Re-Levelling A Snooker Table

[AzureFlyer]

Hi Guys,

At the club I play at we got the Tables recovered about 6 weeks ago, I am not sure of the cloth used or anything like that. Every time there is a slow ball played on both tables a significant roll off is noticeable. Being a complete novice in this department I was wondering will these roll off's come out with frequent ironing or could it be that the table is just not level. I don't think they were levelled at the time of fitting.

My main question is, if re-levelling is indeed needed. What would that look like?

Would the table need to be completely stripped and redone? Or is just a case of putting something under one of the legs?

Regards,
James

[lennon11]

A table will not roll off because of a new cloth....it may drift on a finger mark but not roll off significantly..... .sounds like a relevel is in order.

[AzureFlyer]

Ill have to video it, last night my Dad just out of curiosity tried to roll the cue ball dead weight into the yellow pocket, and in 5 attempts not once did it drop.

It's too big a roll for it to be finger marks in my opinion

[cyberheater]

Ill have to video it, last night my Dad just out of curiosity tried to roll the cue ball dead weight into the yellow pocket, and in 5 attempts not once did it drop.

It's too big a roll for it to be finger marks in my opinion

I'm lucky to have never played on a table that bad.

[AzureFlyer]

I have never noticed it before as I used to batter the balls home. I've now taken a much more controlled approach to the game, and it's annoying that anything slow on pace is turning off line.

The tables were not like this before the re clothing, it was poor workmanship on the fitters end that has caused us to notice these issues. IE - Fitter left 1 tables cushions not tightened, we tightened them ourselves and when doing so discovered that the nuts could be moved by hand.

Ill not name and shame the fitters as of yet, simply because they are meant to be coming back to fix the errors.

[DeanH]

they did not put the cloth on backwards did they?

this does sound bad though, hopefully Geoff or others will come on and point to what could have happened.

In you club, have others noticed the roll? Have you shown it to the "bosses"? What were their comments? (if we couldn't guess )

[AzureFlyer]

We have all noticed it. The bosses know about it, which is how we know that they are meant to be coming back. As I said, a complete let down from someone who has had great feedback in the past.

To pay the amount of money that was paid for the job to be left as it was it not nice.

[Geoff Large]

The main culprit for roll off is Dished slates on a modern table , you do not get this as much on the old welsh slates .
If you roll a ball down one side 2 inch away from the cushion and it rolls towards the middle , then try it on the other side in the same direction and you get the ball also rolling towards the middle , then you have dished slates . Adjustable under frame muntins will help get this out .

also playing on bald worn out cloth offers little resistance on a diagonal shot , but once a new long napped cloth is used the ball will roll off on diagonal shots , you will also get a little wobbling of the cue ball when it is just about to stop , I have been studying the table in the Masters Final on TV tonight and I thought that table was out of level down the green baulk end side where the ball was wobbling most times as it nearly came to a halt . HD TV is amazing for spotting this ! .

some grades of cloth have really thick nap such as the Strachan 6811 Silver , there is also a thicker version of Strachan 6811 Tournament from 30 oz to 32 oz , so expect more roll off on diagonal shots on longer napped cloth .

I all ways use a brace and bit on slotted cushion bolts or brace and socket on hex cushion bolts after using a quick drill up with my torq drill , by nipping them up after with the brace and making sure every bolt has a washer on , they should be at maximum rebound , although after a recover the tight cloth on the cushions do restrict bounce slightly until the cloth loosens up , you can feel how tight the cushion cloth is by putting your finger into the cloth just under the nose of the cushion , feel how much you can gently press the cloth in and then try it on an old cloth table that has not been recovered and you will then have a feel for what I am talking about .
If the bolts where loose just after they left then they just used the drill to tighten the bolts up and not nipped the bolts up , I have to admit even I if distracted have done this , it may be that they took a break and if there was more then one of them the other may have thought the other had nipped them up , so give them the opportunity to come back and see to your complaints .

Bad slate joints sanded down too much can also effect a ball when it rolls over the joint .

Bad set of Balls have been known to give a false reading , if they are tournament champion balls then all is well and good , any under this standard then you may have a bad set of balls or even cue ball , do not forget the cue ball takes all the hammer from the cue and should be replaced by about 6 times the life span of a set of balls , so buy half a dozen cue balls or just buy your own to use and leave the old one in the box or tray.

and talking about roll off's , did anyone see the white ball on one match this week , I think it was one of the Ding matches , as it was slowing down to the baulk cushion , it rolled to one side as if something was under the cloth about 3 inch from the Baulk cushion on the yellow side .

as for taking table apart to level 99 times out of 100 no it will just require a good engineers level and a jack and some toe pieces for under the legs , if slate joints are out then that may require the cloth to come off , unless you can get away with say shimming slightly with a thin playing card under the slate where it meet the side frame , scorned on really , but if someone has had a go sanding those joints too far in the past , do not blame a fitter for doing this as it sometimes is the only way to get those joints from sinking again .
also not all sets of slate are true out of the crate especially modern tables with soft Italian / Chinese / Brazilian / Portuguese slate , some are really bad . it is sometimes the case if a table is really worn and a re-cover is done then the players do not like the speed of the new cloth or the bounce in the cushion , if the cloth has no nap left we describe the cloth as playing on glass , any table with no nap the balls will fly round , tables freshly recovered will be a lot slower .

