What you see and what you get

[Terry Davidson]

depending on which side of the pocket you miss to, left or right as long as its consistent then the problem might be is a sighting issue and not movement, if you miss both sides then it will be a cueing issue.

I found that I always hit to the right knuckle of the pocket consistently, so I put a piece of chalk slightly to the left of the pocket. I sat it on the leather and aimed at that.

at first it just felt so wrong, however I forced myself to go with it and found that I was potting in the center of the bag. eventually I got use to it. now I know what it looks like so when it comes up again and don't have to over analyse it, I just get down and know if I am on the correct line. so as long as I am cueing straight I can pot the majority of these shots.

You are correcting one fault with another one. Much better to learn how to cue consistently straight. It's not impossible to do as thousands of players can do it.

Terry

[alabadi]

You are correcting one fault with another one. Much better to learn how to cue consistently straight. It's not impossible to do as thousands of players can do it.

Terry

for me its a problem how I sight, i'm not actually aiming at the left of the pocket. I did this with the coach and he put the chalk there and he said when I am lining up to aim at the chalk in fact I am aiming for the center of the pocket. with out the chalk I was aiming exactly where the OB was going.

what I see and what my brain is telling me are two different things.

if you remember i told you a while back I had eye surgery and my right eye that was weak is now as strong as the left, my left eye is still my dominant eye but when close up the right is more focused as it has a reading lens in it.

so when standing and looking from afar my strong distance left eye would line up the shot but when down I am sure the right eye is interfering and this puts me either offline or confuses my brain.

now I have sorted this out somewhat so im lining the shot up better, but still the errors creep in from time to time if I don't concentrate

[Terry Davidson]

Uff, I am not sure I can hit it so hard to make CB travel 4 lengths (at least with good precision)?! Never tried yet.
But yes I am not cueing 100% straight all the time that is for sure[not even close, maybe 40%], however this does not influence on how I see CB should hit OB.
No movement here, except eyes, to determine line of aim - and this line is then too thin on OB, because when I hit it[say 4/10], I always overcut it
When I do pot the ball I must aim far too straight(for my eyes) and then also hit what I aimed for(deliver cue OK)

OK, back to 10min CB up&down for warmup
and then I could try dead straight blue from baulk line[or a bit closer] to test my cueing
;-)

It appears that what has happened to you is you've 'trained your brain' and it wants to automatically correct or compensate for your right-to-left cueing. This is why when you get into the address position and are sighting the object ball it doesn't appear 'right' to you. If you select your line of aim when standing behind the shot and have your head (use your nose) centered on that line of aim and then place your straight leg foot on that line of aim and drop your head straight down you have to be on the right line of aim. Because you are not cueing straight your brain unconsciously sees the sighting line as incorrect.

Here are a couple simple tests for you to determine if you are cueing straight. Place cueball on brown spot. Place 3 reds frozen together on the top cushion with centre red directly behind the black spot. Move the outside 2 reds out 1/4" and remove the centre red. The same as 'shooting the spots' try and hit the top cushion from the brown spot without hitting either red. If you are unsuccessful note which red you hit and in your case it will likely be the right-hand red.

If you are successful with the 1/4" then move the outside 2 reds to 1/8" and try another series (this is tough but will show you that you are not able to hit the cueball straight). There might be a number of reasons for this, such as upper body movement on backswing or delivery, gripping the cue tighter during the delivery (very common), crooked backswing, dropping the elbow early, grip too tight.

Take a plastic pop bottle with a narrow opening (less that 15mm) and place on the baulkline so opening is facing you. Address the pop bottle so about 2" of your cue is inside the bottle at the address position. Now slowly do a full backswing and full delivery and see if your cue touches the side of the opening. A better test like this is to place 2 reds on the centre-line of the table about 12mm apart and try the same cueing exercise. If your cue touches either red it will tell you the cue is not being delivered straight and you will have to master that and will have to re-train your brain to 'see' the correctly line of aim when sighting.

j6uk on here has a matchbox device (I don't know if he is selling them yet) which will also show you the same thing.

