2014 World Championship - Discussion

[j6uk]

part of all this is is the come down after the world championships, we all feel a wee bit depressed.. fact is though ron didn't show the same intensity as he had done the last two years and its a shame that he didn't do 6. for me its upsetting

[The Statman]

Site was down for 24 hours...i entered today and in last 2 pages of this thread Selbys fans talked about 3 or 4 times about us who think Selby used gamesmanship as "haters ".....wtf...you have an opinion, some of us have another......but maybe you find it hard to explain Selbys way of playing snooker in the finak so its easy to attack those who dont like that jester....

Did we? You obviously didn't read the last two pages very closely. I wrote the following and I don't think I called anyone a hater.

Well, quite. Just popped onto TSF for the first time since returning from Sheffield yesterday and, having scrolled back through 4 or 5 pages of this thread, I must say many of you were watching a different match from the one which I had the pleasure of witnessing.

I was pretty neutral; you can hardly not enjoy O'Sullivan when playing well but I equally like Selby. Either of their prospective achievements of 6-times and first-time winner would have been a good story too.

All in all, I thought Selby was pretty good, especially on Monday and was good value for the one-frame lead going into the evening session. I think overall the luck probably favoured him, but not by much; those four consecutive snookers created quite a fortunate episode, though. There were many times on the Sunday when he was left nothing from O'Sullivan misses, and I think it roughly evened itself out over the match but any imbalance of luck was certainly not on O'Sullivan's side.

But, having said that, I lost count of the number of times Selby went to open the pack and landed on nothing - end of break.

I do get what people say about Selby seeming to overthink simple situations, but for me it is one of the fascinations. Maybe the atmosphere in the arena made it less of a distraction for me compared with those watching on television. In any case, his average shot time was only something like 25 or 26 seconds, which is not awfully slow and after all it isn't a race. In Selby's defense, I would suggest that there is very real reason for his deliberations and anyone who thinks otherwise obviously doesn't have a very imaginative snooker mind - I find his calculations of the very best position to leave the white safe, and indeed what reds might be available to him if he gives his opponent a tough escape, very intriguing indeed and very seldom unfathomable. (In fact, it is one of the more fascinating traits of O'Sullivan, too - he always makes time to study the baulk cushion when he's run out of position and it was until relatively recently a much underappreciated facet of O'Sullivan's game. He too exhibited it quite often during this final.)

Actually, Selby has in the past bogged both his opponent and himself down with much more negative play than he displayed this week; not right up to his most fluent but by no means all that negative. There were a couple of surprising shot selections, though - one that springs to mind was when he needed one snooker on the last red. O'Sullivan escaped but left the red easy with automatic black to follow, which with two of the baulk colours close together that could have provided a good snooker opportunity. I don't know whether it was mentioned in commentary but I was surprised that he didn't take the 8 points while they were on offer. (Sorry I don't know which frame it was, but I'm almost sure it was Monday afternoon and not Sunday.)

I thought it was an excellent and absorbing final and it was a credit to both players. O'Sullivan was very competitive even after Selby
had taken the lead (the O'Sullivan of a few seasons ago might have caved in, but not this time). In the end, he was caught out by a few very uncharacteristic misses - just a few more than Selby - and this was ultimately the difference.

Another thing for which O'Sullivan I think should be praised is his interview afterwards. As with the Welsh, he was speaking openly and articulately, providing soundbites rather than summarily answering the questions put to him, as he sometimes does. Along with the atmosphere of the Ronnie O'Sullivan Show on Eurosport, I think this puts him in excellent light, which is no bad thing for the biggest draw in the game. (Oh to think how many records he might have smashed if he'd been like this all his life - but that's for another thread!)

As a ticket-holder for the last 21 world finals, I'll tell you that you need either (a) brilliant snooker or (b) a tense, close finish, and if you get both that's a great bonus! This year's final ranks right up there among the best. Many finals have had (a) or (b) in abundance (in fact, the 2006 final is the only one which really had neither) but not many have scored so highly overall for both factors.

