Quick question about Sam Baird and Colin Mitchell

[trains]

If they're WPBSA members or Non tour professionals so eligible to play in the World Champ prelim qualifiers,how are they also amateurs and competing in the Q School Satellite Series or Pro ticket tours? Cheers

[StevieB13147]

That seems to be a little dilema that goes against the rules operated by NGB's
Good Question

Although it is more of a "situation/circumstances thing", rather than anyone being devious or underhand in where they choose to play.

Would be good to get a clear definition sorted out on this one.

[Souwester]

As far as I'm aware they are not WPBSA members and are not, therefore, technically professional. Sam Baird, at least, is a member of the amateur NGB (EASB).

[wildJONESEYE]

As far as I'm aware they are not WPBSA members and are not, therefore, technically professional. Sam Baird, at least, is a member of the amateur NGB (EASB).

so that means anyone who wanted could have played but only 15 took it up ???

[Souwester]

TBH I'm not sure how he and the others came to be playing in it. Did they qualify somehow? Were they invited? Did they just pay some money to enter?

[bigbreak]

It's very simple. They are "WPBSA members not on the tour". It's nothing new

[StevieB13147]

This maybe help..........?

Or it may make things even less clear...........

When I was involved with Scottish Snooker (Chairman)

We had a player (Richy McDonald) who after competing on the WSA Qualifying Tour up to March or April in 2004/05, and after failing to gain a place on the Main Tour, then asked if he could play in the Amateurs for the remainder of the domestic Amateur season which had 2 events left to play.

Scottish Snooker (At that time) did not have anything within it's rules to stop a "non-professional" from entering events. So Richy asked WSA to send a letter to Scottish Snooker declaring that his season with them was over and that he had relinquished his professional status.

Once this was recieved by Scottish Snooker, Richy then joined the NGB and proceeded to win the last two events, one being the National Championship (carrying double Ranking points). The 300pt total also got Richy into 5th spot on the rankings and into the 2005 Scottish Home International Team that year.

Other countries had in the past abused this sort of situation for the furtherance of International Teams and Events, therefore at subsequent HIBSF and EBSA meetings I raised the subject for clarification and was happy when all Home Countries agreed to plug this loop-hole by "not allowing any player who had competed professionally in any season to "come back" as an amateur until the start of the season following. They also could not represent their country at any International events that required amateur qualification in the same season.

Association Officials such as Gordon Pantall (Wales), Northern Ireland's Mr Billy Telford (R.I.P), Jime Leacy (RIBSA), Derrick Brown (Wales) EASB officials and many others were all in attendance when these rules were moved and passed.

Therefore it seems that since then, these rulings have now been superseeded or conveniently forgotten.

It would be good if someone in Authority where to clearly clarify the current situation, rather than all of us guessing at our own interpretation of the rules/situation.

To conclude, I must stress that Richy McDonald never at any time did anything wrong given his situation - Richy merely utilised the then loose scope of the rules at that time.
Also, I wish Sam Baird, Colin Mitchell and any others that find themselves in this "no-man's land" quandry all the very best for whatever level of Snooker they partake of.

Hope this 100% accurate information helps in some way.
Even if only to bring the issue out into the open for clarification to ensure fairness for all.

Cheers
Stevie Baillie

[MattWilson]

Also, I wish Liam Highfield, Colin Mitchell and any others that find themselves in this "no-man's land" quandry all the very best for whatever level of Snooker they partake of.

I don't understand the reference to Liam Highfield here, Stevie?

I flagged up Sam Baird's entry a few weeks back and never really understood why he was allowed to enter. Personally, I think anybody and everybody should be able to enter the Worlds, not just WPBSA members/coaches etc. but the rules are the rules and they should be adhered to.

MW

[bigbreak]

Preliminary qualifying

The preliminary qualifying rounds for the tournament took place on 3 March 2011 at the World Snooker Academy in Sheffield. (WPBSA members not on The Tour.)

