cue is set up.

From my knowledge of cue making thou cues usually fall into 2 categories - they either work with you or against you. The trick is understanding which and why, and if it's the latter, it's sometimes still possible with a few slight changes to rework a cue and make it play wonderful !



EZ

[piper74]

nobody said cue makers are not using the best timbers they can source its about how they make them,if you had a nice plank at 100 inches why not make two out of each length. instead of one,just because someone who does not make or understand cue making says they should!

Ah! This is a very good point, never really thought about it in this way.

Thanks for sharing your experiences on the old Burwatts and the Sidney Smith cues.

If it doesn't affect the feel of the cue (regardless of true shaft or not), I guess most people (including me) should be ok with it.

Back to potting balls then.....Cheers.

[EZ_4_U_OK]

Oh and before I forget, MB please no more talk about this "air angel" crap as it's sending me fruity loops

Carry on and you will be seeing angels before long !



EZ

[sanman]

Maye all ten thai cues may end up better than your bespoke custom. In Stus case that may well be the point as all 3 GBL cues I had(still own 2) were brilliant hitting cues. Way better than both Parris cues I owned.

We may as well all buy some cheap Thai split shaft cues then. Let's say we buy ten for the price of a custom, at least one is gonna be as good as the custom because cue making isn't science. We can then sell the other 9 and have a cue as good as anything for £600 for a fraction. Or maybe just go to Stu and try his split shaft cues cuz the good un in the group will be as good as a bespoke custom because cue making isn't a science. Luckily, Parris disagrees and devotes a great deal of time in getting the right board for the right feel.

[billabong]

We may as well all buy some cheap Thai split shaft cues then. Let's say we buy ten for the price of a custom, at least one is gonna be as good as the custom because cue making isn't science. We can then sell the other 9 and have a cue as good as anything for £600 for a fraction. Or maybe just go to Stu and try his split shaft cues cuz the good un in the group will be as good as a bespoke custom because cue making isn't a science. Luckily, Parris disagrees and devotes a great deal of time in getting the right board for the right feel.

People don't pay top top dollar for a cue because it's going to be the one. Think about it, without trying , how could they know.

The top guys will give you a top quality finish, and a reduced chance of buying a dead plank.

I buy expensive cues because I want to. It's a reward to myself, for working hard all year.

I definitely think if you were blindfolded, you wouldn't be able to tell a recently completed parris ultimate,

from a selection of other cues of the exact same specs, but varying prices / quality.

You don't know what Parris agrees or disagrees with other top cue makers about, as you weren't privvy to their actual conversations.

You only hear / read the promotional bumph, which , lets face it, is hardly going to be designed to reduce sales now. Is it ?

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[mikeyd100]

It would be an excellent exercise to do like a blind test on varying levels of cues.
Bet it would bring some great results.

[pottr]

I could definitely tell you the difference between all of my cues built to the same spec... Me and my mate did the test.

I knew which cue was which by the feel of the cue in my hand and by the hit...

[piper74]

I have previously said I prefer the one piece cues that I have owned as these have had a better feel to them but this was just because they where better cues rather than being anything else - I just generally preferred them to the 3 quarter ones I have owned - although I have had one or two good 3/4 ones too but someone once said to me and they are probably right I think that if you blindfolded me and handed me a few cues to take a shot with I doubt if I could tell the difference and I doubt you would either - its just maybe the placebo effect telling you there is a difference I think.

I agree with you on this, I doubt that I will be able to tell the difference as well.

I don't have much cue making knowledge, its just that my brain seems to tell me that any one piece wood/shaft is probably stronger that a jointed one because it doesn't have a "weak point".
(i am referring to one pieces cues and not 3/4 or 1/2 cues here)

Maybe cues are the exception?

[Byrom]

People don't pay top top dollar for a cue because it's going to be the one. Think about it, without trying , how could they know.

The top guys will give you a top quality finish, and a reduced chance of buying a dead plank.

I buy expensive cues because I want to. It's a reward to myself, for working hard all year.

I definitely think if you were blindfolded, you wouldn't be able to tell a recently completed parris ultimate,

from a selection of other cues of the exact same specs, but varying prices / quality.

You don't know what Parris agrees or disagrees with other top cue makers about, as you weren't privvy to their actual conversations.

You only hear / read the promotional bumph, which , lets face it, is hardly going to be designed to reduce sales now. Is it ?

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Good on you - why not - I am addicted to buying cues too - expensive or otherwise though - whatever takes my fancy. I enjoy the buzz of waiting for them to turn up and enjoy the buzz of getting it out the case to use for the first time and enjoy getting get used to their playing qualities. Lets face it we all or most of us do if we admit it - or we would not all be on here sounding totally obsessed - talking about them all the time.

My friends who all stick to the same cue do think it nuts but I feel more at home on here explaining it.

[billabong]

It would be an excellent exercise to do like a blind test on varying levels of cues.
Bet it would bring some great results.

It would, it would.


I think one of the things that it would show, is how one man's perfect cue ( for blindfolded feel )

would be different from the next man's perfect cue.

It's been repeated in forum after forum, that each individual will like different cues as their perfect "one".

By the time you factor together, the differences in human physical build,

the differences in what each person thinks will feel good,

and the fact that even the best in the world cannot make two cues feel the exact same

using the same specs of cue,

Why would you expect anything else.

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