Timing and final pause issue!

[tom snow]

thanx all for thease great tips......
k bro on i have one question... so when on front pasue ..eyes on object ball right ...when deliver the cues and again eyes on object ball ..so when i look the cue ball then plz tell me .......???? thanx

[hotpot]

Tom , with the metod i mentioned , the first feather you are focused on where the tip is hitting the white and then at the front pause or just as youre bringing the cue back the eyes will switch to the object ball .

[Terry Davidson]

tom snow:

To clarify a bit as the importance of eye rhythm is hardly mentioned by books or some coaches.

Although a player can have his own unique or different eye rhythm, the 'ideal' is to have the eyes switching back and forth between CB and OB when feathering. Then at the front pause the eyes lock onto the spot on the cueball you want to hit.

Then somewhere near the end of the final backswing or else at the rear pause the eyes shift to the object ball and lock onto it and the cue is delivered. It's this last step which differs amongst players. I lock my eyes on the object ball at the end of the front pause and have experimented with doing that at the end of the backswing, watching the cue tip come back then switching my eyes to the object ball.

It's very difficult to change your natural eye rhythm once you've developed one

Terry

[kezman]

Hi there, i am new to this forum, but im a quite good player, I can make regular 50s. and sometimes if am lucky i can make 80-90 or centuries (my highest is 136)!

i started to strugle with my game since last year, and this happened exactly when i tried to inject a backswing pause before hitting the cueball becuz i thought it would imrpove my game and build a consistency, but it made it worse for me . So what is the problem exactly?

When i go down on the shot, and try to do the final backswing pause, i cannnot seem to know when to hit the whiteball, it's like, sometimes i do 0.5 sec, and sometimes 1 sec, and if a im under pressure, it takes more than 1 sec! the timing is just awuful now! if i am playing alone like lineup or something, or playing with a friend with a huge confident, everything seems sweet and nice and i can make huge breaks without any issue, but when i play in tournements under pressure, i just cannot get the timing right, which affected my game alot becuz i am not delivering the cue the way i want it! if i am trying to screw back 4 inches, i might screw 2 inches or 8 inches !! i lost the feeling!

I tried alot of things, but it seems the more things i try the worse my game is getting, i need to sort things out for me, so i need some help pls.


My friendz advise me to think positivly (with confident) while doing the final pause to forget about it and play naturally until i master it, for example, when i am down and doing the final pause, i try to think that the cue will go straight to hit the object ball sweetly,

others told me to count, for example, do 3-4 feathers, and then count one (backswing) two (hit/deliver the cue),


im just lost, and i need to sort my mind pls, becuz i am playing now with no confidence at all,

I think that you may have to sort your eyes sighting. When you go down and start feathering did you flick your eyes to the object ball and cue ball? If you have a backswing pause it is only to do with the timing and eyes in other words you have to look at the object ball when your backswing pause than strike the cue ball and stop at your chest. Stoping at your chest or hitting the chest when you complete the shot will improve your consistence. Will advise you to see a coach but not this new modern student, experienced one.
There are scale on the timing between 1-3. Players with the back swing pause 90 percent work on the number 3. It is mean when you go down on the shot you sight on the way down and start feathering usually 2-3 feathers but don't do them fast, on the final feather pause at the front look at the cue ball for a 0.5-1 second than pull the cue back and flick your eyes at the object ball and strike with exceleration and stop at your chest. You will also fined that you developed a bit more cue power. Don't forget eyes flicking between feathers,tip to the cue ball eyes on the cue ball, when feather back -eyes on the object ball. You will fined later that your timing is became natural and back swing pause too. Breathing is important, dont hold your breath let it flow It is hard to explain by text but hopefully it will help if you want to develop a back swing pause. Remember its all about eyes and you have to be prepare that is not coming fast you will have to work on it. Good luck. I hope it helps.

[Leo78]

Thank you all for your reply, very helpful indeed your tips and instructions. (especially the eyes rhythm)

I am getting closer to master the backswing pause, but one thing that frustrated me, one day i could make 70-80 and the next day strugle to make 30! then i realized that something was wrong and try to figure it out, which could be follow through (drive), eyes rhythm, hitting the chest, aiming .etc.

Snooker drives me crazy sometimes, why can't I play good consistently! eveytime i play poor, i try to find out what is wrong and alter my techniques (biggest mistake i know), but without a good coach, i think i have to work it out myself! last time i had a decent coach was 4 years a go with Del Hill.

