Cue rubbing the chest or not ?

[DeanH]

Hi Terry.
I have moved my bridge-hand closer to the white to try to negate any tip movement until after white ball impact.
"moving the cue a touch more towards the tip of your forefinger" do you mean have the butt lower in the fore-finger/thumb away from the webbing? When I said in my previous post that I had space between the butt and the webbing, that was when I used to have the butt in the crux of the first knuckle and not in the webbing, so it would be closer to the tip of the forefinger, is this what you mean?
I have been trying the blue from spot, absolutely straight, and the blue tends to hit side custom, to the left of the corner pocket to the left of the black, by an inch; or the bottom custom when trying the other side, so to me the white is going right a tad throwing the Blue left a tad.
My forearm and elbow tend to be dead-vertical, as my playing partner (the wife) always comments on how vertical it is !
I will try the cocked outward wrist next practise night (Sat) and see what happens.
All the best
DeanH

[Terry Davidson]

Dean:

This is a prime example on why there's nothing better than one-on-one coaching. In your first explanation you said you were pulling the butt into your body (left) on delivery and the tip was going to the right.

However, with the results you're getting on the long blues you must be hitting the cueball on the left to push it to the right and over-cut the blue to the side cushion.

Therefore, you MUST be moving the butt to the right and the tip to the left on delivery if the cue is on the right line of aim.

Now matter, I will try and get you there. First of all, when I say move the cue butt (grip) a little more towards the tip of the forefinger (just a bit, not a whole lot by the way) this normally forces more of a wrist cock and that is done in order to have NO GAP with the web. Try and grip your cue just like you would a hammer and most people pound a nail by having the wrist well cocked with no air gap in the web.

You should hold your cue exactly the same way as you would grip a hammer to drive a nail, except the 'hold' on the cue is with the FOREFINGER ONLY (not the thumb) and of course a lot less pressure than with a hammer.

Too bad you can't fly over here for some lessons and the only way to get the grip right and stop your crooked cue delivery is by one-on-one coaching.

For some reason you are delivering the cue tip right-to-left, despite what you said originally. For right-handers this is very common and thjey only cure I've found is a more severe wrist cock whilst maintaining the 'no air gap' with the web between forefinger and thumb.

In addition, try and relax your grip as much as possible to ensure you are not tightening the grip on the cue until the very end of the delivery or at least as late as you possibly can in the delivery.

To see this, try and get a plastic pop bottle and lay it down on the baulk line (plastic so you won't damage your shaft). Now try cueing in and out of the neck of the pop bottle VERY slowly without touching the sides. Use a long backswing and lots of follow-through but not a lot of speed.

Once you stop hitting the sides of the neck of the pop bottle start speeding up the delivery (not the backswing) until you can cue six inches into the pop bottle without touching the sides (this is very difficult).

From this exercise you will see exactly what's happening with your tip and it sounds as if you will hit the left of the neck of the bottle on delivery.

Let me know how you make out

Terry

[Terry Davidson]

johno:

If you have the correct and loose grip, dropping the elbow is a very natural movement, especially on power shots.

To learn how to do it consistently, get on the baulk line from the side and use the brown spot as if it were a cueball. Now place a ball a couple of inches away from the side cushion and centered on the baulk line.

Cue up to the brown spot and SLOWLY do a long backswing and SLOWLY deliver the cue as if you are trying to hit the object ball near the side cushion (ensure the object ball is at least 12in away from the brown spot, so on the other side of the green spot somewhere).

Slowly deliver the cue all the way and as far as you can towards that object ball. As you get to the end of the delivery, in order to get a couple more inches closer to that object ball you will HAVE TO drop the elbow naturally. Remember to do this VERY SLOW at first and as you get the feel of it, start speeding up the delivery (but NOT that long slow backswing) and if you concentrate on trying to hit that object ball with your tip you will find you naturally have an elbow drop.

By the way, players who say they don't drop their elbow are mostly mistaken. If I task them with a long blue and tell them to pot the blue and screw the cueball back to the yellow pocket they will ALL drop their elbow as it's a forcing shot (either that or miscue if their grip is too tight).

