Terry's Technique Video

[j6uk]

Yes and to keep your body on balance are the three point contacts like in snooker and the bridge hand is the arm you cup the remaining darts in, cupping them, keeping them close to the core of the body.

I played darts to a decent level and as with snooker there is a basic way to throw a dart, a good dart is thrown from the elbow not the arm, just the forearm moves and it must be brought back in a straight line, once released the elbow comes up to meet the hand to maintain the correct height of the hand,(a very bad fault in poor players is the hand comes down to the elbow which results in a snatch, or the shoulder comes in to try and throw it higher)after that its when you release it for height,but it's the same throw for every shot, now you can see pros with all type of throwing actions, but(and here's the thing that's the same as a cue action)when the pressure is on it can go horribly wrong for them, they tend to be streaky players, when its all going well they can beat anyone, but they can't get it back, if its slightly off, as they don't have the basic technique ,the less moving parts the less that can go wrong, was my moto for my darts and it holds true with snooker, if everything is in line,and it's just the forearm moving, less to go wrong, after that its just the pace of the shot but its the same cue action for every shot. Easier said than done mind.

[itsnoteasy]

Hi Terry

i think the solution as Chris, Steve and others have mentioned is keeping things in a straight line. i made a video like yours and played it back i was surprised that actually my elbow chin and nose were on the line of aim. my nose was very slightly left, not as much as yours, you have the line under your left eye ( see video below), however i still do something similar to you, i.e i push the cue right to left before correcting it eventually. its like a wiggle. where yours stays left of the line of aim mine moves left then back again.

i think i have mentioned this to you previously. so i haven't been able to get rid of it yet. i did notice though my elbow does drop dramatically on every shot, so this is my next task to keep my elbow steady

well it something to work on for me over the coming weeks, my coach up until now has not bothered at all with anything to do with my approach to the shot so hopefully he will soon, i don't want to tell him what to do he should be spotting any errors and telling me.

i am including a snap shot of your video with key images for you to see that when you are up your nose is on the line of the shot but you get down to the right of it.



http://youtu.be/10UqZ3MtJco

Nice vid Alabadi, opens up the dominant eye issue again.

[Sidd]

Ok guys seems Terry has sorted his problem out. He will get to stopping the elbow drop im sure of it.

I have the same issue, apart from other problems. Any ideas for how not to let the elbow drop cuz when I practice I can think abt it and stop it from dropping bit when at the match table I drop it and my potting goes bad. Cant control it...

Ideas as to how one should stop dropping the elbow on slow n medium shots ???

[Terry Davidson]

Sidd:

I know you get few opportunities for solo practice whereas here at my facility that is all I get. You need to practice not dropping the elbow during solo practice if you can and keep practcing it until it becomes ingrained in your delivery.

The way I'm doing it is I consciously try and keep the elbow up as far as I comfortably can and then when I'm doing my backswing and delivery I place all my concentration on my grip hand and really just try and deliver it straight into the chest and keeping the elbow as a hinge. I will be looking at the object ball as per normal but my brain is focused on my grip hand.

Terry

[j6uk]

On the contrary, I focus/look to letting the cue do the work from the elbow and the 'so called grip' is a neutral support, simply opening then closing on shot completion. enjoy

Sidd:

I will be looking at the object ball as per normal but my brain is focused on my grip hand.

Terry

[Terry Davidson]

Sidd:

It may be helpful if you think of the grip as a cradle to hold the cue and just concentrate on bringing the forearm into the shot working off the elbow as a fulcrum. Don't worry as the cradle will tighten near the end of the delivery automatically.

I've found there is no loss of power or cueball action when I don't drop the elbow and I think the only reason to drop the elbow is at the very end of the delivery during a very high power shot where the weight of the cue with higher acceleration is carrying the cue to the end and then the follow-through will be a bit more and it's necessary to drop the elbow to keep the cue on a level plane.

In watching the recent tournament I noticed the pros almost never drop their elbow and that includes Ronnie. In the very last frame he tried to play and very powerful black and missed it and I noticed on that shot he did drop his elbow so perhaps even someone at his level who has been dropping his elbow all his career does get a little less accuracy from both the hard acceleration and maybe dropping the elbow prematurely.

I had always thought Ronnie dropped his elbow on most shots and perhaps he used to (I haven't checked out any older videos) but it appears he is now limiting that drop.

