The Masters 2014

[cueman]

Corals offering 21/10 for Selby to win! If you like a bet then you aught to snap their hand off at that price!

I'm shocked all the bookies are making O'Sullivan odds on. 4/11? Do me a lemon. You can easily make a case for making either player the favourite.

It is a good price but I think they are countering in the form of O'Sullivan this week too. Lets be honest its hard to not make him a clear favourite and most money will be going on Ronnie. Its only because of the sheer amount of bets placed on him that they have made him odds on favourite.

[monkeytennis]

I think this match will be the biggest test of Dr Steve's influence. On paper Ronnie is obviously the better player but he does sometimes let Selby get to him.

Really looking forward to this final!

[daffie]

I'm trying not to get drawn into a long discussion with people who clearly have a completely different view of things regarding ROS than myself, but I will say this to try and make my own view on this a bit more clear and end the discussion (from my end anyway). This is not the place for it.

A lot of people in the Ronnie camp (aka the obnoxious loudmouth shouters) will always only have interest in their man, and him alone...never in the game, the opponent, nor anything else surrounding it. It's very clear that whenever ROS plays that certain lurkers come our from under their rock and start shouting, loudmouthing, and bigging-up their man. There will never be any recognition for the opponent nor for the game itself, and imho that's just not fair nor healthy for the sport at all. I have no big problem with ROS himself (although I find he tends to be somewhat aloof shall we say) and I enjoy watching him play when he's in the zone. But...having said that, I watch snooker for the game itself, the close competition between two players, the sportsmanship that has always been a big part of our game ever since I started watching some 35 years ago. Therefore imho there should always be an equal amount of respect towards both players (and the game...as always). Some (I will say many) Ronnie fans (the ones that give his fans a bad name) tend to be obnoxious and without any healthy respect for anything other than their man. Yes this can annoy me at times, as I find it degrading to the game and the opponent. Audience members who are shouting out and woo-ing with every single shot of ROS (yes, even the very simple ones), and at the same time are quiet mostly whenever the opponent makes any decent pot, lays a snooker, or makes a break, let alone win a frame or take the lead!, I don't think that is fair or healthy behaviour within our sport. But hey...that's me But I don't think I'm completely alone in this btw.

So...there you have it. Enough said imo. On with more important things than ROS or their 'fans' Looking forward to the Final today. If anybody can upset ROS then it's Mark. I hope he brings his A game, as will Ronnie. Goes without saying that I will be rooting for Selby, but at the same time I'm hoping for a close fight...that's the most important thing to me. A 10-9 midnight finish would do me just fine

[jrc750]

I think Mark can beat Ronnie
(if only to upset Arb's )

[jb134]

Selby and Higgins upset Ronnie in a way that no-one else can, he knows they won't go away, they won't bottle it and they have the ability when the chances arise.

[jb134]

Yeah one in 20 matches lol

Which would make it not the first time then eh? Lol.

[Billy]

Audience members who are shouting out and woo-ing with every single shot of ROS (yes, even the very simple ones), and at the same time are quiet mostly whenever the opponent makes any decent pot, lays a snooker, or makes a break, let alone win a frame or take the lead!, I don't think that is fair or healthy behaviour within our sport. But hey...that's me But I don't think I'm completely alone in this btw.

No, you're not alone, but at the same time I'm not sure how accurate or fair your description of the average RO fan is. There's nothing wrong with having a favourite player, and to say most of them have no interest in the game other than their man is probably very inaccurate.

Having said that, I do relate to your views to some degree. On the rare occasions I find myself discussing snooker with a group of strangers (such as during the warehouse/FLT training course I'm currently attending) I always find myself letting out a private groan whenever someone pipes up, "Did Ronnie win?". Inevitably the remark will have come from a young, 20-something 'lad', and it is then that I find myself making the same assumptions as yourself. If I then try to engage this person in a discussion about the game in general, it becomes blatantly obvious they know nothing about it.

[daffie]

No, you're not alone, but at the same time I'm not sure how accurate or fair your description of the average RO fan is. There's nothing wrong with having a favourite player, and to say most of them have no interest in the game other than their man is probably very inaccurate.

Having said that, I do relate to your views to some degree. On the rare occasions I find myself discussing snooker with a group of strangers (such as during the warehouse/FLT training course I'm currently attending) I always find myself letting out a private groan whenever someone pipes up, "Did Ronnie win?". Inevitably the remark will have come from a young, 20-something 'lad', and it is then that I find myself making the same assumptions as yourself. If I then try to engage this person in a discussion about the game in general, it becomes blatantly obvious they know nothing about it.