Round 1
Sam Baird 5–1 Colin Mitchell
Tony Brown 2–5 Ali Bassiri
David Singh 4–5 David Gray
Ian Stark 5–2 Paul Cavney
Philip Minchin 0–5Stephen Rowlings
Tony Knowles 4–5 Del Smith
Les Dodd 4–5 Stephen Ormerod

Round 2
Neil Selman 3–5 Sam Baird
Ali Bassiri 0–5 David Gray
Ian Stark 0–5 Stephen Rowlings
Del Smith 5–0 Stephen Ormerod

Qualifying

The qualifying rounds 1–4 for the tournament will take place between 4 and 10 March 2011 at the World Snooker Academy in Sheffield. The final round of qualifying will take place between 12 and 13 March 2011 at the same venue.
Round 1
Reanne Evans Match 12 Sam Baird
bye David Gray
Jak Jones Match 14 Stephen Rowlings
bye Del Smith

[trains]

I don't understand the reference to Liam Highfield here, Stevie?

I flagged up Sam Baird's entry a few weeks back and never really understood why he was allowed to enter. Personally, I think anybody and everybody should be able to enter the Worlds, not just WPBSA members/coaches etc. but the rules are the rules and they should be adhered to.MW

True but those rules should apply both ways as Baird (and no reproach from here on him) is getting another shake in the amateurs.
Maybe Stevie's Highfield reference was because he's at 64? and viewed possibly as the most perilous to lose his card I dont know.

[wildJONESEYE]

World Championship pre qualifieng should be PTC Linked for amateurs.

top 32 on the PTC Rankings thats not on the main tour play in the Amataur rounds to get either 16 or 8 players to play in the first round against tour players.

top 32 PTC Players not on MT

Daniel Wells
Allan Taylor
Michael Wasley
Luca Brecel
Stuart Carrington
James McGouran
Andrew Norman
Ian Burns
Craig Steadman
Chen Zhe
Stephen Craigie
Leo Fernandez
Ian Glover
Chris Norbury
David Grace
Adam Duffy
Ben Harrison
Jamie Walker
David Singh
Mitchell Mann
Aditya Mehta
Martin O'Donnell
Jordan Brown
Nick Jennings
Lasse Munstermann
Sam Thistlewhite
Michael Wild
Sam Baird
Alex Davies
Ralph Enax
Michel Heeger
Jurgen Kesseler

[StevieB13147]

I don't understand the reference to Liam Highfield here, Stevie?

I flagged up Sam Baird's entry a few weeks back and never really understood why he was allowed to enter. Personally, I think anybody and everybody should be able to enter the Worlds, not just WPBSA members/coaches etc. but the rules are the rules and they should be adhered to.

MW

Hi Matt,
My apologies for referencing Laim Highfield instead of Sam Baird, which I ment to! (Old head is losing it!)
I have corrected the post now.
Good Spot Sir
Cheers
StevieB

[StevieB13147]

Hi Trains

No, there was no sideways reference just a pure and simple typo error from myself.
Apolgies once again.
Now corrected.
Hope that clears any dicrepency
Cheers
StevieB

[trains]

Only thought stems from this which Souwester mentioned is which amateurs or how many of them were made aware or privy? to WPBSA membership? If a good no. werent and they're like what? looking at these prelims thats interesting at least,not implying anything as I have no idea.

[JanieWatkins]

Only thought stems from this which Souwester mentioned is which amateurs or how many of them were made aware or privy? to WPBSA membership? If a good no. werent and they're like what? looking at these prelims thats interesting at least,not implying anything as I have no idea.

When a WSA Member loses his place on the Main Tour, he needs to resign his membership, by letter, in order to be reinstated as an amateur eligible to play in his ngb events.

In the past we had a player disbarred from possible qualification on the PIOS because WSA informed us he hadn't resigned his membership,

The onus is on the player to resign.

Whether WSA notify the amateur bodies that their players have retained their membership, I've no idea.

The anomaly to all this is the Coaches. They have to retain their wpbsa membership and I, for one, think it is grossly unfair that they can play in both the world champs and their amateur events.

Either everyone or no-one should be able to play in the world champs. Personally I think it should be thrown open again to everyone.

But it is quite patently wrong that some players could play in the worlds and also on the amateur circuit but the amateur couldn't play in the worlds.