Practice Videos Invaluable

[alabadi]

Hi All

Has anyone took a video of themselves practicing certain routines, and afterwards were shocked at what they saw.

its strange to see unexpected and sometimes bizzare footage of faults in cue action and technique afterwards. some of the things i have noticed i wouldn't have believed until i saw it with my own eyes when i played back the video.

some of the movenments that i couldn't detect and wasn't aware of now have become visible.

it is best playing it back in slow motion because the errors can be seen more easily. the difficulty now is trying to correct the errors and habbits that have become ingrained in the way i play.

has anyone here took videos of themselves and were amazed by what the have seen, it would be nice to hear from those who use video recording during solo practice to self coach and improve performance in a way.

i have detected errors that i am not able to sort out yet, i am keeping a video log of myself every three or four weeks to see if any of the changes i make are working. if anyone has any videos of errors they detected in their play and now have corrected through practice i would appreciate if they could share with us the info.

i will be doing the same too when i have sortied my problems out.

Alabbadi

[tomw]

Hello,
to answer your questions:
yes, I have filmed myself in the past, when there was a time I couldn't pot 3 balls in one visit and I wanted to know what I did wrong;
yes, I was shocked with what I saw (well, the first time anyway);
yes, it made me a better player!

The first thing I noticed was that I didn't keep my head still, although I thought I was.
Furthermore, I saw that my bridge was too long, that I was standing too much backwards.
I made the necessary corrections, and now I KNOW my head is still and my stance is ok. And guess what? Now I can beat anyone and pot anything :-)

[Terry Davidson]

There are some people on here who are totally against coaching and although I don't agree with them they are certainly entitled to their opinions regarding coaching.

I have been advocating on here (many times) that players should video themselves and then use 'Kinovia' to analyse their cueing technique frame-by-frame and in slow motion and Kinovea gives you both those options along with a few more, like drawing reference lines and circles. In this way a player who knows anything at all about technique can at least quickly see where he is going wrong and can try to work out the problems by himself without spending money on coaching.

Where it does get a little tricky and in my opinion where expert coaching advice is needed is when the player cannot get to the root cause of the problems he sees. However, knowing what faults you have and want to correct will provide the coach with a roadmap which is very clear and will (or should) focus his attention on those specific problems and will help him to sort out the root cause and correct the basic problems.

I use video analysis in all my coaching and always offer my students a 'before' and 'after' video if they want it along with a written list of my recommendations.

Terry

[alabadi]

Thanks Terry

I think it was you who told me about Kinovea the first time, i have used it many times, and it is very good especially the drawing tools, i took a video of myself yesterday doing some screwback routines from the blue spot, the cueball about 12 inches bahind and trying to screw the cueball in the opposite pocket.

i was able to pot every OB however the cueball wasn't coming back straight it was coming back to my right, i did get a few come back and drop in the pocket though, i thought that i must be putting some unintentional right hand side.

when i analysed it in slow motion i noticed that my arm pushes the but of the cue out to the right on with the white, this sends the tip to the left. my arm then straightens up. i was suprised that i actually potted the object balls, i guess that the tip deviation didn't cause too much swerve on the cueball because the movement is on the follow throw.

i used the line tool to draw a line on the cue to check that i was cueing straight, i was happy that my alignment was ok, i took around six shots and each time i got down the cue was on the line.

i am not sure what is causing the movement yet, is it grip, shoulder movement or something else. i have saved two of the shots in slow motion about quarter speed and will post them here for anyone to give advice or recommendations

Alabbadi

[Chris Bedford]

Practice Videos Invaluable

What platform is kinovea on?

[Terry Davidson]

alabadi:

Your problem is almost certainly one of two things. The first would be your upper arm (large shoulder muscle) getting involved in the delivery too early - i.e. - dropping the elbow too early in the delivery.

The other factor could be re-gripping the cue with the back 2 fingers too early in the delivery. To eliminate this problem as an experiment, grip your cue right at the end of the butt with the back 2 fingers right off the butt and folded into your palm and then do the video exercise again. If the cue goes straighter then you have at least identified the problem. Getting rid of it using your normal grip however will be (if you experience the same as I did) a real frustrating experience.

I now 'hold' the cue nice and loose with the first 2 fingers and the butt just laying in the bed of those two fingers and with the thumb lightly touching the forefinger and hanging straight down. I keep my back two fingers almost off the butt entirely throughout the delivery and use the first two fingers to stop the cue. Checking on video this is eliminating that right-to-left movement of the tip I had previously although there is still some when I don't do it correctly. (I found gripping with the back two fingers off the cue didn't really suit me as I had too much cue out over the 'V' of the bridge, even when I straightened the bridge arm out).

Give it a try and let us know the results as I would be interested if you are successful and I could use this method as a teaching aid with students who have this very common problem.

Terry

[nrage]

has anyone here took videos of themselves and were amazed by what the have seen, it would be nice to hear from those who use video recording during solo practice to self coach and improve performance in a way.

I have, on Terry's advice. It's amazing what goes on that we're simply unaware of. I haven't done it for a while now and I really should. I have kept all the old footage so I will have something to compare things to.

when i analysed it in slow motion i noticed that my arm pushes the but of the cue out to the right on with the white, this sends the tip to the left. my arm then straightens up. i was suprised that i actually potted the object balls, i guess that the tip deviation didn't cause too much swerve on the cueball because the movement is on the follow throw.

