Joint thread thread!

[trevs1]

Thank you so much once again, for your precious time, and knowledge.

I now understand what you meant by the depth of the ebony splices being more or less fixed.

This brings me back to my original question, if you dont mind me repeating myself. Why dont cue makers just tap the shaft with a wood female, and insert a 3/8 pin in the butt for a wood to wood contact. If cracking is of concern, perhaps a joint collar can be installed around the joint face? These pin is threaded into the butt end with more or less the same diameter as the pin. The pin can be made of brass, stainless steel, titanium, and even phenolic, for weight, balance and playability consideration. I am not sure if I understand your answer previously, with regard to playability?

Is there any particular reason why the face at the joint has to be covered by brass, making the joint much heavier? From what you have described regarding the diameter of the maple inside the ebony splices, I am just wondering if this would be a more simple way to install a joint, perhpas to achieve a more "one-piece" hit due to more wood contact?

I know the British has been making cues for many years (much longer than the US), and are the best in terms of snooker cue building. I have total respect for the craft that you and others are able to offer. Please forgive my limited knowledge and ignorance on snooker cue building. Thank you so much.

Bongo, I am not aware any jump cue using a metal joint in the US. The breaking cues used by most US pros usually do not use metal joint collar either. Usually, most US pool players believe that metal joint offers a harder hit while a wood to wood joint is a bit quieter if the tapers and such are all the same--but that depends on the particular cue.

I'd say the main reason why the female side of a joint is not simply tapped into the timber is because of the wear it would suffer over a short period of time, especially if the other 'male' side is a metal. Also, although fitting the female side with a brass joint means drilling the butt end and the removal of some timber, it is still going to offer more strength and durability than the timber alone.

Personally, I don't think that there's ever been much in the way of examining why brass has been used over any other material, apart from the fact that it's easily machined and very durable. It was probably a case of "what works well for the job gets used" and no more than that. In fact, it's my view that the material for any joint alone is not in itself going to ensure a certain 'hit' or contact. There are other issues to take into account as to why a cue will feel like this or that, and not purely because a joint is made from brass, wood or any other material.

At the end of the day here, what is a one piece feel???

How would anyone define that???

Myself, a one piece feels slightly more 'woody' than a jointed cue, but having said that, I've used 3/4 or other jointed cues which have felt far more woody than many one piece cues, so where does that leave us?

I am sure there will be a good number of players who read this post, who have used more than a few one piece cues over the years, of which only a few have had this 'woody' ring to them on the contact. If the cue is anything over about 17.5oz's, it's far more likely to begin to feel, and sound, duller and duller on the contact as the weight increases. This is perfectly normal too.

This is just one aspect which affects a cues contact, with timber choice and tips etc playing their own separate part in the equation.

As you have stated at the end of your post above, it all depends on the particular cue.

[poolqjunkie]

Yes, you raised a very good pint. What is a one piece hit? I have asked myself this question, and also, "why is one piece hit necessarily better?"

May be MW can tell us what he thinks.

Is it correct to say that when a metal joint is introduced into a cue, the "hit" of the cue will become a bit more "loud" than without such joint, in your opinion?

Do you think that since the male and female will never have complete contact *with each other, the gaps will cause movements during the vibration of the cue, causing a sound which is usually being interpreted as a different hit?

With the introduction of a wood thread, although there are still gaps between the metal pin and the wood thread, since the collisons is no longer between metal and metal, the hit will become more quiet?

I am just think out loud here, have not done any systemic research to prove this. But I do have some experience with various joints in US pool cues, and I have noticed a very distint difference with different joint in terms of the sound it makes upon contact.

On the note of the wood female, usually in the US, a pin with a very wide spacing between threads is used, such as 10 threads or more per inch, and it is usually quite long. It is also common to insert and glue a piece of phenolic rod into the drilled hole before it is tapped, so the female is actually covered with phenolic, not wood. But bare wood is still very common. I would think with a solid piece of ebony butt section, the wood thread should hold as they have in maple shafts used in US pool cues?

* when you put a conventional joint half way down the female, you can still waggle the pin quite a bit, which shows that the contact surface areas are not very tightly touching each other.

[stan-mullin]

My first cue was a Stuart Surridge which I bought because I'd heard of their cricket bats.
It had both male and female parts of the joint made from wood, it did have a plastic collar in the middle, maybe to protect from over turning, it never failed me in about two years of use.