I realise it's hard to take anyone seriously who claims to be a Selby fan and an O'Sullivan fan, but please don't just read what you want to read and ignore the rest.

[stephenm2682]

My only nark was with the commentators comparing stats like total points scored in tournament, when they were level, which was biased in the sense of Ronnie played less frames! Yet they fail to mention that

[j6uk]

I think Ferret put the site down for 24hr so this thread can die a death and stop the repetition and to-and-fro.

yeah i was getting a bit parra, i thought i may have said something wrong

[attilahun]

Did we? You obviously didn't read the last two pages very closely. I wrote the following and I don't think I called anyone a hater.I realise it's hard to take anyone seriously who claims to be a Selby fan and an O'Sullivan fan, but please don't just read what you want to read and ignore the rest.

Why did you assumed i was talking about you? Please read carefully last post and see who used that word....And i read all your post and i agreed with some and disagreed with some....It is obvious that your snooker experience is greater than mine by a mile but i am entitled to an opinion snd surely that doesnt make me a hater...

[The Statman]

Why did you assumed i was talking about you?

Maybe because you said "in last 2 pages of this thread Selbys fans talked about ....."

... i am entitled to an opinion snd surely that doesnt make me a hater...

As I said, I never said it did!

[attilahun]

Looks like there is a Selby hater working for The Telegraph........

PS I say again....more clearly now...i wasnt talking abou you Statman.....

[Odrl]

I have hunted high and low to find this stat that there was only four seconds between the average shot times in the final, but I can't find a single thing on it, could the folk who posted these stats put up a link for me thanks.

I've had a look through the last session, but I don't think the average shot time was displayed at any point close to the end of the match. This is the latest I found, at 38:20 in the video:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aSvo1r8UAZ0

It's in frame 26 of 32, so it's probably close to what it was in the end. Having said that, Selby had his two highest breaks of the match after that point, and O'Sullivan had a quick break himself, so it's probably a second or two less for both players...

[itsnoteasy]

Thanks Odri,appreciated, that's hard to believe , but it will be true obviously, just shows you how you can get the wrong perception of something, Selby is virtually a Billy whiz round the table. Why does it feel like a wet weekend in November every time he's at the table? It's most strange, it's not like I have any baggage with Selby, I have only started watching snooker again in the last year and a half, and had never heard of him or any of the new players before then.

[miscuehamburg]

Ronnie had a car crash. His son was also there. Both shaken but not hurt.
When ****s gets going ....

In Leicester for all the places

[JeeSe]

He wasn't slow throughout, but there was a point, where he could only see one red, he could not play safe off it, he could only pot it, there really were no other options, yet selby spent 2 minutes walking around the table pulling funny faces. Was a blatent Ebdon.

But fair play to the guy, he is the champion, it's just he'd be more popular if he won by out potting and entertaining.

[alexiy]

This was a very suspicious match.This should be investigated thoroughly.
And oh yea,i accept the fact that selby is the champion,he beat them all, but no doubt in my mind that he is the most dreadful player to watch since peter ebdon.Very bad for snooker,but oh well chelsea was also boring but they won the CL title and football moves on,but thats easy beacause football has a huge fan base.I know ronnie deserved to loose this match,but i'll say that Mark Selby is not a worthy champion,knows nothing about a gentleman game or entertainment,no grace and class or whatsoever,just a pure "opportunistic money maker".If Joe Perry did win against ronnie now that would be beating the rocket in style,and he was pretty close,that was a great match to watch,i even rooted for Joe because he showed some "balls" to ronnie,but this final was b...**** and all thanks to the great mark selby..
I don't understand how could anyone defend his style of playing,but oh well,there are even stranger people on this planet.
And yea Neil Robertson is the player of the year for me.**** rankings.Neil is going to get it next year,great player and i hope ronnie will be back to his game to spice things up again and challenge hendry's records.