I guess this is the beauty of Snooker there is always a room for improvmenet!

[Terry Davidson]

leo:

Perhaps another trip to Del is in order. Now that you have a little more insight into your own technique you can ask him more pointed questions and therefore get more specific guidance on your problem(s) and in that way improvement will come more rapidly.

I can also recommend Nic Barrow in Milton Keynes, depending on where you are. Jim Donnelly in Glasgow too

Terry

[Leo78]

leo:

Perhaps another trip to Del is in order. Now that you have a little more insight into your own technique you can ask him more pointed questions and therefore get more specific guidance on your problem(s) and in that way improvement will come more rapidly.

I can also recommend Nic Barrow in Milton Keynes, depending on where you are. Jim Donnelly in Glasgow too

Terry

I wish I could, but today i cannot visit them due to some personal issues.

I can conclude the following things from all these years in Snooker:

1- Aim properly (get down to the right angle). No micro adj. as you have mentioned many times here.

2- Straight cueing ("push through" the white smoothly to send it straight while your eyes locked on the object ball)

if you manage to do the above two things properly, you will 100% will pot the balls!

In your opinion, what do you think are the most important things in Snooker?

[The Doctor]

Its very difficult to say one part of your technique is more important than others. I would say the most important thing is to have as few variables as possible. Meaning, get the basics right, keep your method simple and consistent. Your game will improve loads if you do things consistently but you also must have consistent thought. You alluded to making changes and having a lot of thoughts when not playing so good. This is a classic sign of inconsistency and should be avoided at all costs. When you are struggling always go back to the basics and your game will come back.

[Terry Davidson]

leo:

In my opinion here are the most important parts of a technique, listed in decending order of importance (although as the Doc says, all are important):

1. No upper body movement which is accomplished by having a stable, solid and comfortable stance.
2. Driving the grip hand through to the chest on every shot (or in other words accelerating THROUGH the cueball.
3. Slow and smooth backswing with length either proportional to power required or else long all the time (ferrule back to 'V' of bridge). The backswing should be slow enough so the player can control it and keep it consistently straight.
4. Loose grip, loose enough that the cue can be easily pulled through the grip by the other hand or by a friend pulling on the butt of the cue.
5. Front and rear pause. Both are necessary for the 'ideal' technique.
6. On delivery from the rear pause, accelerate smoothly, starting slow and building up to the required acceleration.
7. Keep the cue on the same plane all the time, dropping the elbow slightly on longer backswings and dropping the elbow at the end of the delivery.
8. Never, EVER, tighten the grip on the cue until well after the cueball has been struck, ideally when the back of the grip hand thumb hits the chest.

There are some other important points but in the final analysis the KISS principle applies meaning do not have any extra movement in any other part of the body except the elbow joint and the shoulder joint to a small defgree when dropping the elbow. For instance, Stephen Hendry allows his right elbow to drop into his back on the backswing and then raises it again on the delivery. This extra movement in his technique demands that he has absolutely perfect timing in order to get the cue back to the precise address position at the time of strike, no earlier and certainly no later. For a 21-year-old this may be achievable however for anyone over 30 any extra movement in any part of the technique demanding perfect timing and coordination will be costly, especially on long pots.

Now, if a player consistently and faithfully follows my 8 pointa above and gets 8-10 hours (or more) practice per week I GUARANTEE he (or she) will improve RAPIDLY, of that I have no doubt.

Also I should mention if I could have had these proper technique points when I was playing in Britain in the late 80's I would have been a much better player and would have likely turned pro. Hell, if I could do these 8 points consistently NOW, I would be a much better player! (I'm working on it but I think it's a little late for me)

Terry

[Leo78]

Its very difficult to say one part of your technique is more important than others. I would say the most important thing is to have as few variables as possible. Meaning, get the basics right, keep your method simple and consistent. Your game will improve loads if you do things consistently but you also must have consistent thought. You alluded to making changes and having a lot of thoughts when not playing so good. This is a classic sign of inconsistency and should be avoided at all costs. When you are struggling always go back to the basics and your game will come back.

So you are suggesting to always go back to basics when struggling, which is 100% true, but what if i go back to basics and my game is still bad? what do you suggest in this case? any advice? could be my techniques??