To correct this problem just cue VERY slowly along the baulkline, with the cue covering the baulkline at address, and watch the ferrule come back somewhere around 8" on the backswing and then slowly deliver the cue as you normally do and while watching the ferrule determine if the cue is covering the baulkline all the way through the backswing and delivery.

The things you should do is first of all loosen your grip until you feel it's too loose and also slow down your backswing since the slower it is the easier it is to keep straight.

Terry

[vmax4steve]

Yes probably I have both problems and I don't always miss for the same reason.

When I aim it looks to me that its going to hit the right spot on OB, but then when CB gets there(maybe even sooner-while it's still traveling) I see that is much too thin[3/4 hit when it should be less-more fullish]

This sounds like you're looking at the cue ball instead of the object ball, otherwise how would you know ?

[metju]

This sounds like you're looking at the cue ball instead of the object ball, otherwise how would you know ?

I try to switch my eyes to OB during or at the start of final backswing but only recently implemented this in my game so maybe not yet very consistent.
But, you still see CB with peripheral vision, I am talking fractions of second here, when as soon as you see CB you see its not a good line(or when its almost at OB but not yet, maybe few inches before).
This is more obvious on longer shots, where judging which line will take CB to desired contact point is more difficult and also you see CB longer while it is on its path.

[itsnoteasy]

If the cue ball isn't hitting where you are looking it's a technique fault, not an aiming or sighting fault.

[metju]

If the cue ball isn't hitting where you are looking it's a technique fault, not an aiming or sighting fault.

Yes, providing I am looking down the proper line(of aim/sight) which leeds CB to correct place.
I know my technique is not good, but there is something else here, not related to execution, only to my perception/sight
That is what I am trying to describe.

...simple tests for you to determine if you are cueing straight. Place cueball on brown spot. Place
3 reds frozen together on the top cushion with centre red directly behind the black spot. Move the outside 2 reds out 1/4" and remove the centre red. The same as 'shooting the spots' try and hit the top cushion from the brown spot without hitting either red. If you are unsuccessful note which red you hit and in your case it will likely be the right-hand red.
...

in that case it is a cueing issue, as mentioned here play the spots until you have confidence that you are cueing straight

Video(the best I could do for now) of me playing the spots:

I. Front view: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iyhiAucB8oc
II. More from side: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XkRuvVr2DZg

And there, playing absolutely straight, as I get down and while my eyes move from CB to OB(or spot on cushion in this case) it feels like my cue is pointing at least one(or two) full ball width(s) to the left of contact point, though if I execute shot OK(2nd shot) it hits what I want, but I have to kind of know its the right line, because I don't feel or see it that way.
This is less pronounced If I just try to look more to the OB(when you only see cue with peripheral vision), but you also have to look at CB in the process of aiming, at least for lining up center ball striking.

A picture - after shots 1 & 2
Matej - Spots 1.jpg

I don't wear glasses or contact lenses and have left eye dominance and probably tendencies to overcomplicate stuff :-D

Thank you all for your contributions.

[Terry Davidson]

metju:

Just from that short clip I see a whole bunch of problems which are causing you to take the cue off-line.

1. To much cue out over the bridge (should be 9" to 12" from the 'V' of the bridge).
2. Look at your videos again, especially the one from the side and you will see the cue rising and falling as you both feather and do your backswing and delivery. Try and keep the cue on the same plane, which is almost level except for cushion height.
3. With my 2nd point, the butt of the cue is way too high and you have a 'pump handle' cueing technique.
4. Body lifting on the final backswing.
5. You are delivering the cue with your shoulder rather than your elbow. The elbow joint should be the only moving part on the backswing and delivery (besides the eyes only).
6. Backswing WAY TOO FAST...slow it down and make it deliberate and controlled.
7. Loosen the grip until the butt of the cue just lays in the bed of the 4 fingers (this has been around since Joe Davis).

Terry

[metju]

1. To much cue out over the bridge (should be 9" to 12" from the 'V' of the bridge).
...

1. OK, move bridge closer to CB
2.&3. Yes I saw that, didn't know I was doing it before ...
4-7. Yes I see a little bump ... too excited and want to get it done as soon as possible. But its hard to be slow&controled

Will try something ... and post and update.
Thanks!

