The absence of Ronnie

[Looki]

http://www.global-snooker.com/global...ough100426.asp

in this match, 14 secs AST for ronnie and 16 secs AST for MJW - ding is closer to 18-20 for most matches. in any case this is a moot point since the issue is about deliberate slow play, not a subjective opinion of whether ding is fast or normal.

on that subject, ding (after s. maguire in the 2012 china open final) is the latest victim of ebbo's cheating slow play. so much for the 'only ronnie can't cope with it mentally' argument. fact is, most players will be affected by people deliberately slowing down play - in any sport and that is why there are rules in place in all major sports to prevent it.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/oth...ng-Junhui.html

Who have said "only ronnie can't cope with it"? You also said mjw is not fast, 16 sec sounds pretty fast, at least to a right-wing dinosaur.

[nrage]

on that subject, ding (after s. maguire in the 2012 china open final) is the latest victim of ebbo's cheating slow play. so much for the 'only ronnie can't cope with it mentally' argument. fact is, most players will be affected by people deliberately slowing down play - in any sport and that is why there are rules in place in all major sports to prevent it.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/oth...ng-Junhui.html

I don't see a quote from Ding there.. only a whining Judd Trump. So, yet again, we have the media taking a comment from someone (Judd) and trying to turn it into an issue/news. In fact, the article so devoid of content they have to resort to listing frame scores, not to mention the first thing they do in that article is reference the 2005 match vs Ronnie.. which was itself the exact same thing, a player making a comment and the media trying to make it newsworthy. That's all that is happening here.

Do you have any actual evidence or there being a real problem, aside from of the cuff comments from players twice in the 21 years Peter Ebdon has been a professional snooker player.

[nrage]

.. Deliberate slow play (assuming for a sec that this is what Ebdon was doing) should have no effect on his opponent, as stated numerous times, just about any other player than Ronnie (then or now) would have coped with it and beaten Ebdon from that position - assuming Ebdon's actual snooker wasn't the real reason Ronnie lost that match in the first place.

Who have said "only ronnie can't cope with it"?

I did The Ronnie that lost to Ebdon in the constantly talked about incident couldn't cope with it, that's obvious from the result.

What is not obvious is whether it was the slow play or Ebdons snooker that was the problem, nor whether another player would have been similarly effected. I cannot imagine any of the other great players been as affected as Ronnie, but then they have historically all been more stable mentally.

[The Statman]

What an amusing thread which has become so different from the original title!

It's also interesting that the "6 minute break of 12" has gradually got slower as the years have gone by. It was originally referred to as the "5 minute break of 12" and, if you look at the Youtube video, you can see that he pots the pink for 12 at something like 3 min 35 sec. The referee then has a tricky spotting action to do, which takes 30 seconds or so, and Ebdon, now out of position on the next red, spends 45 seconds analysing and carrying out his safety shot.

However, it is an infamous incident and I think, most of all, it is a great shame that this will be what Ebdon is always remembered for. Especially considering that he has a fantastic record of ranking event wins, centuries and of course is a former world champion, and is one of the most spectacular shot-makers of all time. Many of my most memorable single shots, for outright obscene how-did-he-manage-to-pull-that-off-ness, are his.

[craigslater]

The absence of Ronnie

Rocket to launch at PTC http://southwestsnookeracademy.com/news/2012/08/28/rocket-on-launch-pad-at-ptc/

[SnookerFan]

Rocket in trouble. http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/oth...=feeds-newsxml

[Looki]

Rocket in trouble. http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/oth...=feeds-newsxml

£1000.. I hope he doesn't go bankrupt. You get more for swearing in Twitter. :P

[SnookerFan]

£1000.. I hope he doesn't go bankrupt. You get more for swearing in Twitter. :P

That's true.

[tommygunner1309]

Probably the reason why ROS is SEEN to be slagged off more than positive remarks, is because fans of his see remarks like "childish behaviour" etc are seen as a nonsense and they can't be bothered to answer!!!!! Ronnie is his own man, and there is nothing childish in making decisions that suit him. He doesn't need the money, and I suspect dropping out of the top 16 would suit him, as he can then select what qualifiers he wants to win. I wonder if you people that say he is guilty of "childish behaviour" would be accused of that same sympton, if you got to work and was told that you were to go to a factory 200 miles away each day!!! If it didn't suit, you wouldn't want to do it. Nothing childish in that. Snooker may be the only thing in some peoples lives, but I think Ronnie has a much wider interest. Just leave the guy alone to do his own thing.

[wildJONESEYE]

If you dont want to go to a Factory 200 miles away every day you would have to find another Job. employers wouldn't understand if you say i cant be bothered Going today and you would probably get the Sack.

[SnookerFan]

If you dont want to go to a Factory 200 miles away every day you would have to find another Job. employers wouldn't understand if you say i cant be bothered Going today and you would probably get the Sack.

Exactly! It's not the same thing.

The factory worker who had to do the hundreds of miles of travelling would do it, or would find another job. They wouldn't get away with pulling out constantly, especially if they did it at short notice the majority of times. Ronnie was on the plane to Ireland one time, then decided to get off and leave because he couldn't be bothered to go. The factory worker in the above comparison would more than likely be fired if he decided not to travel 200 miles on the morning he was supposed to be going.

If Ronnie stood up and said; "Look, I'm retiring. I've won four world titles, countless other trophies. My dad is out of prison now, and I have kids that I want to spend time with and watch grow up." Nobody would have an issue with that. What they do have an issue with is him pulling out of tournaments a few hours before his matches, just due to the fact he can't be bothered to go.