I have had quite a few students who couldn't screw a ball 6 inches on that shot and after one lesson have not only got them delivering the cue straight but also screwing back to the baulk line or close to it, which is still a real power shot.

Terry

[DeanH]

Hi Terry,
Now I am confused
This is why you are a World Class Coach and I am not (yet)

I would love go to the land of the Maple! Not sure the wife would like it though

What I am planning is to see Gavin again in Northampton , when I can in the New Year (Gavin - dust down the old diary).

I will try the plastic bottle to judge exactly what is going on!

All the best to you and yours
Dean

[stephenm2682]

just looking at that youtube clip gavin posted, if you look at 0.50 you can see ronnie looking at CB/OB then CB i think?

[CoachGavin]

Be good to see you again DeanH.

On the OB/CB sighting I would not be surprised as I reckon a lot of pros are not sure what they are looking at. I have seen slow motion of Hendry playing and on long pots he actually looks at the white ball last so maybe looking at OB last is not as important as was thought - who knows !

[Acrowot]

Just had a look at one of Ronnie's videos and he does not cock his wrist on this video.
:snooker:

[mick 142]

Hi terry am i right saying that tony knowles was one of the first to drop his elbow on the follow threw . cheers mick

[Terry Davidson]

Acrowat:

Normally Ronnie does have a healthy wrist cock but even he admits he experiments with his grip all the time (not a good thing I would imagine).

Tony Knowles was the only one I remember in the more modern era *80's onward) but the elbow drop was very common in the early days with Joe Davis and most of the other billiards pros who turned to snooker pros. Rex Williams also dropped his elbow too

Terry

[peterpackage]

Got a question guys

What if your a big boy and have your cue in a nice regular spot touching your chest. Then you lose a lot of weight so your chest shrinks to half it's size (e.g. going from a Stephen Lee to a Neil Robertson). Is that going to serious stuff up your cue action ?

[gem]

Got a question guys

What if your a big boy and have your cue in a nice regular spot touching your chest. Then you lose a lot of weight so your chest shrinks to half it's size (e.g. going from a Stephen Lee to a Neil Robertson). Is that going to serious stuff up your cue action ?

I stopped playing for many years and I am now around 5 stone heavier than when I played before and have found it a bit awkward now as some shots I feel the cushion gets in the way of my stomach and it definately affects some of my shots. On the plus side i used to get a problem of the cue rubbing on my neck around the Adams apple but now it is not close due to the extra bulk.
I would reckon if someone lost weight then it would help their game rather than hinder going on my findings the other way.

[Terry Davidson]

peter:

Losing the weight should actually help you but you should get the chest down to the cue again and keep the elbow up as high as possible.

Do not pull the butt of the cue into the chest, keep the butt about one inch above the cushion but get the chest down. Try an almost straight bridge arm in order to lower that side of your body which is accomplished by bending the leg a bit more

Terry

[Beastier]

Just did a search and came across this old thread and have read with much interest...especially the comments from Terry who clearly really knows what he's talking about.

Reason I searched, being I've recently taken up trying to learn how to play to some kind of standard and progress from the "knocking a few balls around" level and of course getting a good and more consistent cue action is an absolute pivotal basic (to be fair not quite so basic as one might anticipate).

This is something I've put quite a bit of effort in (I've also had some lessons with a pro coach) and finally thought I'd got it cracked......however my last few sessions I've noticed a lot of bumpiness in my feathering and last night finally narrowed it down that my cue is running across my chest and this is causing a lot of un-evenness, moreso as I continued to try and tuck the cue further into my body. Also I guess as I was naturally tensing up more as I was getting increasingly frustrated at the time.

Having gone away and thought about it and had a few practice shots on my lads pool table this morning, it seems to work a bit better (for me at least) for the cue to run slightly on the underside of the chest muscle, which also seems to create a more parallel cueing action as it makes you naturally drop your elbow a bit. Obviously need to get back on a proper table later and see how this goes.

[itsnoteasy]

When you say bumpiness do you mean in a up and down sense or side to side?