Straighter cueing without dropping elbow

[Sam_92]

Recently I have been playing quite inconsistent and unable to cue as straight as I would like.
I usually 'drive' the cue through the ball dropping my elbow quite a lot but over the last two days I have tried stopping myself from doing it and have noticed pretty interesting results.

I usually average 14/21 long straight blues when dropping my elbow.
Without dropping I get an average 18/21.

I have been taught that dropping the elbow should help cue straighter and improve timing, but over the last two days this is not the case.

Also I can now cue straight up and down the spots with screw for around 4 lengths of the table dead straight, where as when dropping my elbow I was getting a slight trace of left hand side.

Just wondering if anyone could try figure out why this is the case or am I just really strange?

Regards.

[paulperks]

i think after we have the basics . we then adopt are own style of play that works best for us . just look at some of the players like Joe swail or Dave Harold . there style works for them . so don't get to hung up on it as we are all different

[Monsoon]

Could'nt agree more go with what works for u. Confidence is key, if by not dropping elbow you are more confident then this will lead to being more relaxed which in turn makes you more positive on your shots. Once you have the basics and ability confidence is a huge percentage of playing well and knocking in bigger breaks.

[Sidd]

Sam: Well there is nothing strange about you this is indeed a funny game that we play. things of that sort happen to us all the time. on shots requiring longer follow through to add more spin the elbow has to drop in order to keep the cue inline and there is no question about it. However, while droping the elbow one might not be droping it straight down and hence putting that extra side on the CB and if you are putting left hand side you must be a right handed player, as this is what happens: putting unintentional side on the CB happens to us all; if you are putting unintentional left hand side then this means that your cue butt is moving to the right hand side and hence resulting in the left hand side on the CB and right handed players while playing would at times end their delivery a fraction away from the hip as intended and result in putting that left hand side because in ending further from the hip you take the cue butt to the right and result in left hand side. Keep practicing slowly and very slowly and then gradually put more pace on shots until the accidental side is removed... while dropping elbow one sometimes does not drop it straight enough and hence encouraging accidental side however if the elbow drop happens after the tip makes contact iwth CB and that is ideally how it should happen then the elbow dropping a fraction not straighter should not matter any way...

But in the end if playing without the elbow drop is working fine for you; so be it... why worry on a thing if something is working fine for you... I have seen a player who can make breaks of 80 and 70 and he stands with both legs bent (he has a back problem so cant have a straight leg) but since he had to bend them both he trained his brain to provide his body his required stability with both legs bent... each player has a different body type and hence things would be different for different people; look at the pros and compare them they all play differently due to being different... we cant be textbook copies when it comes to technique-- the rule is comfort and feel...!!!

I also play with a severe elbow drop at the end of delivery even though I would like to reduce my elbow drop but then its not easy one has to work hard to change a habit in snooker...

[vmax4steve]

Recently I have been playing quite inconsistent and unable to cue as straight as I would like.
I usually 'drive' the cue through the ball dropping my elbow quite a lot but over the last two days I have tried stopping myself from doing it and have noticed pretty interesting results.

I usually average 14/21 long straight blues when dropping my elbow.
Without dropping I get an average 18/21.

I have been taught that dropping the elbow should help cue straighter and improve timing, but over the last two days this is not the case.

Also I can now cue straight up and down the spots with screw for around 4 lengths of the table dead straight, where as when dropping my elbow I was getting a slight trace of left hand side.

Just wondering if anyone could try figure out why this is the case or am I just really strange?

Regards.

This is how Steve Davis, Jimmy White and Stephen Hendry used to play when they were young. Check out some old video on youtube and see just how good they were then compared to how they are now. IMO that's the way to play as very few people will have an action that keeps the cue straight when the shoulder joint is part of the cue action. Play with the elbow joint only, open the hand on the backswing to keep the cue level, and the shoulder will drop after the cue ball has been struck as a result of the forward momentum of the action when playing power shots.

You will see a lot of pros dropping their elbows when playing but if you have the capability to slow down some video footage of them you will see that most, if not all, drop the elbow after the cue ball has been struck and for a lot of amateurs to try to incorporate this into ones own action results in bringing the shoulder into the shot before the cue ball has been struck which in 99% of cases will result in the shot being missed.

www.youtube.com/watch?v=ysgJHBSoEMc

[nrage]

I'm with vmax on this one. It's clear you're playing better with less/no elbow drop, so keep it up (pun intended).

[pottr]

Just put the bloody cue through the ball and keep still. The straighter the better

Don't worry about your elbow dropping, whether or not your shoes are tied too tightly or whether Venus is in line with the Sun.

The results you achieve on the table will determine if your technique is sound. I'm yet to see a snooker textbook pick up a cue and start knocking balls in.

I assume 92 is the year of your birth? If so, you're young enough so just find the time keep practising and you'll improve.

[Sam_92]

Sam: Well there is nothing strange about you this is indeed a funny game that we play. things of that sort happen to us all the time. on shots requiring longer follow through to add more spin the elbow has to drop in order to keep the cue inline and there is no question about it. However, while droping the elbow one might not be droping it straight down and hence putting that extra side on the CB and if you are putting left hand side you must be a right handed player, as this is what happens: putting unintentional side on the CB happens to us all; if you are putting unintentional left hand side then this means that your cue butt is moving to the right hand side and hence resulting in the left hand side on the CB and right handed players while playing would at times end their delivery a fraction away from the hip as intended and result in putting that left hand side because in ending further from the hip you take the cue butt to the right and result in left hand side. Keep practicing slowly and very slowly and then gradually put more pace on shots until the accidental side is removed... while dropping elbow one sometimes does not drop it straight enough and hence encouraging accidental side however if the elbow drop happens after the tip makes contact iwth CB and that is ideally how it should happen then the elbow dropping a fraction not straighter should not matter any way...

