Wrist

[Terry Davidson]

Trevor:

The 'hammer' grip is advocated by most coaches. Hold the cue out in front of you in the VERTICAL position just the same as you would hold a hammer (I forgot to mention the vertical in my first post).

You will find, just the same as using a hammer, the butt of the cue is being held with the fingers but the telling point is the butt will also be against the BACK of the palm and it's EXACTLY this position and hold on the butt you want at the ADDRESS POSITION.

When the cue goes back during feathering or on the backswing the back of the palm comes off the butt of the cue and then comes back onto it as you get back to the address position again whether feathering or during the instant of stiking the cueball.

To have an automatic wrist cock a player will hold the cue on the middle pads of the 4 fingers with only the forefinger and thumb exerting pressure. Also the main knuckles of the hand should be parallel with the butt of the cue or even a bit above it.

Looking at Steve Davis from the 80's he had a pronounced wrist cock, however looking at Stephen Hendry during the 90's reveals he had almost no wrist cock, just a very slight angle between back of the palm and wrist.

As my coaching theory is to keep everything as simple as possible I advocate the butt of the cue should be directly under or perhaps a little outside the long straight forearm bone, which is really the driving lever for the cue and doesn't it make sense to have a straight and vertical line straight down the forearm bone and through the middle of the butt?

Terry

[trevs1]

Trevor:

The 'hammer' grip is advocated by most coaches. Hold the cue out in front of you in the VERTICAL position just the same as you would hold a hammer (I forgot to mention the vertical in my first post).

You will find, just the same as using a hammer, the butt of the cue is being held with the fingers but the telling point is the butt will also be against the BACK of the palm and it's EXACTLY this position and hold on the butt you want at the ADDRESS POSITION.

When the cue goes back during feathering or on the backswing the back of the palm comes off the butt of the cue and then comes back onto it as you get back to the address position again whether feathering or during the instant of stiking the cueball.

To have an automatic wrist cock a player will hold the cue on the middle pads of the 4 fingers with only the forefinger and thumb exerting pressure. Also the main knuckles of the hand should be parallel with the butt of the cue or even a bit above it.

Looking at Steve Davis from the 80's he had a pronounced wrist cock, however looking at Stephen Hendry during the 90's reveals he had almost no wrist cock, just a very slight angle between back of the palm and wrist.

As my coaching theory is to keep everything as simple as possible I advocate the butt of the cue should be directly under or perhaps a little outside the long straight forearm bone, which is really the driving lever for the cue and doesn't it make sense to have a straight and vertical line straight down the forearm bone and through the middle of the butt?

Terry

Ah, I see what you are inferring now Terry.

What I think you are saying the wrist cock adds up to is, that viewed from behind the player, it creates a dead straight perpendicular line, through the centre line of the forearm, down through the centre line of the cue butt...yes???

This gives the impression of a cocked wrist, where the outside line of the back of the hand is not in a straight line with the outside line of the forearm (like the position a boxer would hold his fist in relation to his forearm) but instead, is angled outwards slightly.

If this is description is what you meant, then yes, I agree with that 100%.

[tornado taylor]

Maybe its just me being a bit slow to not understand but from what I can gather from this wrist cock is you have to twist your hand out a bit? Is that correct. When I was learning the game this was known to be very bad to turn the wrist outwards. The wrist cock I know of was to hold the cue with the end of the index finger and thumb and to rest the knuckles on the top of the cue and by doing this when you bring the cue back and forwards your wrist will automatically cock back. Joe swail has a classic example of this.

[Terry Davidson]

Trevor:

That's exactly what I mean. The trick is to have a grip where the main knuckles of the hand are roughly parallel with the butt of the cue or perhaps a little bit above it if the player prefers to hold the cue more towards the end of the fingers (a little bit) rather than resting on the middle pads of the fingers.

Tornado:

I would differ with whoever it was who taught you regarding not turning the wrist outwards. By the way, Joe Swail has his own very unique grip with his right elbow far into the middle of his back and this forces him to have his main knuckles FAR above the butt of the cue.

To get what I mean try holding the butt of your cue just like you would hold a hammer to drive a nail. Hold the cue out in front of you vertically with your right arm straight and notice there will be an angle (every person is different according to their particular physique) and this agle will be anywhere from about 20degrees to somewhere around 45degrees. There should also be a couple of wrinkles at the wrist joint.

I would recommend you do not hold the cue with the end of the forefinger or have the cue resting on the last pad of the forefinger, but rather just laying in the bed of the middle pads of the 4 fingers (pure Joe Davis and right from his book). The grip or as I like to call it, the 'hold' on the cue is with the forefinger and thumb and the thumb is not exerting any sideways pressure on the butt, just holding it in the bed (again pure Joe Davis).

The backswing and delivery should be initiated with ONLY the forefinger (this is pure Terry Griffiths theory).