[tommygunner1309]

I still think you are totally missing the point. In effect, pro snooker players are self employed. From a very early age they spend thousands of hours practising their trade for which they pay for themselves. Non of their equipment, use of tables at clubs, cue maintenance or coaching is paid for by an employer. Ok, agreed there has to be a rule book, as in all walks of life, and maybe Ronnie has been at fault in entering tournaments that he later pulled out of, but that is still not "childish behaviour". To me, Ronnie will never be the greatest player ever - since he walked out on Stephen Hendry at only 4 2 down. To me a great player sees it through to the end, however poorly he is playing. That is why I rate Hendry so highly - a true snooker great and probably the best ever. Many say Alex Higgins - not to me - due to his behaviour off the table - like headbutting referees. This is inexcusable. A true sporting great depends not only in his sporting ability, but his behaviour off the table. However, I still think it is wrong to accuse Ronnie of childish behaviour. He certainly is a brilliant cueist, and he certainly does pull in the crowds, and on his day, I have never seen anyone play the game like Ronnie - and I remember watching from as far back as Fred and Joe Davis. Criticise by all means, but at least make it constructive.

[SnookerFan]

I still think you are totally missing the point. In effect, pro snooker players are self employed. From a very early age they spend thousands of hours practising their trade for which they pay for themselves. Non of their equipment, use of tables at clubs, cue maintenance or coaching is paid for by an employer. Ok, agreed there has to be a rule book, as in all walks of life, and maybe Ronnie has been at fault in entering tournaments that he later pulled out of, but that is still not "childish behaviour". To me, Ronnie will never be the greatest player ever - since he walked out on Stephen Hendry at only 4 2 down. To me a great player sees it through to the end, however poorly he is playing. That is why I rate Hendry so highly - a true snooker great and probably the best ever. Many say Alex Higgins - not to me - due to his behaviour off the table - like headbutting referees. This is inexcusable. A true sporting great depends not only in his sporting ability, but his behaviour off the table. However, I still think it is wrong to accuse Ronnie of childish behaviour. He certainly is a brilliant cueist, and he certainly does pull in the crowds, and on his day, I have never seen anyone play the game like Ronnie - and I remember watching from as far back as Fred and Joe Davis. Criticise by all means, but at least make it constructive.

Actually, I have missed the point of this post. Are you suggesting that the only thing you have issue with is the use of the phrase; 'childish behaviour'?

I'm not a fan of Ronnie, but when I criticise it's because I believe he has done something wrong. Like walking out on Stephen Hendry, in your example. Is it really that bad to refer to that as childish? It doesn't exactly show emotional maturity, does it? What about talking about how he wanted a female journalist in China to suck his dick? Is what you're saying that I can criticise that, but not refer to it as childish. And what do you mean make it constructive? Okay. Here are my constructive criticisms;

In the instances that we discussed, I don't believe Ronnie should have walked out mid-match. I also don't believe he should have discussed a journalist sucking his dick that close to a microphone. I would appreciate it if he beared this advice in mind in the future.


I don't believe everything he's done is bad. See how he looked after Ding at that Masters final, for example. I'm not trying to Ronnie bash, per se. But even his most ardent fan has to admit, he does sometimes open himself up for such criticism.

[tommygunner1309]

Sure, I agree that Ronnie does deserve criticism, but I just think that putting it all down to childish behaviour is a total misunderstanding of the man. I didn't know about the china incident, but if that was said by him, then I would expect knuckles to be severley rapped. That behaviour is unacceptable in a top pro in any sport, which is why I made the comparison with Alex H. There is no doubt that Alex was a grand master in the art of snooker, but I am a great believer in setting good examples. Ronnie doesn't always do that, which I have already recognized. But I see the words "childish" so often when people write about Ronnie, by people who obviously do not know the man, and have no idea about his mental state. I believe in fair play, and giving a man a fair deal from the pack, and so often, Ronnie doesn't get that. The only time I felt Ronnie was a little immature was when he was about to refuse the black to make a 147 because there was no prize money for it. Jan V got Ronnie to pot it - but it did annoy me - most of us would give our right arm (or leg - we need the arm to play the shot) at a chance of a 147. But talking of childish - have you noticed how many people on this forum have 147 for their highest break - hahahahahaha now that really is - There are more amateurs on here with a 147 than you can shake a stick at - but who are some of them fooling - just themselves I guess. But getting back to the point, I think it is fair to criticise, if someone thinks that criticism is warranted - but constantly using childish is not warranted unless you know the man. BTW, Ronnie isn't my fave and I am not an ardent fan - but I love to watch him in full flow - My favourites are MJ Williams, Steve Davis and Matt Stevens (and the great Hendry when he was playing.)

[SnookerFan]

Just a link to the story I was referring to, just so you don't think I was making it up;

http://www.metro.co.uk/sport/extra/1...nese-reporters

I do think, however what he did was exaggerated by the press. I don't believe he actually asked reporters to suck his dick physically. More that he was muttering stuff off camera about what he'd like to do, and it got picked up. (Or at least that's my recollection, on not having seen the clip in a while and having no intention to watch him do it again.)

Either way though, I think sometimes his behaviour warrants the term 'childish'. I kind of found it odd that you thought it was to harsh a term. But if it bothers you that much, I guess we can think of some other terms to use.