Yes that's exactly the point I was trying to make. It's like many people tend to only be interested in the person Ronnie and whether he won, instead of the game in general, or anything else for that matter. I feel it's like pretty much everything in today's world is about (over)hype and only about winning...like that's the only thing people care about...who is the best, who is a winner. Nevermind the way to a result, it's merely the result that counts. Not for me it doesn't. I'm funny that way

Btw I have tried being very careful not to generalize (too much) regarding Ronnie fans, although like yourself I don't often hear from "normal" Ronnie fans...they tend to be loud and very onesided.

Anyway...there I go again

[SnookerFan]

Come on Selby.

[SnookerFan]

No, you're not alone, but at the same time I'm not sure how accurate or fair your description of the average RO fan is. There's nothing wrong with having a favourite player, and to say most of them have no interest in the game other than their man is probably very inaccurate.

Having said that, I do relate to your views to some degree. On the rare occasions I find myself discussing snooker with a group of strangers (such as during the warehouse/FLT training course I'm currently attending) I always find myself letting out a private groan whenever someone pipes up, "Did Ronnie win?". Inevitably the remark will have come from a young, 20-something 'lad', and it is then that I find myself making the same assumptions as yourself. If I then try to engage this person in a discussion about the game in general, it becomes blatantly obvious they know nothing about it.

I think this doesn't apply to all Ronnie fans, but does to some. The Wembley Arena fans were bad for this. I was at Ronnie vs Mags in the first round a few years back. Some people were evening clapping when Mags missed.

These fans give others a bad name. Some crowds show respect to both fans, regardless of who they want to win.

[coomsey76]

. These fans give others a bad name. Some crowds show respect to both fans, regardless of who they want to win.

I'm with you on that mate, I was up at Ally Pally for Ronnie's match against Milkins and I was in amongst a lot of Ronnie fans and they showed clear respect for Milkins..... and a lot of the time you could see they were clearly not happy with the unnecessary shouting out!!

daffie View Post
Audience members who are shouting out and woo-ing with every single shot of ROS (yes, even the very simple ones), and at the same time are quiet mostly whenever the opponent makes any decent pot, lays a snooker, or makes a break, let alone win a frame or take the lead!, I don't think that is fair or healthy behaviour within our sport. But hey...that's me But I don't think I'm completely alone in this btw.

I'm a Ronnie fan and when he's on song its brillant to watch..... but I also can appreciate good snooker, like for instant I'm not a massive Selby fan but you have admire the way he can still win playing his B game and that last frame against Higgins. Firstly that snooker he laid behind the green then that back double on the blue had me standing and applauding that just amazing to watch!!

I think its quite easy to pigeon hole Ronnie fans but there not all like that I can assure you....

Away I'm up there for this evening session and I can't wait..... looking forward to a great final whoever wins!!

[Odrl]

What to say ahead of today's match? :smile:

Well, this is the final a lot of people wanted and one of THE pairings in the game today. Some of the matches these two have played over the last six years or so have been among the most entertaining I have ever seen. They have met six times in long matches, both winning on three occasions, but I suspect Selby is the more pleased of the two with that record, because he was seen as the underdog each time. Is he the underdog this time?

Well, Ronnie O'Sullivan has only lost three frames in the tournament so far. Robert Milkins didn't trouble him one bit in the 1st round, even though he got a couple of chances, and Ricky Walden hardly got a shot in six frames. Maguire had a lot of chances last night, it has to be said, but O'Sullivan wasn't really pushed to play his best, so his level dropped a bit. He has been in his comfort zone all week, getting good chances to score and taking them, so it will be interesting to see how it goes when he has to fight for frames more.

He has a great history of getting himself up for major finals, and of course has a good record in them as a result, but I guess the Masters is a bit of an exception. He has played in nine finals and only won four. Three of those were very comfortable, 9-3 and 10-3, the one he won against Selby in 2009 went 10-8, and I would consider that one of his best wins. It was a match where he really kept his discipline throughout and battled in the fragmented frames, even when the style of the match suited Selby more. Of the five finals O'Sullivan has lost, he was outplayed by Hendry once, but the other four were all close matches. He lost from well in front against Davis in 1997, against Hunter in 2004 and against Selby in 2010, and he was a couple of balls away from winning against Higgins in 2006, before Higgins cleared to win 10-9 on the black. So what I'm trying to say is, if matches go close O'Sullivan is certainly vulnerable. But if he has a chance for one of his trademark thrashings, he is usually merciless. :wink:


Mark Selby, on the other hand, can't seem to go through a tournament dropping just a couple of frames. In fact, he seems to try his best to play as many as possible. :wink: He three wins this week were not very similar... He had a strong start against Mark Davis to take a good lead, but he only struggled over the line in the decider in the end. Against Higgins he also had a decent start, before Higgins took command of the match and got himself close to the winning line. But as always, Selby stuck in there and won on the pink in the decider. The match against Murphy was a lot more comfortable. It was the first time Selby showed any breakbuilding fluency, putting the pressure on Murphy with four strong frames before the interval. The match went scrappy after that, but of course Selby is more than comfortable in that type of game as well.

