New ideas... to try or not to try

[hotpot]

I also believe the grip is one of if not the most important aspect of all . For me when my grip feels right the rest of my game falls into place and i feel in control of the cue and my thoughts , when this happens i expect to pot nearly everything instead of hoping to pot balls and having negative thoughts on the shot .

[throtts]

I agree with all of you guys.

Sidd, on the baby sitter reds you are feeling pressure purely on immense expectation to pot these because you have probably done all the hard work up till you see these baby sitters, be it a colour or red. When I first started putting in the hours I use to do this all too often. Now if I get these easy pots after pulling the cue ball back to prime position I take a few extra seconds out just to recompose, the same I would do with a tricky pot to keep the break going. As I say, your probably coming across them when your getting a decent break and then feel the pressure because its such an easy pot. All to do with what's in someone's head, really is.

Example, when I played snooker years ago I had the same practice partner for many years which we use to play matchplay snooker against each other. In all the sessions we had, which must have been a good 400 matches at least, he won about 3 sessions. Our standard did not much differ its just I become use to of beating him and he was not use to of beating me and when he had a lot of chances to nail me he did not, due to this pressure thing and what's going on in his head. At those times he simply wanted it toooo bad which effected his cueing without him knowing it. In the end I was giving him a 25 start but it still didn't work good for him.

So judging by your passion for the game, maybe just sometimes your trying too hard, and yes, a lot of us too on here.

[ace man]

And yet they have controlled the cue ball and cued straight to make that 60+ before the shot they have finally missed...

Have they controlled anything? We don't know this for a fact. There may have been a few fluked positions in that best break of theirs, lucky cannons maybe, questionable shot choices, remarkable super tough recovery shots...etc. In fact, I'm sure there were. If there wasn't any luck involved I'd be very surprised.

[vmax4steve]

Have they controlled anything? We don't know this for a fact. There may have been a few fluked positions in that best break of theirs, lucky cannons maybe, questionable shot choices, remarkable super tough recovery shots...etc. In fact, I'm sure there were. If there wasn't any luck involved I'd be very surprised.

We are talking regular 50+ makers aceman, and I include myself among them. I have a highest match break of 86, highest practise break was an uncounted total clearance and I have countless 50+ breaks that I have fallen down on. My technique is sound enough, I find the game incredibly easy when in the zone but don't have the concentration to find the zone at will, and lose the zone after just a few minutes.
Just a momentary lapse is all it takes, just that split second when I take my eye off the pot. I don't believe for one moment that I could play as well as I do sometimes if my technique wasn't good.
Of course shot choice comes into it at times, of course I can also make great pots to keep breaks going, of course I get lucky now and again and get unlucky as well as everyone does but my own experience and those of my friends who are about the same level as me tells me that the difference between me and the best players is that they do not miss the easy ones as often as I do.
That's the middle and both ends of it as far as I'm concerned.
When I watch a pro make a century break I can see that all the pots he makes are ones that I can make just as easily and yet I don't string them together like he does because I am capable of missing anything no matter how easy it is simply because I don't do the basics 90% of the time like he does, I only do them 40% of the time intermittantly and that's what I and others of my level have to work on first before tinkering with technique and rushing off to a coach.
Get the fundamentals together and keep them together as often as you can.

[throtts]

When I watch a pro make a century break I can see that all the pots he makes are ones that I can make just as easily and yet I don't string them together like he does because I am capable of missing anything no matter how easy it is simply because I don't do the basics 90% of the time like he does, I only do them 40% of the time intermittantly and that's what I and others of my level have to work on first before tinkering with technique and rushing off to a coach.
Get the fundamentals together and keep them together as often as you can.

That is so true, I think its the "in zone" concentration factor. Maybe thats the reason why you see the same faces in the final stages at most majors.

[pottr]

True dear Pottr. But not only that, with me, what happens is that once in the balls and having scored 27 being on a baby three quarter red that needs a nice smooth stun for the black.... and I would visualise, aim, stand behind, calmly do down, feather, front pause, nice and slow back swing, final back pause, smooth delivery, grip hand to the chest, follow through and .... MISS is that even possible well for me it has been so ! I just cant get to know what caused me to miss such a baby sitter.

The problem I think you have Sidd is that your technique is probably better than you realise. You're getting in the balls and missing and you assume it's your technique. Then you make the leap to your laptop and start expanding on a missed pot which is most likely down to a lapse in concentration.

It happens to every player, myself included and only my experience through hours of practice has led me to minimise missing simple ones when in the balls... I still do it though!

Grip, stance, aiming... It really does not matter. You are not going to become the player who clears the entire table every other day. No offense, but you're just not young enough to make the leap.

You've knocked in the odd 50+ which means if you get out of your own way there is the possibility that you could crack three figures...