I have seen the same thing in my cue action and have never managed to capture footage of it 'fixed'. Sometimes it moves less, sometimes later, I haven't managed to pin down what factors define it. I think relaxing the grip helped. I think staying down on the shot and still helped. But, I haven't ever caught any footage where the flaw didn't appear at some stage in the delivery.

Partly I think it's a subconscious thing, as in my brain knows my body is where it is and instinctively tries to avoid driving the hand into it and instead tries to go around it.

[alabadi]

What platform is kinovea on?

i am not sure if it will work on a Mac i have windows, the software is freesource so u just download it from there website. its brilliant as mentioned you can replay in slow motion, you can have split screens , synchronise two shots, use drawing tools and comments. also compare tool can compare two different clips.

their new software is out now and has some new features, i'm off to get the newer version and try it out.

download from www.kinovea.org

Alabbadi

[rovnos]

what is the best way to set-up for a self video ?

[alabadi]

alabadi:

The other factor could be re-gripping the cue with the back 2 fingers too early in the delivery. To eliminate this problem as an experiment, grip your cue right at the end of the butt with the back 2 fingers right off the butt and folded into your palm and then do the video exercise again. If the cue goes straighter then you have at least identified the problem. Getting rid of it using your normal grip however will be (if you experience the same as I did) a real frustrating experience.

(I found gripping with the back two fingers off the cue didn't really suit me as I had too much cue out over the 'V' of the bridge, even when I straightened the bridge arm out).

Give it a try and let us know the results as I would be interested if you are successful and I could use this method as a teaching aid with students who have this very common problem.

Terry

Well Terry a little update, yesterday i tried the method leaving the last two fingers off the but, to tell you the truth it was so uncomfortable and i couldn't get to grips with it, forgive the pun

my grip felt too far away from my bridgehand, i stil persavered and to tell the truth the same results as before, i could pot the OB but the cueball returned to my right, which suggested to me the same thing was happening. i didn't get an opportuninty to take any video footage but will try and get some nest time.

I did try the method from one of Nic Barrows training videos, i gripped the cue with the tip of my forefinger and thumb only, i tried a few screw shots from the blue spot, i had better success in terms that the cueball returned straighter. i still felt uncomfortable but i felt that i am getting somewhere, i am under the conclusion that it has something to do with my grip, and the sooner i can sort it my game will improve for sure.

i will update with any more findings as soon as i get them

[Particle Physics]

There are some people on here who are totally against coaching and although I don't agree with them they are certainly entitled to their opinions regarding coaching.

I have been advocating on here (many times) that players should video themselves and then use 'Kinovia' to analyse their cueing technique frame-by-frame and in slow motion and Kinovea gives you both those options along with a few more, like drawing reference lines and circles. In this way a player who knows anything at all about technique can at least quickly see where he is going wrong and can try to work out the problems by himself without spending money on coaching.

Where it does get a little tricky and in my opinion where expert coaching advice is needed is when the player cannot get to the root cause of the problems he sees. However, knowing what faults you have and want to correct will provide the coach with a roadmap which is very clear and will (or should) focus his attention on those specific problems and will help him to sort out the root cause and correct the basic problems.

I use video analysis in all my coaching and always offer my students a 'before' and 'after' video if they want it along with a written list of my recommendations.

Terry

There are folk on TSF who are against coaching? You are joking?! I suppose they don't advocate that magic 92 clearance by ROS at the worlds then, you know, the coach assisted one? The greatest players of all time have had coaches. Goodness.

I think I'll have to do some video somehow, it's gonna look a bit odd having a camera set up in a public club, but stuff it, if it can remove faults in my game, I'm up for it.

[alabadi]

I think I'll have to do some video somehow, it's gonna look a bit odd having a camera set up in a public club, but stuff it, if it can remove faults in my game, I'm up for it.

It is a bit, especially where I practice it's not a coaching club, just your regular club where everyone not very keen on practicing, I don't use a camcorder I use my iPhone a bit more discreet . Most don't realise I am filmIng. The ones who do sometimes can be nosey, and keep watching which is off putting , but I don't care really if it helps me impove I'm not bothered .

Alabbadi

[alabadi]

I think I'll have to do some video somehow, it's gonna look a bit odd having a camera set up in a public club, but stuff it, if it can remove faults in my game, I'm up for it.

It is a bit, especially where I practice it's not a coaching club, just your regular club where everyone not very keen on practicing, I don't use a camcorder I use my iPhone a bit more discreet . Most don't realise I am filmIng. The ones who do sometimes can be nosey, and keep watching which is off putting , but I don't care really if it helps me impove I'm not bothered .

Alabbadi

[nrage]

It is a bit, especially where I practice it's not a coaching club, just your regular club where everyone not very keen on practicing, I don't use a camcorder I use my iPhone a bit more discreet . Most don't realise I am filmIng. The ones who do sometimes can be nosey, and keep watching which is off putting , but I don't care really if it helps me impove I'm not bothered

I use my HTC desire and one of these:
http://joby.com/

Looks like they have newer mobile attachments now too

I find the joby great because it wasn't expensive, and I can mount it securely right over a pocket, or often attach it to furniture behind or to the side of me, stairs are really good but any railing or fixture which I can bend the joby legs around works a treat.