If my techniques, how could I made couple of high breaks last night and today i played poorley, even when trying to go back to basics. what could be the issue? i was playing without any pressure, but mind would not stop of what is wrong with my cue action because you cant let go the thoughts when you do all the basics correctly and still missing

[Leo78]

leo:

In my opinion here are the most important parts of a technique, listed in decending order of importance (although as the Doc says, all are important):

1. No upper body movement which is accomplished by having a stable, solid and comfortable stance.
2. Driving the grip hand through to the chest on every shot (or in other words accelerating THROUGH the cueball.
3. Slow and smooth backswing with length either proportional to power required or else long all the time (ferrule back to 'V' of bridge). The backswing should be slow enough so the player can control it and keep it consistently straight.
4. Loose grip, loose enough that the cue can be easily pulled through the grip by the other hand or by a friend pulling on the butt of the cue.
5. Front and rear pause. Both are necessary for the 'ideal' technique.
6. On delivery from the rear pause, accelerate smoothly, starting slow and building up to the required acceleration.
7. Keep the cue on the same plane all the time, dropping the elbow slightly on longer backswings and dropping the elbow at the end of the delivery.
8. Never, EVER, tighten the grip on the cue until well after the cueball has been struck, ideally when the back of the grip hand thumb hits the chest.

There are some other important points but in the final analysis the KISS principle applies meaning do not have any extra movement in any other part of the body except the elbow joint and the shoulder joint to a small defgree when dropping the elbow. For instance, Stephen Hendry allows his right elbow to drop into his back on the backswing and then raises it again on the delivery. This extra movement in his technique demands that he has absolutely perfect timing in order to get the cue back to the precise address position at the time of strike, no earlier and certainly no later. For a 21-year-old this may be achievable however for anyone over 30 any extra movement in any part of the technique demanding perfect timing and coordination will be costly, especially on long pots.

Now, if a player consistently and faithfully follows my 8 pointa above and gets 8-10 hours (or more) practice per week I GUARANTEE he (or she) will improve RAPIDLY, of that I have no doubt.

Also I should mention if I could have had these proper technique points when I was playing in Britain in the late 80's I would have been a much better player and would have likely turned pro. Hell, if I could do these 8 points consistently NOW, I would be a much better player! (I'm working on it but I think it's a little late for me)

Terry

Terry, I really do appreciate all your afforts to help me out, thanks million.

I will work on those techniques during solo pratice and monitor my self.

is there a chance if i videotape my self and post it here for you to see if i am doing the basics correctly? note that i will do my best to get a clear video.


Thanks again

[The Doctor]

I got very interested in the mental side of the game because that same question always came up "why did I play so good yesterday but not so good today"
There is not a simple answer but I found that there were common denominators. On first day your mind was busy with positive "doing" thoughts like trying to have a smooth slow backswing. This thought process helps the conscious mind keep busy and allows the subconscious to do it's job.
Also on the first day you have lower than normal expectation levels(the same as when you have not played for a while and find that you don't play so bad) but on second day you have higher expectation levels because you want to do better than first day(making sense).
Also on second day, when things start to go wrong you start to wonder what you are doing wrong or different to the day before. These are not positive "doing" thought but rather "destructive" thoughts and are the main cause for the poor display.
So the answer is, positive thoughts about what you want to do and playing each shot without comparison to any before will help to perform better and more consistently.

[Giggity1984]

I got very interested in the mental side of the game because that same question always came up "why did I play so good yesterday but not so good today"
There is not a simple answer but I found that there were common denominators. On first day your mind was busy with positive "doing" thoughts like trying to have a smooth slow backswing. This thought process helps the conscious mind keep busy and allows the subconscious to do it's job.
Also on the first day you have lower than normal expectation levels(the same as when you have not played for a while and find that you don't play so bad) but on second day you have higher expectation levels because you want to do better than first day(making sense).
Also on second day, when things start to go wrong you start to wonder what you are doing wrong or different to the day before. These are not positive "doing" thought but rather "destructive" thoughts and are the main cause for the poor display.
So the answer is, positive thoughts about what you want to do and playing each shot without comparison to any before will help to perform better and more consistently.

Great post. Anything new will have this effect too. Be it a new cue, new size tip etc. you're not thinking about anything except "lets see how this feels/plays." Next day it all falls to pieces!

[The Doctor]

Thanks giggity. It is exactly the same reason why these other things work too. I call it the honeymoon period. Lol.

[Giggity1984]

I call it the honeymoon period. Lol.

Doesn't last as long as that though!!!!!! lol