I hope I'm wrong, but I don't think you will anytime soon as you place too much emphasis on advice you recieve from this forum about your technique (WHICH NONE OF US HAVE FCKING SEEN!)

Gavin is right. When you play frames, don't think about your technique at all. No point.

[pottr]

That is so true, I think its the "in zone" concentration factor. Maybe thats the reason why you see the same faces in the final stages at most majors.

That's what I tell everyone. The most important factor in my snooker game is my stress level from that day's business prior to me picking my cue up.

We are all human.

[Sidd]

The problem I think you have Sidd is that your technique is probably better than you realise. You're getting in the balls and missing and you assume it's your technique. Then you make the leap to your laptop and start expanding on a missed pot which is most likely down to a lapse in concentration.

It happens to every player, myself included and only my experience through hours of practice has led me to minimise missing simple ones when in the balls... I still do it though!

Grip, stance, aiming... It really does not matter. You are not going to become the player who clears the entire table every other day. No offense, but you're just not young enough to make the leap.

You've knocked in the odd 50+ which means if you get out of your own way there is the possibility that you could crack three figures...

I hope I'm wrong, but I don't think you will anytime soon as you place too much emphasis on advice you recieve from this forum about your technique (WHICH NONE OF US HAVE FCKING SEEN!)

Gavin is right. When you play frames, don't think about your technique at all. No point.

Excellent post dear Pottr. You are spot on. I am writing a detailed response on all comments in responding to all and sharing what I just learnt yesterday.

[Sidd]

OK guys after days and weeks and months of tinkering I have learnt something and have learnt it for good.

Needed a BREAK so got a BREAK ... did 59 with clearance...
There weren't any more reds of else I might have beaten my 67.

How did that happen all of a sudden? Well I read all your posts here and went to the club last night only thinking one thing, as per Vmax's comments and advice, "Eyes on the contact point on the object ball" and it suddenly did the trick. I made 59 even without being in the zone and I know it. When I started playing a session; race to 5 I kept reciting in my mind a short version of the advice EOB I call it- so I kept saing to myself EOB EOB and even when playing the shot kept reminding myself EOB... Although I lost the session but came home satisfied and relax and happy. I did this on intention as this discussion here on this thread was taking a turn which, for me, had to be learnt through experiment. So I told myself (just to check and confirm if Vmax's theory was right) that I WILL NOT do anything but only EOB- no matter what happens.

All I did yesterday was EOB all the time and still felt that I was not looking at EOB contact point and in thin air on some shots that I missed. This means that even if one keeps concentrating on EOB one is destined to look in thin air (Vmax would truly understand what I mean here) it happens as Pottr says we are all humans. However, with every chance in hand I did 27 or 34 or 41 and finally a clearance of 59 i.e. I WAS CONSISTENT.

The point has been proven to me now. After all this trial and error. Terry's advice and following it religiously had turned my technique really proper but I was just lacking confidence in myself and Vmax's EOB did that for me. I am now a MATURE player if not BETTER

I will tell you 3 things I learnt...

1. I won a frame by a lead of 60. Well I realised that whenever I was in for potting I was doing my EOB thing but while opting for a snooker or safety I took it lightly and really wasn't doing EOB on those easy safety shots and giving away chances to the opponent. So I did EOB even on easiest baby safeties and put my mate in real real trouble. The result; he started giving me chances and I started capitalizing on them

2. There is a very thin line that differentiates confidence and over-confidence in snooker. I missed a few baby shots again but this time I realised that at 37 my confidence is really good and I dont seem to think that I would miss and only at that point I missed- why? Because I thought I am potting balls and made 37 so the nest baby red is a piece of cake and at that point I looked in thin air even doing EOB that is the secret I was after..... It is indeed lapse of concentration. You can even loose EOB concentration if faced with a very easy pot... In snooker nothing can be taken for granted.

3. While doing EOB perfectly I noticed that my grip, stance, elbow drop, timing, back swing, delivery everything sort of FOLLOWED me rather than me following them big lesson learnt.

Pottr: You are right, my technique isnt that bad at all; I just wasnt trusting it but EOB taught me. Yes lets face the facts, I am not getting younger but older and if chances permit i might get a to triple figures hopefully and InshAllah... Finally I know I am not young enough to make that leap but dude this doesn't matter to me ... ... what matters to me now is Am I passionate enough to make that leap ? I will keep trying and trying and hopefully would one day before I die or become old enough not to be able to play make it happen for me- YES My Passion Would Defy my Age lets see...

Gavin: Terry has been saying this to me and must have said it a million times; concentration on pot n position in matches and technique in solo but I was too deeply in to thinking that my technique was bad that I kept unconsciously working on it in matches ... While doing EOB I couldn't think on technique and realised that it wasn't bad at all... in fact Terry had made my technique really solid... I do have glitches here and there and shall correct them in solo.