His Masters record is almost as impressive as O'Sullivan's. This is his fifth final in seven years, and a win would put him level with O'Sullivan as the second most successful player in the history of this tournament. His 11 out of 11 decider record is one of the most impressive statistics in snooker today. There are four or five players in that generation that have enjoyed some major success in the game in recent times, but the thing I find the most telling is whether or not they have been able to hold their own against O'Sullivan and Higgins in major matches. I think that's what ultimately sets Selby and Robertson apart from the likes of Murphy, Maguire, Carter... Selby's record in finals isn't even all that great, but win or lose, he has always made a match of it, even when things weren't going for him, and as a result he has never failed to entertain me. :wink:


It's not just the fact that it's a bit of a grudge match that makes this pairing so interesting. In a way, these two players encompass the very best snooker has to offer between them. O'Sullivan is the ultimate artist on a snooker table, playing the game with incredible ease and nonchalance, as if it were child's play. You don't get style marks in snooker, like you do in ski jumping, but if you did, O'Sullivan would be even harder to beat. :smile: On the other hand, Selby can play an equally good frame of snooker and make it look like the hardest work he has ever done. The thing I love most about snooker is the tactical and the mental battle players go through, with their opponent as well as themselves. You need the head, the heart and the balls, and there is no one in the game that has more than Selby. In a way, both players' road to the final has been quite fitting this week, O'Sullivan breaking the points without reply record, and Selby winning a classic midnight decider against one of the best players of all time.

The Selby-O'Sullivan finals of 2009 and 2010 broke the most users even online record on this forum both times, so hopefully the match goes close again and we can have some fun. :smile: But who will the winner be? O'Sullivan said in his post-match comments yesterday that he is now in a better shape to handle Selby's game, which is a good sign for him. He is the stronger scorer, so if he can compete in the tactical stuff, like he did in 2009, he has every chance of winning. On the other hand, Selby has won their last couple of major matches, as well as their PTC final this year, so he will have the confidence to compete with O'Sullivan and not just fall apart like Maguire did yesterday. He is one of the few players who can outplay O'Sullivan in the safety, and he is the king of late-night pressure, so the closer it goes, the more chance he has. If he can get the crowd on his side again, like he did on his comeback in 2010, O'Sullivan will be up against it.

As usual, I will take a 10-9 either way at 1am, but if I had to call it, I would say Selby to win. :wink:

[Holden Chinaski]

Good post Odrl

Snooker doesn't get more exciting than this.

[cebs]

I've been at the masters all week and had the best holiday ever. Sadly home since yesterday but watched on the big screen last night and soon today.

I love Ronnie and the way he plays but I will say that I and others clap the opponent whenever suitable. I cheered for Milkins, and said good effort once when he had a kick/bad luck on a shot.

Walden got a cheer in the final frame when he had he chance and before the frame began.

Stephen seemed to have support last night and looked like he enjoyed the match, i would have liked to have heard what he said before he won his second frame, 'please Ronnie let me get one more than Milkins' ?

Selbys win over Higgins, until fridays session, was the best match I've seen in the flesh. What a few frame but at 5-5 59-59 (i think) the blue was amazing. We were up of our seats clapping that one in. And to land on the pink and risk the cut in was brave also. I was second down to shake his and he was about to walk away but turned round and shook peoples hand and signed.

Murphy was the manners of the lot, stayed and signed for every and anyone when he won his first match over 100 people I think. Sadly someone took a photo of me and him but it didn't take and in his second match he got whisked away to the studio. I was in my superman t shirt by random luck for his first match but on purpose the next one, missed his semi and he lost. Someone else was in one but guess it wasn't as luckly for him as someone else from Sale.

Robertson was very nice and did photos and signing in the lobby as did all the pundits when asked. Meet Davies, Parrot, Ken, Hendry, White and all the refs.

Ronnie didn't sign anything after any matches but I was very lucky and had stayed late on the night of his first win and was walking out the same time he was being escorted somewhere. I shouted well done and was getting waved off by the guards but Ronnie said he would be right back so I should wait. He then said did I have my book ready and as I did was happy to sign it then. Sadly didn't feel brave enough to ask the guards for a photo and cannot do selfies on my mobile. I told him that if he meet Selby in the final I hoped he turned him over big style for some revenge.

However having watched and meet Selby, i wish him all the best as he is very mild mannered and friendly with crowd. When playing attacking and open play he is great, just the negative grinding I hate. He laughed and looked right at me before his match with Higgins when I shouted Come on the Jester before frame 1.

Hoping for a 10-9 classic today with great snooker from both players, that or a massive comeback from Ronnie.

[svdyc]

Can't wait for the match! What could be better than Selby - O'Sullivan final. Two great and unique players and entertainers. Hoping for Mark to win it, but won't be disappointed either way it goes.