"Scooping the ball"

[narl]

I do this occasionally when playing a screw shot (usually sent the white flying across the room if its a power shot) and I'm not entirely sure what I'm doing wrong, if its the angle of the cue or if I'm stabbing at the ball. 9/10 I can play a screw shot fine, just seems occasionally I'll jump the white for no reason. prefer to get to the bottom of it (pardon the pun) sharpish as the tables in my local have been recovered with Strachan tournament cloth and I don't want to be taking lumps out of it.



I usually hold my cue about an inch or so from the end (57" cue), and when playing the shot I'm sure I have the bridge lowered and the cue pretty parallel to the table. I find it hard to remember to open an close the grip while addressing the ball so usually I keep a loose grip on the butt, I think because of that the cues travelling slightly upwards on the backswing and creating a scooping motion as I drive it forwards.

Any routines to snap out of this habit? I think if I could concentrate more on the grip id almost eliminate this altogether.

[nrage]

A scooping cue action is often blamed for this, but it's not the actual root cause. The actual root cause is striking the white too low. The cause of that is inaccuracy. The cause of that is an inconsistent cue action, one variety of which is an action with a dynamic movement. One of those is a scoop

So... If you're fine 9/10 times then what makes that 1/10th time different? More power/effort? Typically it's trying to add power which alters where you strike or how you strike or adds upper body movement. Also not going through the ball and trying to stop on the shot adds movement.

The best way to figure it out is to catch it on camera, so get down to the club with a camera and if possible find a ratty table, and just play screw shots till it happens. Get on a PC and download kinovea (which is FREE) and analyse the shot in slow motion. Upload to youtube for opinions, upload to dropbox so others can analyse with kinovea in case they can spot something, etc.

[vmax4steve]

The root cause of 90% of miscues is tightening the grip before the cue ball has been struck due to a snatchy action trying to generate speed in the cue from the get go instead of smoothly accelerating so that maximum speed of the cue is reached at the moment of the strike.
Contact is made with the cloth before the cue ball causing a miscue or the ball is not struck low enough so the screw effect is poor. This snatch when using power is very common, I do it myself often, the trick is to lengthen the backswing according to the power you are using, ie: maximum power cue tip all the way back to your thumb then smoothly accelerate through the cue ball without tightening the grip.

[throtts]

I say its movement due to giving it more power. If I am playing a power screw I raise the tip a mm or so because I know I am going to put my cue right through the white. By the time the cue ball leaves the tip I bet my tip is at the lower 6 o clock range.

[Sidd]

If you are keeping the cue level to the table lowering the bridge then ideally the CB should not jump off... the only reason for it could be scoop.. Perhaps you are cueing level but as you say you do not open the grip on backswing then it means you are raising the butt and hence resultantly scooping. You may not know this but it might be happening.

This coupled with what Steve said might be the reason. Grip might also be tightening... but the grip has to open (back fingers) or else it is destined to raise the butt... you might not know but you may well be scooping.

Try to use this method and practice as that really helps... hold the cue in the tips of the thumb and first finger only not touching the cue with anything else but these two points then take a few screw shots and your concept of the screw will change all together. Then keeping this in mind take a few screw shots and add fingers i.e. full grip.... last not the least the grip needs to open to keep the cue level....thats it!

[Terry Davidson]

As has been said by vmax, you are tightening your grip too early in order to accelerate the cue more rapidly and this results in the tip going too low on the cueball.

Also, throtts has it right too...in using high power most players will not only tighten the grip too tight and too soon but this will also inject upper body movement during the delivery which results in the butt of the cue going off-line so of course the tip goes off-line too.

The grip should not tighten AT ALL until AFTER the cueball has been struck. The best way to achieve this is to use an extremely long backswing during solo practice since the amount of power imparted to the cueball is directly proportional to the length of backswing during a power shot. A short backswing will force the player to tighten the grip unconsciously in order to get the acceleration he wants and this will automatically bring in body movement.

If you can control it, a longer backswing for all shots (like Mark Selby, or Ronnie, or Higgins, or Murphy, etc., etc.,) is always the best way to go but unfortunately a lot of players cannot control a very long backswing and keep it absolutely straight.

Terry

[ace man]

Of all things mentioned, maybe it is worth reviewing the bridge length. Robertson and Trump are greatest screw shot players of today, watch their videos. Notice that they don't use a very long bridge and that even their longest backswing isn't that long at all. Their actions are definitely much simpler than those of Ronnie, Higgins, Murphy...etc.
I think Robertson in particular will last very very long time at the top of snooker rankings. Watching him play it seems to me that nothing can go wrong with his cue action.