One more thing that I am happy to have now is that now for as long as I have EOB I am not scared of elbow drop follow through feathers grip stance bridge etc.... Yes I did one small technique thing apart from EOB (let me admit) and it was to try and keep myself still on the shot and keep my head without movement...!

Thanks to all of you out there in general and to Terry (master coach) and Vmax (master psychologist) in particular.

I now have my path clear in mind and it is EOB and getting the fundamentals right together all the time.

[pottr]

Pottr: You are right, my technique isnt that bad at all; I just wasnt trusting it but EOB taught me. Yes lets face the facts, I am not getting younger but older and if chances permit i might get a to triple figures hopefully and InshAllah... Finally I know I am not young enough to make that leap but dude this doesn't matter to me ... ... what matters to me now is Am I passionate enough to make that leap ? I will keep trying and trying and hopefully would one day before I die or become old enough not to be able to play make it happen for me- YES My Passion Would Defy my Age lets see...

Hope it doesn't come across that I was trying to knock you mate. I love snooker, I would watch anyone play and cheer them on. Can't help but offer tips on everything to do with the game.

I think your scores in one session last night shows that you are capable of producing. Which was my main point, don't worry about your technique so much. Just work on switching on your mood. Results will follow.

[Sidd]

Hope it doesn't come across that I was trying to knock you mate. I love snooker, I would watch anyone play and cheer them on. Can't help but offer tips on everything to do with the game.

I think your scores in one session last night shows that you are capable of producing. Which was my main point, don't worry about your technique so much. Just work on switching on your mood. Results will follow.

Hey no no mate; not at all... I literally got your point as soon as I read it. All I said was out of sheer excitement and joy and my passion for the game; not due to feeling offended or any of such like crap

All you guys out here are my energy...!!!

Happy snookering!!!

[vmax4steve]

Hope you stick with it Sidd and I also hope that others on this forum take your lead and learn to stop tinkering.
What pottr and I and many others try to put across is that the fundamentals of snooker are very simple, but carrying them out is very, very difficult and it is so easy to get sidetracked into doing something totally unneccessary.

The single most important thing in snooker is to look at the target at the moment of striking the cue ball, and that target is the contact point on the object ball.

It's this that keeps your head still at that crucial moment, it's this that keeps your cue on the line of the shot, it's this that gives you a good follow through. Even though I know this myself and I have been aware of it for years now I still can't do it on a conscious level, I have to relax and just let it happen naturally. Just had a hours line up practise as I have a match tonight and for half an hour I wasn't doing it and played crap but then it clicked and I cleared the line up in about five minutes and made several other good runs as well.
I have given a great deal of thought as to what it is that makes me take my eye off the pot so often and play so badly. It ain't pressure because in solo practise I do it all the bloody time yet in close tense matches I always seem to play well.
I have noticed that it's not because I'm looking at the pocket or the cue ball or another ball I need to cannon, even though that can happen. The majority of the time when I take my eye off the pot I find myself simply staring at nothing at all, just like I used to in school when the teacher was droning on about something I couldn't care less about. That's why I miss so many easy balls I guess but I'm damned if I can do anything about it.

[tommygunner1309]

For me, Frank Callan is the master. He says in his book "If your left eye is the master eye you want your left eye over the ball when you go down to sight the shot.............................If the eye which is doing the sighting is not directly over the cue, you will have a strong tendency to hit across the ball........................" then "So if you want to direct the cue ball to the correct spot on the object ball you have to have your eyes on that spot on the object ball when you HIT the cue ball" and later "Meanwhile, never forget; eyes on the object ball when striking the cue ball"
Anyone found anything different to this? How does it actually work for you? or does anyone disagree with what has been written?

[vmax4steve]

For me, Frank Callan is the master. He says in his book "If your left eye is the master eye you want your left eye over the ball when you go down to sight the shot.............................If the eye which is doing the sighting is not directly over the cue, you will have a strong tendency to hit across the ball........................" then

I have great difficulty understanding those who do have a dominant eye putting the cue under their other eye or between their eyes when sighting at snooker. Surely the dominant eye is in charge and the subconscious makes this happen naturally without having to think about it.

[DG GIBERT]

I have great difficulty understanding those who do have a dominant eye putting the cue under their other eye or between their eyes when sighting at snooker. Surely the dominant eye is in charge and the subconscious makes this happen naturally without having to think about it.

I agree. tried this the other night then thought nahh it has to be natural

Im sure no left or right sighted player made the conscious decision to move their chin accordingly.

I notice that not many coaches mention this so perhaps natural is best