If the cloth used is top quality then look under one side of the table with a torch where the tacks are and see if you can see any embroidery writing and lines each side on the very edge of the cloth ,if it is Strachan 6811 tournament then two blue lines will be showing on the very edge , if 6811 Club then two red lines, if Hainsworth match or club then XXXX will be showing on the edge .
there are other types of grades in Strachan such as No10 which I doubt would have been used as it will not last long , and another one called Special .

[Pascale]

Really interesting read thanks. Love tech info

The main culprit for roll off is Dished slates on a modern table , you do not get this as much on the old welsh slates .
If you roll a ball down one side 2 inch away from the cushion and it rolls towards the middle , then try it on the other side in the same direction and you get the ball also rolling towards the middle , then you have dished slates . Adjustable under frame muntins will help get this out .

also playing on bald worn out cloth offers little resistance on a diagonal shot , but once a new long napped cloth is used the ball will roll off on diagonal shots , you will also get a little wobbling of the cue ball when it is just about to stop , I have been studying the table in the Masters Final on TV tonight and I thought that table was out of level down the green baulk end side where the ball was wobbling most times as it nearly came to a halt . HD TV is amazing for spotting this ! .

some grades of cloth have really thick nap such as the Strachan 6811 Silver , there is also a thicker version of Strachan 6811 Tournament from 30 oz to 32 oz , so expect more roll off on diagonal shots on longer napped cloth .

I all ways use a brace and bit on slotted cushion bolts or brace and socket on hex cushion bolts after using a quick drill up with my torq drill , by nipping them up after with the brace and making sure every bolt has a washer on , they should be at maximum rebound , although after a recover the tight cloth on the cushions do restrict bounce slightly until the cloth loosens up , you can feel how tight the cushion cloth is by putting your finger into the cloth just under the nose of the cushion , feel how much you can gently press the cloth in and then try it on an old cloth table that has not been recovered and you will then have a feel for what I am talking about .
If the bolts where loose just after they left then they just used the drill to tighten the bolts up and not nipped the bolts up , I have to admit even I if distracted have done this , it may be that they took a break and if there was more then one of them the other may have thought the other had nipped them up , so give them the opportunity to come back and see to your complaints .

Bad slate joints sanded down too much can also effect a ball when it rolls over the joint .

Bad set of Balls have been known to give a false reading , if they are tournament champion balls then all is well and good , any under this standard then you may have a bad set of balls or even cue ball , do not forget the cue ball takes all the hammer from the cue and should be replaced by about 6 times the life span of a set of balls , so buy half a dozen cue balls or just buy your own to use and leave the old one in the box or tray.

and talking about roll off's , did anyone see the white ball on one match this week , I think it was one of the Ding matches , as it was slowing down to the baulk cushion , it rolled to one side as if something was under the cloth about 3 inch from the Baulk cushion on the yellow side .

as for taking table apart to level 99 times out of 100 no it will just require a good engineers level and a jack and some tow pieces for under the legs , if slate joints are out then that may require the cloth to come off , unless you can get away with say shimming slightly with a thin playing card under the slate where it meet the side frame , scorned on really , but if someone has had a go sanding those joints too far in the past , do not blame a fitter for doing this as it sometimes is the only way to get those joints from sinking again .
also not all sets of slate are true out of the crate especially modern tables with soft Italian / Chinese / Brazilian / Portuguese slate , some are really bad . it is sometimes the case if a table is really worn and a re-cover is done then the players do not like the speed of the new cloth or the bounce in the cushion , if the cloth has no nap left we describe the cloth as playing on glass , any table with no nap the balls will fly round , tables freshly recovered will be a lot slower .

If the cloth used is top quality then look under one side of the table with a torch where the tacks are and see if you can see any embroidery writing and lines each side on the very edge of the cloth ,if it is Strachan 6811 tournament then two blue lines will be showing on the very edge , if 6811 Club then two red lines, if Hainsworth match then XXXX will be showing on the edge .
there are other types of grades in Strachan such as No10 which I doubt would have been used as it will not last long , and another one called Special .