Riley Aristocrat Tournament Champion v Burroughes and Watts table

[Mark1]

Please can I have your opinions on the pros and cons of each:

I am buying a full size snooker table for my home. The choices I have are: A brand-new Riley Aristocrat Tournament Champion, or a refurbished Burroughes and Watts table with Steel cushions. The Riley is a mixture of solid wood in combination with hardwoods and the B+W will be solid wood. Is the longevity on the Riley going to be as good as the B+W and will it play as well as the Riley?

Do the welsh slates on the B+W really make a different over the Italian slate on the Riley?

Best,

Mark

[GeordieDS]

I'm no expert but you can't go wrong with a Riley Aristocrat, beautiful table

[Byrom]

I'd go for the steel block B & W ....but its a close thing

The slate is thicker and I think a lovely table with steel blocks on which are worth 500 all day long on their own.... both nice tables mnd - Geoff Large on here will give you his opinion he is the expert you should be asking ... Depends on what B & W model it is what condition they are in and the price variation between the two - what cloth & is fitting in your home included too

[Byrom]

Best table I played on was a Karman & Hillman with steel blocks on it.. followed by a B & Watts again with steel blocks both had heaters and tournament cloth on - then I would say the aristocrat then the star - the star tables are really nice at first but don't keep that way - a bit more cheaper materials used these days if you ask me - always plastic bits falling off and other issues - prone to movement with climate change I am told but its the tables they use at pro level these days which makes them highly sought after and if you are not moving them around so much then no bother. I am a bit nostalgic however and think with a nice cloth heaters and steel blocks bringing them up to modern standard makes them two tables I mentioned far superior to anything else and luckily far cheaper too.


Just my opinion ...

[maryfield]

Why Brand new Riley Aristocrat? Far less expensive a refurbished Riley Aristocrat with new steel block cushions. Where are you based?

[Geoff Large]

£1000 extra for Steel cushions

[Mark1]

Hi everyone, The Aristocrats are not solid wood like the tables of old, does this affect their longevity as different types of wood expand and retract at different rates, or is this not a consideration?

£1000 for steel cushions is not bad so long as the wood on those cushions are also perfect. I'm looking for a table that will give the best playing experience but will also look good in the home.

Do you think heaters are necessary or do you think these days if you have a table in your home around 18-21 degrees should be fine?

[maryfield]

Aristocrat's are made the same as B and Watts. Solid timber throughout. Unfortunately not the same quality of timber, but the best of modern tables. Send me a PM and I can advise the pros and cons of both types of table.

[DeanH]

maryfield - Mark1 cant PM yet until he has over 10posts and a bit of patience

please put you advice of both tables on here for all to learn :wink:

[maryfield]

DeanH, I appreciate the desire to post info publicly. But anything that I will say has already been said by Geoff, myself or other contributors in previous posts. Bit of a chore trying to read through the mountains of old posts to find it though. Rather than regurgitating old news I was trying to make the information more targeted to the OP. Didn't spot that he was new member, thanks for pointing it out.

[DeanH]

DeanH, I appreciate the desire to post info publicly. But anything that I will say has already been said by Geoff, myself or other contributors in previous posts. Bit of a chore trying to read through the mountains of old posts to find it though. Rather than regurgitating old news I was trying to make the information more targeted to the OP. Didn't spot that he was new member, thanks for pointing it out.

gotcha

[maryfield]

Thanks. Having said that many of the professionals that I have spoken to, ROS included, have expressed a fondness for the Riley Aristocrat. The Star is table of choice because of commercial arrangements agreed with WSA, same as when Riley could afford to compete for contract. More a case of 'He who pays the piper calls the tune.'

B and Watt my favourite table maker but not really suited to snooker due to the narrow cushion rails causing bounce back from pockets.

heaters not essential if table is kept in moderate conditions.

[DeanH]

Thanks. Having said that many of the professionals that I have spoken to, ROS included, have expressed a fondness for the Riley Aristocrat. The Star is table of choice because of commercial arrangements agreed with WSA, same as when Riley could afford to compete for contract. More a case of 'He who pays the piper calls the tune.'

B and Watt my favourite table maker but not really suited to snooker due to the narrow cushion rails causing bounce back from pockets.

heaters not essential if table is kept in moderate conditions.

of course nothing to do with him having an endorsement contract with Riley tables is it? :biggrin:

[maryfield]

Same as Hendry with Star when they came to market I suppose. In all honesty I'm basing my opinion on 25 years selling tables and of players expressing their preference. Bear in mind that Riley bought B and Watt over in 1967 and then used the B and Watt design steel block cushion on the Aristocrat. This is now copied on the Star table. China is very good at imitating not innovating. The quality of some materials in a Star table are inferior in terms of quality and finish. Ex- crucible table fitter I know hasn't got a high opinion of them.

[Mark1]

I spoke to Riley, and they said that the Aristocrat is not solid wood throughout. For instance, on the Silver and Mahogany table, the mahogany that you see on the outside, is solid Mahogany. The silver legs and struts under the slate are not Mahogany but rather other hard woods being used. This is done to save costs, but according to Riley will not affect the playing experience being purely aesthetic. I asked Riley how much it would cost for them to make me a solid wood table in Mahogany and the quote was £20,000+.

The Star tables apparently are made with cheap parts coming from China. They are supposed to play well initially but it's been reported that the playing experience declines with balls rolling off line etc. It makes sense that if China offer the WPBSA money to use their tables at the top line events then it's purely a business move. If they play well for the short time period of a tournament then why not. Talking to both Riley and B+W, I understand that the Riley and B+W tables are far superior in manufacturing quality in the materials being used and playing experience.