Terry

[tornado taylor]

My grip is as you describe like holding a hammer but I dont consciously turn my wrist out. Its been along time since i've watched it but I thought steve davis said not to turn the wrist out on his video that I bought. Frank callan if I remember his last name correctly was the 1 who said about the holding the cue with the finger and thumb as a technique to get wrist cock. I tried it but never liked it but I believe it is to get the wrist loose like joe swail his wrist is very loose and seems to just flick the cue with the wrist.

[Terry Davidson]

tornado:

For goodness sakes, DON'T use Joe Swayle as an example of what a snooker technique should be like as he has his own technique learned when he was a kid and could just reach the cushions and he hasn't changed it as he grew.

For those of you who don't agree with cocking the wrist just have a look at some of the pics ferrett has posted here from the Masters. ESPECIALLY the second lot, pictures #3 and #5. Picture #3 is Mark Allen before he delivers the cue and note the angle of the back of his left hand and see that it's probably at around 45degrees to the left forearm.

Then look at photo #5, Neil Robertson cueing a ball and note how cocked his wrist is too.

But then again, I suppose you will say that it's a lefty thing since both of them are left handed?

The wrist cock is NATURAL and CORRECT technique

Terry

[tornado taylor]

Hang on terry I never said joe swail's technique was correct or that you should copy him I was using him as an example of wrist cock only, that frank advocated many years ago I also never said that I agree or disagree with your method of the wrist cock I was just interested in what you had to say on the subject as you know more about this than me. Cheers mate.

[DWOT]

tornado:

For goodness sakes, DON'T use Joe Swayle as an example of what a snooker technique should be like as he has his own technique learned when he was a kid and could just reach the cushions and he hasn't changed it as he grew.

For those of you who don't agree with cocking the wrist just have a look at some of the pics ferrett has posted here from the Masters. ESPECIALLY the second lot, pictures #3 and #5. Picture #3 is Mark Allen before he delivers the cue and note the angle of the back of his left hand and see that it's probably at around 45degrees to the left forearm.

Then look at photo #5, Neil Robertson cueing a ball and note how cocked his wrist is too.

But then again, I suppose you will say that it's a lefty thing since both of them are left handed?

The wrist cock is NATURAL and CORRECT technique

Terry

I shall take a good long look as I'm a leftie too.... I was going to mention Allens as his wrist cock was the most obvious I'd seen.

[Terry Davidson]

sorry tornado, it appeared to me you were advocating the Joe Swail technique if a player preferred a wrist cock.

I hope no one out there decides he should play with his cue arm elbow in the middle of his back as that would entail a very, very loose grip with a severe wrist cock and the cue mostly held with the fingertips only, just as Joe does.

DWOT:

See if you can find pictures or videos of most of the top players and if you can get a view of their wrists while they're in the address position. The fact of right or left-handed is one is (or should be) just a mirror image of the other and the technique is exactly the same for either.

Terry

[DWOT]

sorry tornado, it appeared to me you were advocating the Joe Swail technique if a player preferred a wrist cock.

I hope no one out there decides he should play with his cue arm elbow in the middle of his back as that would entail a very, very loose grip with a severe wrist cock and the cue mostly held with the fingertips only, just as Joe does.

DWOT:

See if you can find pictures or videos of most of the top players and if you can get a view of their wrists while they're in the address position. The fact of right or left-handed is one is (or should be) just a mirror image of the other and the technique is exactly the same for either.

Terry

Will do, after tomorrows match I think I'm going to take a break for a week as I'm getting worse not better!

[tornado taylor]

No problem terry. I cant see many if any tryin to copy joe as his style is way off the scale as far a textbook technique goes but he does play well with I have to say but like you said he has played all his life like it so thats what he's used to.

[GEO147]

Was getting worried there. Just went and checked my "hold" and was pleasantly surprised to see that I am doing this naturally. :snooker:

Tend to grip with the back fingers a bit from time to time though!

[CoachGavin]

ronnie o sullivans wrist in addess and delivery is here. Look at 1:50

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lwhypbnmnjY

[Terry Davidson]

Thanks for the clip Gavin.

It clearly shows a wrist cock of about 20degrees or so which is not too severe as there are no wrinkles at the joint that I can see.

However, when they show him playing left-handed he has his wrist turned in the other way! I wonder if he realizes that?

Terry

[Giggity1984]

Thanks for the clip Gavin.

It clearly shows a wrist cock of about 20degrees or so which is not too severe as there are no wrinkles at the joint that I can see.

However, when they show him playing left-handed he has his wrist turned in the other way! I wonder if he realizes that?

Terry

I don't suppose he would Terry! After nearly falling out of my chair hearing Jamie Cope say that he didn't realise what he was doing with his bridge hand in his first round match at this years masters until after the match when someone text him, I think that the best players don't think too hard about technique like the rest of us do!