[vmax4steve]

I think you have sighting issues and should sort then with a home made sightright device to determine how you see the line of aim with regards to where between your eyes you place the cue.
Draw a thickish dark line down the middle of an A4 sheet of paper, put two folds in the centre to create a step of about an inch and with a small book or something the same thickness under the first step, put this on the bed of the snooker table.
Cover the line on the lower step with a sheet of paper and then stand behind the first step and line up your cue to the line on the paper as if it were the line of aim.
Get a friend or playing partner to then remove the paper from the bottom step and check if you see the top line in sync with the bottom line as one or two separate lines.
If you see two separate lines then adjust your stance until you see both lines in sync as one.

[itsnoteasy]

I can't watch the second video, it says not for mobile users, or something along those lines.

[itsnoteasy]

Since it hasn't been mentioned, is your bridge arm off the table? It's a wee bit hard to tell but on the first video it looks like the elbow is in the air.
Not getting that cue online Metju, look at the spots running back up towards you ,they should run right through your cue if you are playing up and down the spots, your cue is going from your left to right. What Vmax has said should help, and of course do as Terry says.

[metju]

I can't watch the second video, it says not for mobile users, or something along those lines.

Here, smaller resolution of video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GtGj...ature=youtu.be
And without sound/music, maybe because: "Acknowledged third party content."

is your bridge arm off the table? It's a wee bit hard to tell but on the first video it looks like the elbow is in the air...

Yes elbow is in the air.

... look at the spots running back up towards you ,they should run right through your cue if you are playing up and down the spots, your cue is going from your left to right...

Spots are NOT completely straight, but I saw that too, even on 2nd shot, but there only in the follow through

the bridge (should be 9" to 12" from the 'V' of the bridge).

I will put my bridge hand on the D line, which should be 9 3/4" behind brown spot

I think you have sighting issues and should sort then with a home made sightright device to determine ...

Have already tried that, but on the kitchen table ... :-D

Also tried this: Nic Barrow Snooker Coaching Matthew S 09 Aiming Setup System
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZKoMZrg1MAg

Will do it again, now that I have more information.

[Terry Davidson]

Actually if you have the 'V' of the bridge on the 'D'-line behind the brown spot then the back of the cueball should be 10-1/2" from the bridge. The 'D' is 11-1/2" in radius and half the cueball will be near enough 1" subtracted from that.

Can't believe I didn't notice the bridge arm not laying on the table. Get it down there to provide stability.

Also,the 2 reds shouldn't be beside the black spot, they should be frozen on the top cushion behind the black spot and only 1 ball width apart plus another 1/4" on each side and you should be able to hit the cushion without hitting the balls. If you can't do that then for certain you are not delivering the cue even reasonably straight (which I can easily see from your videos).

No matter what else you think is wrong, work on delivering straight consistently before you work on anything else. Only then can you determine if your sighting is off since right now you are not sure although for certain you do not deliver straight at all.

Terry

[metju]

...bridge arm not laying on the table. Get it down there to provide stability

OK, I'll keep that in mind, its not difficult to do, especially if I step a little bit wider, which feels better anyway

...
Also,the 2 reds shouldn't be beside the black spot, they should be frozen on the top cushion behind the black spot and only 1 ball width apart plus another 1/4" on each side and you should be able to hit the cushion without hitting the balls.

I can hit the spot(well within few millimeters) between reds on cushion like you describe with ease every time, though I set it up with half ball clearance[will try now with only aprox. 6mm = 1/4"]
Its after the bounce the angle appears ...
Because of unintentional side which comes from not cueing straight, and pushing through CB from left to right or not hitting center ball at all, right?

Also: is this(see image) American snooker size table(a bit lower, 10cm shorter and 5cm narrower)?
Miza - Arena BTC.jpg
I practise mostly on this one, but I also play 12ft regular size like this one
Turnir Direkt 1 - Matej.jpg