Terry

[vmax4steve]

Ideas as to how one should stop dropping the elbow on slow n medium shots ???

Looking at the video you posted Sidd, you already have an address position of less than 90 degrees of vertical at the elbow. That's fine as long as the grip hand is not completely closed at that point. The grip should still be slightly open at the address position and should close completely about a balls width after the cue ball has been struck.

Get this right and then you can concentrate on the opening and closing of the grip, in conjunction with swinging the forearm from the hinge of the elbow joint, controlling the forwards and backwards movement of the cue so that it feels like it's your hand that moves the cue and not your arm, which is of course attached to your body at the shoulder, so feeling the arm moving the cue will tend to bring the shoulder into the cue action.

The stroke ends when the hand closes and the momentum of the stroke gives you a natural follow through, so on medium and gentle shots the shoulder will not come into the stroke at all, but beware of closing the grip too soon and gripping too tightly on power strokes as this will automatically stop the stroke short, negate the natural follow through and bring the shoulder into the shot and give upper body movement.

[Sidd]

Sidd:

It may be helpful if you think of the grip as a cradle to hold the cue and just concentrate on bringing the forearm into the shot working off the elbow as a fulcrum. Don't worry as the cradle will tighten near the end of the delivery automatically.

I've found there is no loss of power or cueball action when I don't drop the elbow and I think the only reason to drop the elbow is at the very end of the delivery during a very high power shot where the weight of the cue with higher acceleration is carrying the cue to the end and then the follow-through will be a bit more and it's necessary to drop the elbow to keep the cue on a level plane.

In watching the recent tournament I noticed the pros almost never drop their elbow and that includes Ronnie. In the very last frame he tried to play and very powerful black and missed it and I noticed on that shot he did drop his elbow so perhaps even someone at his level who has been dropping his elbow all his career does get a little less accuracy from both the hard acceleration and maybe dropping the elbow prematurely.

I had always thought Ronnie dropped his elbow on most shots and perhaps he used to (I haven't checked out any older videos) but it appears he is now limiting that drop.

Terry

You are very right Terry.

I had this idea that my elbow drops for the extra follow through and I can do more with the white with lesser effort. But after seeing Judd screw the length of the table without dropping his elbow changed my mind on this in particular. I have also noticed that when i intentionally play without dropping the elbow and complete the shot when grip hand touches the chest; well i normally get the same result in terms with CB reaction. So I have matured my mind on this at least.

Before this: I sometimes used to exaggerate it like for instance I am on the wrong side of the blue so its an in and out of baulk shot... Upon shot completion my grip hand wasnt in the chest oh no! It used to be in the chin

Yes I remember you telling me this and I do try to keep that in mind nowadays, when down in address I try to keep the elbow as high as possible however when i do that it normally feels as if I am locking my cueing arm shoulder joint for some reason? Is that normal because to keep the elbow high, you have to take help from the shoulder joint right?

As for Ronnie, well i have stopped watching the devil for he screwed my game LOL but i still do- secretly

Plus: quite interestingly I have managed to get my grip pressure back to how I used to play before. I am so happy at this achievement. Now when I play a shot and keep my grip relaxed then trust me upon impact with CB I get a feeling as if the CB is made of rubber hahahaha crazy as it may sound but true. So whenever I get that feeling, for some reason, I seldom miss that pot. Another thing is that with this feeling i.e. hitting CB and it feels it is made of rubber- I have started taking those very very thin cuts slong the cushion or otherwise very thin and I have started potting them. For instance a red on the side cushion about 6 inches away from it in line with say yellow and the CB just above the green spot... These pots were the hardest and now with this loose grip and keeping it loose to a point that my CB feels made of rubber; I take em all or at least 7 out of 10 or even more and those negative cut backs ... no issues !!!!!

[Sidd]

Looking at the video you posted Sidd, you already have an address position of less than 90 degrees of vertical at the elbow. That's fine as long as the grip hand is not completely closed at that point. The grip should still be slightly open at the address position and should close completely about a balls width after the cue ball has been struck.
Well I dont know about this. Yes at address my elbow is less than 90 and as you say its ok I shall not worry about it. However, recently i have been playing with my grip in closed position at address and also I have reconfigured my grip where now at address the back of my palm is touching the butt. I have more confidence playing like this now as this tends to loosen up my hold from the V and takes my grip a bit behind vertical at the wrist. Is that not right? however during the shot I try to keep it relaxed, it opens and at shot completion it closes but not fully, it is still a bit loose upon shot completion but not open. On high power shots I can sometimes feel the cue butt sliding back just a tiny bit upon impact or upon shot completion. Is that good pressure on high power shots?