But in the end if playing without the elbow drop is working fine for you; so be it... why worry on a thing if something is working fine for you... I have seen a player who can make breaks of 80 and 70 and he stands with both legs bent (he has a back problem so cant have a straight leg) but since he had to bend them both he trained his brain to provide his body his required stability with both legs bent... each player has a different body type and hence things would be different for different people; look at the pros and compare them they all play differently due to being different... we cant be textbook copies when it comes to technique-- the rule is comfort and feel...!!!

I also play with a severe elbow drop at the end of delivery even though I would like to reduce my elbow drop but then its not easy one has to work hard to change a habit in snooker...

I think you are spot on here, I think that my elbow mustn't have been dropping straight down which is good to know so I could improve it if I ever wanted to start doing it again

I used to play a fair bit and have had a couple of centuries but I took a couple of years off and am just getting back into it. I just want to get back to a decent level of play again

Thanks everyone for the help, if I make any progress or fix the elbow drop I will post back in here

[throtts]

Just put the bloody cue through the ball and keep still. The straighter the better

Don't worry about your elbow dropping, whether or not your shoes are tied too tightly or whether Venus is in line with the Sun.

The results you achieve on the table will determine if your technique is sound. I'm yet to see a snooker textbook pick up a cue and start knocking balls in.

I assume 92 is the year of your birth? If so, you're young enough so just find the time keep practising and you'll improve.

I agree, however, these guys do not have there own tables like me and you ( yourself does ? ). I found since ownership of my table the only way to become decent is to put in some serious hours, too the point where it feels like a job / mission.

The biggest thing that changed my game for the better was,,, yes, THE GRIP, a nice super loose one. It developed my rear pause and my cue push through of the cue ball, if the stick does not go through then you can forget positional play.

When I was playing snooker on an off over many years once every 8 9 10 days down the club it was just basically not enough to improve.

I have had my table 8 month now and practised hard. I just had a 2 week break and went straight back playing well. The first thing I noticed when I went down on the first shots was the loose grip, it was as though I had not lost what I had stamped in to myself. I can really see now how the good pros get as good as they get, before I had my table I thought how on earth do they get that good, but now I can well see it. It's hours on the table, pure and simple.

Good luck guys.

Edit add: For the record my typical practise week in the first 6 month having my own table amounted to around 21 hours a week, now do the math to work out how much that would cost one down his club to reach a decent standard. Got to be around £100 on average.?...

[CoachGavin]

Also agree with vmax and nrage. Lots of amateurs see ronnie o sullivan drop his elbow and try to copy but they do it too early or too severe causing problems with straight cueing. The less moving parts the more accurate you will probably be so as long as you get through the white properly you don't need a big elbow drop. Both robertson and trump,arguably the best two long potters at the moment, keep their elbows up.

[pottr]

Having your own table certainly helps to get the arm going a bit quicker. You're spot on, with regular practice you play far more consistent.

I do believe that unless you're a complete beginner, incorporating subtle nuances into your technique will do more harm than good. As you have your own table Throtts you are one of the few exceptions to that rule.

[throtts]

Having your own table certainly helps to get the arm going a bit quicker. You're spot on, with regular practice you play far more consistent.

I do believe that unless you're a complete beginner, incorporating subtle nuances into your technique will do more harm than good.

I totally, agree, pott. I think alot of players waste so many hours f**ting about.

I remember watching Ronnie on a youtube clip clearing the table in a practice session. Of course he is a great player, obviously, but, he cleaned up while chatting to his mate. It all looked so natural and relaxing.

I remember what our Terry stated on here, you must be comfortable down on the shot.

[Sidd]

Also agree with vmax and nrage. Lots of amateurs see ronnie o sullivan drop his elbow and try to copy but they do it too early or too severe causing problems with straight cueing. The less moving parts the more accurate you will probably be so as long as you get through the white properly you don't need a big elbow drop. Both robertson and trump,arguably the best two long potters at the moment, keep their elbows up.

Coach Gavin: I did not think this was my problem but now I am thinking you have pointed out something in this comment that I am suffering from- i have posted it in detail in another new thread- please if you have time kindly do comment on that- id be really thankful

[Sidd]

This is how Steve Davis, Jimmy White and Stephen Hendry used to play when they were young. Check out some old video on youtube and see just how good they were then compared to how they are now. IMO that's the way to play as very few people will have an action that keeps the cue straight when the shoulder joint is part of the cue action. Play with the elbow joint only, open the hand on the backswing to keep the cue level, and the shoulder will drop after the cue ball has been struck as a result of the forward momentum of the action when playing power shots.

You will see a lot of pros dropping their elbows when playing but if you have the capability to slow down some video footage of them you will see that most, if not all, drop the elbow after the cue ball has been struck and for a lot of amateurs to try to incorporate this into ones own action results in bringing the shoulder into the shot before the cue ball has been struck which in 99% of cases will result in the shot being missed.

www.youtube.com/watch?v=ysgJHBSoEMc

Excellent post bro. I did not realise but I guess I am suffering from this.. Kindly comment in detail on this on my new thread where i have explained the exact problem of mine in complete detail...Thanks

[armstm]

It's clear to me from listening to ronnie that his style is not natural at all but the result of carefully copying Davis.