[Evilbrain]

It has to be reminded that there are two players at the table, and Selby has every right to play how he wants. However boring and negative it is and he is an excellent player. That being said i just would want tickets seeing him play.

[The Statman]

This was a very suspicious match.This should be investigated thoroughly.
And oh yea,i accept the fact that selby is the champion,he beat them all, but no doubt in my mind that he is the most dreadful player to watch since peter ebdon.Very bad for snooker,but oh well chelsea was also boring but they won the CL title and football moves on,but thats easy beacause football has a huge fan base.I know ronnie deserved to loose this match,but i'll say that Mark Selby is not a worthy champion,knows nothing about a gentleman game or entertainment,no grace and class or whatsoever,just a pure "opportunistic money maker".If Joe Perry did win against ronnie now that would be beating the rocket in style,and he was pretty close,that was a great match to watch,i even rooted for Joe because he showed some "balls" to ronnie,but this final was b...**** and all thanks to the great mark selby..
I don't understand how could anyone defend his style of playing,but oh well,there are even stranger people on this planet.
And yea Neil Robertson is the player of the year for me.**** rankings.Neil is going to get it next year,great player and i hope ronnie will be back to his game to spice things up again and challenge hendry's records.

"Opportunistic money maker"?

That's one of the most astonishing posts I've read this week, and against some stiff opposition.

At the end of the day, he played well within the rules, and Ronnie O'Sullivan was unable to respond on the day that it matters. That's how sport works. The best doesn't necessarily win; if someone has a bad day someone else can prevail.

It's worth remembering that Mark Selby has a pretty good record at the Crucible. He remains one of only a handful of players to have made 5 centuries in one match under 30 frames, had a better Crucible century strike rate than either O'Sullivan or Higgins until 2011 when they won further titles, and is a solid and proven big-time winner.

I don't care if you don't like him or his style of play - that's you're opinion and you are by all means entitled to it - but to call someone who has as good a pedigree as Selby, whether you like him or not, an unworthy world champion and an opportunistic money maker is nothing short of preposterous.

And actually I'd much rather have a world champion who will always stop and chat and have a photo with fans than someone who sneaks out side entrances and walks past a school group of 8-year-olds at the Crucible stage door without even saying hello, let alone doing any autographs.

But I suppose that doesn't come in to it where a 'worthy champion' is concerned.

I was at the after-tournament party late on Monday night and at 2am Mark was still very happy to chat and have photos with anyone who asked. Ronnie O'Sullivan, by contrast, last year did the bear contractual minimum and off he went long before any fans got to gain entry.

So yes, you're right, there are stranger people on the planet - there have been, ever since the mirror was invented.

[Kargetina]

This was a very suspicious match.This should be investigated thoroughly.
And oh yea,i accept the fact that selby is the champion,he beat them all, but no doubt in my mind that he is the most dreadful player to watch since peter ebdon.Very bad for snooker,but oh well chelsea was also boring but they won the CL title and football moves on,but thats easy beacause football has a huge fan base.I know ronnie deserved to loose this match,but i'll say that Mark Selby is not a worthy champion,knows nothing about a gentleman game or entertainment,no grace and class or whatsoever,just a pure "opportunistic money maker".If Joe Perry did win against ronnie now that would be beating the rocket in style,and he was pretty close,that was a great match to watch,i even rooted for Joe because he showed some "balls" to ronnie,but this final was b...**** and all thanks to the great mark selby..
I don't understand how could anyone defend his style of playing,but oh well,there are even stranger people on this planet.
And yea Neil Robertson is the player of the year for me.**** rankings.Neil is going to get it next year,great player and i hope ronnie will be back to his game to spice things up again and challenge hendry's records.

Lmao some of you are so deluded,you probably can't distinguish between night and day.

Bad for snooker?Selby's tactical schooling of OSullivan had a lot bigger average audience and a lot bigger peak at the end of the match than Ronnie's beating of his pigeons Hawkins and Carter in the last two years.