Get this right and then you can concentrate on the opening and closing of the grip, in conjunction with swinging the forearm from the hinge of the elbow joint, controlling the forwards and backwards movement of the cue so that it feels like it's your hand that moves the cue and not your arm, which is of course attached to your body at the shoulder, so feeling the arm moving the cue will tend to bring the shoulder into the cue action.
You are so right. I do normally feel that its the middle of the forearm doing the swing

The stroke ends when the hand closes and the momentum of the stroke gives you a natural follow through, so on medium and gentle shots the shoulder will not come into the stroke at all, but beware of closing the grip too soon and gripping too tightly on power strokes as this will automatically stop the stroke short, negate the natural follow through and bring the shoulder into the shot and give upper body movement. GOT IT

My responses in green

[Terry Davidson]

Sidd:

You say getting the elbow up as high as possible feels like you are locking the shoulder...well, this is a good thing. The shoulder muscle cannot be used for accuracy and you can tell if you have used the shoulder during the delivery if the elbow drops at all since the only way the elbow can drop is by use of the shoulder muscle.

Terry

[j6uk]

I'm starting to like the 'shoulder muscle' banta, its so ridiculous but griping at the same time

Sidd:
The shoulder muscle cannot be used for accuracy and you can tell if you have used the shoulder during the delivery if the elbow drops at all since the only way the elbow can drop is by use of the shoulder muscle.

Terry

[Sidd]

Sidd:

You say getting the elbow up as high as possible feels like you are locking the shoulder...well, this is a good thing. The shoulder muscle cannot be used for accuracy and you can tell if you have used the shoulder during the delivery if the elbow drops at all since the only way the elbow can drop is by use of the shoulder muscle.

Terry

Thanks Terry. I shall keep up at it and practice to get it done. I need some solo for this for sure cuz during matches I have noticed that trying to keep the elbow up and shoulder locked sometimes it limits my shot and the grip hand wont finish at the chest... but will work that out. it seems more easy now being assured im doing it right by locking my shoulder.

[Sidd]

I'm starting to like the 'shoulder muscle' banta, its so ridiculous but griping at the same time

Well it sure is, is it not ?

[vmax4steve]

Thanks Terry. I shall keep up at it and practice to get it done. I need some solo for this for sure cuz during matches I have noticed that trying to keep the elbow up and shoulder locked sometimes it limits my shot and the grip hand wont finish at the chest... but will work that out. it seems more easy now being assured im doing it right by locking my shoulder.

It's this driving through to the chest that's making your shoulder come into the stroke, so forget the grip hand finishing at the chest and just let the momentum of the stroke dictate the length of your follow through.

[alabadi]

i had another day coaching yesterday, I me and the coach discovered that my cue action was somewhat peculiar, well he discovered it.

we are working on cueball position and understanding the path its going, I have been struggling with the different positions its been finishing up for the same height of shot.
we had a discussion and I felt that I was hitting the cueball higher than where I was addressing it on my follow through. I believed that I must be dropping my elbow too much and therefor raising the tip.

but after we did some routines and analysed my cue action he told me that as the cue comes back the butt raises, which he said is natural, then as I follow through the cue straightens out and I hit higher up the cueball than I was aiming at.

so instead of changing my whole setup to correct this we did some practice where I actually addressed the cueball slightly lower than I thought needed for the shot and the results were amazing. I was getting lots of consistency in terms of cueball control.

I find these coaching sessions very engaging, however I always leave thinking I haven't done anything new or in other words improved. hard to explain really.

before I came to this coaching session I had been playing absolutely rubbish over the last two weeks the worst I have played for a long time. yet all way through the coaching session I potted everything in sight. the coach told me he cannot see a problem with the way I pot and the way I play. yet I couldn't string 3 balls together in the games I played with my mates.

its like when you have a pain some where and as soon as you get to the doctor it disappears.

I'm coming to the conclusion that I have to accept that playing with less technical players drags your game down to their level, frames are always scrappy, most colours are never on their spots, most balls on the cushions tables are in poorer conditions...etc.

I need to start playing regular with players who are much better than me because I have reached stalemate, and need to get out of this rut.

Alabbadi