Best tables

[dannygj1988]

Some people seem to like new tables. Others like antiques. Which makes are the best for playing on? Can old ones play as well as a modern one? Some modern ones look a bit "cheap" to me when you look at the old ones.

[philip in china]

I also prefer the look and general quality of older tables but I know not everybody agrees. As to playing I doubt there is any difference if a classic table is properly set up and has modern rubber fitted. My 1930s Burroughes & Watts has Riley cushions for example.

[Geoff Large]

Youre table Phil has the best of both modern and old , the frame and slates are around 1930s the cushions which are Riley Aristocrat made around 1999/2000, the pocket openings and wood capping depth plus pocket plates are made for the modern game , the old welsh slates are less prone to distorting unlike modern italian / Brazilian / Potuguese / or even Chinese slate , Welsh and Irish slate in my opinion is the best in the world for Billiard tables , it is a shame that it is just not cost effective to still mine it , there is tons and tons of it left in the ground , the density of Welsh and Irish slate is so much heavier than italian when they are the same thickness .

As billiard fitters world wide will testfy when manhandling them upstairs

Old tables have more muntins under the slate , if the muntins are fitted and planed correct this will support the slates across the width , stopping any deflection or dip in the slate .
Modern tables use an adjustable muntin this is just as good if not better than the old way , but people often remark , they are not made as good , in truth not a lot has changed in design of the frame work , apart from less muntins in preferance to one centre adjustable muntin , they are pretty much the same , look for double bolted frame work , they are much more sturdy , I often look on ebay at modern Riley aristocrats , one way of spotting a good one is the double bolted frame work over the single bolted version , Riley made Both versions ? . plus there are a lot of chinese copies of the aristocrat . some made under license .

Quality of wood is the main differance , a table made out of solid oak or good quality mahogany including those inner muntins is a sign of very good table . today manufacturers would not waste hard wood on muntins most are soft wood .
this is not to say that the old manufacturers would not use soft wood , scotch pine was often used as the inner frame work and also the outer with a veneer over it , why scotch pine , less knotts .

Adjustable slate supports is not a new thing , as you know Phil , youre ridgidous Burroughs and watts frame has two adjustable width ways supports and two planed supports , all these align with the slate joints , a way for spotting these ridgidous B&Watts tables are that the legs are not evenly spaced , the centre legs are closer to the middle of the frame work rather than set 4 legs spaceings equal like most tables .

[philip in china]

I do hope it is "the best of both modern and old" Geoff. Having seen it in a dismantled state I am absolutely itching to play on it. I am due over there in February and hope it will be fully functioning before that.

Youre table Phil has the best of both modern and old , the frame and slates are around 1930s the cushions which are Riley Aristocrat made around 1999/2000, the pocket openings and wood capping depth plus pocket plates are made for the modern game , the old welsh slates are less prone to distorting unlike modern italian / Brazilian / Potuguese / or even Chinese slate , Welsh and Irish slate in my opinion is the best in the world for Billiard tables , it is a shame that it is just not cost effective to still mine it , there is tons and tons of it left in the ground , the density of Welsh and Irish slate is so much heavier than italian when they are the same thickness .

As billiard fitters world wide will testfy when manhandling them upstairs

Old tables have more muntins under the slate , if the muntins are fitted and planed correct this will support the slates across the width , stopping any deflection or dip in the slate .
Modern tables use an adjustable muntin this is just as good if not better than the old way , but people often remark , they are not made as good , in truth not a lot has changed in design of the frame work , apart from less muntins in preferance to one centre adjustable muntin , they are pretty much the same , look for double bolted frame work , they are much more sturdy , I often look on ebay at modern Riley aristocrats , one way of spotting a good one is the double bolted frame work over the single bolted version , Riley made Both versions ? . plus there are a lot of chinese copies of the aristocrat . some made under license .

Quality of wood is the main differance , a table made out of solid oak or good quality mahogany including those inner muntins is a sign of very good table . today manufacturers would not waste hard wood on muntins most are soft wood .
this is not to say that the old manufacturers would not use soft wood , scotch pine was often used as the inner frame work and also the outer with a veneer over it , why scotch pine , less knotts .

Adjustable slate supports is not a new thing , as you know Phil , youre ridgidous Burroughs and watts frame has two adjustable width ways supports and two planed supports , all these align with the slate joints , a way for spotting these ridgidous B&Watts tables is the legs are not evenly spaced , the centre legs are closer to the middle of the frame work rather than set 4 legs spaceings equal like most tables .

[NorthWestJunior]

I'm not too fussed. If I could have any table I'd go for the Star or an Aristocrat but a well refurbished antique table always looks great when done properly.

[philip in china]

Yes, there is a thread somewhere about "refurbished " tables. Plenty of people selling "fully refurbished" tables at prices where you know they cannot conceivably have refurbished them. Mine was done professionally by Rileys but many have just had a coat of polyurethane on the legs and a new cloth!

I'm not too fussed. If I could have any table I'd go for the Star or an Aristocrat but a well refurbished antique table always looks great when done properly.

[s.h442]

Yes, there is a thread somewhere about "refurbished " tables. Plenty of people selling "fully refurbished" tables at prices where you know they cannot conceivably have refurbished them. Mine was done professionally by Rileys but many have just had a coat of polyurethane on the legs and a new cloth!

i quess it must be a luck of the draw kind of thing.

[philip in china]

It wasn't luck in my case. I asked Geoff Large to source me a good table. Also I wasn't in a hurry so he had plenty of time to sniff around. I would advise anybody in a similar position to do exactly the same. I think most of us need to admit we actually know little enough about tables and an expert opinion is valuable.

i quess it must be a luck of the draw kind of thing.

[bricktip]

Playability wise, it's a case of how well maintained the table is, whether it's relatively new or and antique type. I think it's important to have a table that plays to suit the modern game, like Geoff was saying about Phil's table, a good old solid frame and slates that will last, yet setup with modern cushions and pocket plates to suit the style of todays game.

[philip in china]

Maybe it's because of my age but I really do love the look and feel of deeply polished wood. I also like classic designs. Somehow, and I know this is purely personal, the idea of gold sprayed legs with lights under the table seems too flashy to me.

[throtts]

Maybe it's because of my age but I really do love the look and feel of deeply polished wood. I also like classic designs. Somehow, and I know this is purely personal, the idea of gold sprayed legs with lights under the table seems too flashy to me.

Star of course, lads.

I did have a Riley TC with the silver legs and obviously now have a golden legged Star. I did wonder how the Star would look like in my snooker room but can honestly state I have no regrets. After the quick brush and polish up the table it sits looking very nice and after having it now for nearly nine month I find the older tables look somewhat bland and boring.

I just think we all seem to think we prefer what we all started playing on, yes, the old traditional club looking tables with no flamboyance..

Jmo, guys...

[bricktip]

In my opinion, the Star's could have a nicer leg design, but other than that they look really substantial and are a joy to play on once you get used to the unbelievable speed compared to non-heated tables.

[NorthWestJunior]

I love both the sliver-legged Riley and the Star table. Separates them from the typical plain mahogany that the vast majority of tables seem to have.