Jump shot????

[Strickimicki]

When is a jump shot a jump shot?

I always thought that to play a jump shot the cue ball had to pass over the object ball on the initial route, but I have been told that this is not the case.

So for example, I play a hard shot into the pack to try and make a plant into some pocket. The cueball hits the desired red causing the plant to take place, but also kicks up and leaves the bed of the table jumping into the pack and over the hit red. Please note that the cueball correctly hit the red on the initial stroke.

Or I play an extremely hard shot causing the cueball to hit the initial ball-on very thinly and the cueball to hit the cushion causing it again to leave the bed of the table. The cueball in turn jumps over the ball-on running the length of the table and away from the initial contact point.

Could somebody somewhere clarify this for me! I now am almost at the point of believing that this is the case.

But then again, on reading some of the points made in other threads. Would that not make any shot that is not a clean contact a jump shot? If the cueball is slightly jumping on its way to the object-ball then it is clearly hitting above center. This would mean that a small part of the ball is being cleared. A snooker ball is a sphere and therefore any contact above middle would be a jump shot!

I know, all very confusing

Thanks for any replies,

Brian

[APK]

If the cue-ball leaves the bed of the table and LANDS on the bed of the table further away than the object ball then it is a jump shot regardless of whether it touches that object ball in the process.
So if the cue ball hits the object ball and both balls travel but the cue ball lands on the near side of the travelling object ball then that is OK.

If the cue ball legally strikes the oject ball and then hits a cushion before jumping over that ball then that is OK too.
Also OK if the jump occurs after hitting another ball after hitting the object ball.

[Terry Davidson]

Neither of your examples is a jump shot foul. I've seen Ronnie intentionally pot a red into a top pocket and have the cueball jump into the middle of the pack. That was the best pack break-out shot I've seen I think

Terry

[Strickimicki]

Any other takers, I'm still not 100% on this!

[Strickimicki]

He who can read!

20. Jump Shot

A jump shot is made when the cue-ball passes over any part of an object ball, whether touching it in the process or not, except:

Section 2 – Snooker

(a) when the cue-ball first strikes one object ball and then jumps over another ball;
(b) when the cue-ball jumps and strikes an object ball, but does not land on the far side of that ball;
(c) when, after striking an object ball lawfully, the cue-ball jumps over that ball after hitting a cushion or another ball.

Thread closed!

[Kyra]

I agree with Terry. Without having seen the shots I'd say that the following part of the rules should answer your question:

19. Jump Shot

A jump shot is made when the cue-ball passes over any part of an object ball, whether touching it in the process or not, except:
(a) when the cue-ball first strikes one object ball and then jumps over another ball,
(b) when the cue-ball jumps and strikes an object ball, but does not land on the far side of that ball,
(c) when, after striking an object ball lawfully, the cue-ball jumps over that ball after hitting a cushion or another
ball.

First situation:
The cue ball hit the ball on correctly and then, after getting into the pack and therefore hitting other reds, jumps over another ball. It's covered in letter (c).
Second Situation:
Clear to me and covered in letter (c) as well. First correctly hit by the cue ball, then into the cushion and finally the "jump" over the ball on.

[The Statman]

The general principle is that, if the cue-ball jumps over (even partially) a ball, the judgement of foul is if it lands on the far side of the ball. If it has been hit at an angle, then obviously a judgement has to be made whether the cue-ball has travelled further when it lands, than the object ball has at that moment.

However, in the situation you describe, where the red has hit another red and so stunted its movement, you would have to be very wary of calling foul. I think, essentially, you would have to judge whether a jump would have taken place if the white and initial red were the only two balls on the table.

Although this may not be strictly covered in subparagraph c (see post above this one), because the cue-ball has not hit another ball, I think the principle can hold because it is essentially making a second, separate hit on the same red due to the amount of topspin applied.

As mentioned in the previous post, hitting the cushion and jumping a ball on the way back is covered in the exception in subparagraph c.

[Strickimicki]

I have now grasped the meaning and the fully understanding of the jump shot. I do though having said that, think that if the cue ball hits the ball-on correctly then jumps over the said ball-on through a kick or what ever else may cause this, then the rules a very unfair.

But rules are rules, and we will obide by them (Unless of course they are mearly driving regulations ,-)).

[ace man]

As mentioned in the previous post, hitting the cushion and jumping a ball on the way back is covered in the exception in subparagraph c.

But subparagraph c states "when, after striking an object ball lawfully...", so it is not clear whether cushion first jumps are allowed, it refers to striking the object ball first and then rebounding off the cushion...at least that's the way I see it. I've only seen cushion first jumps performed as a trick shot.

[The Statman]

Yes, did I misunderstand the original question?

Essentially, after the initial object ball has been hit, anything can jump over anything and it's ok. If you played the cue-ball directly into the cushion and it rebounded and jumped over an object ball, that is a foul.

[Rjcmcmlxxix]

I did have a certified ref clarify to me that Yes you could hit a ball and then jump, but you couldn't jump a ball before hitting one. This could actually be handy, to perhaps avoid hitting another ball.

[Odrl]

Just a quick question on the subject of jump shots...

Am I right in thinking that the ball being jumped over is not actually "involved" in the shot, as far as penalty points are concerned?

For example... When on a red, the cue ball jumps over the pink, without touching it, and then goes on to hit a red first. Am I right in thinking this would only be a penalty of 4 points?

[Souwester]

Yes, it would only be four points.

The rules define the penalty for playing a jump shot as four points (in the four points section), but if the cue ball was to jump and touch the pink in the process (whilst on a red) then the penalty would be six for making contact with a ball not on with first contact (from the section 'higher of ball on or ball concerned'.

[Odrl]

Thanks Souwester.

[tris]

isn't the definition of object ball, the ball you are aiming for? So if you chip the ball purposely over a colour/red to get out of a snooker, in theory that is not a foul. Because you haven't jumped over the object ball, you've jumped over another ball.

I guess that would completely change the physics oof the game because it would make getting out of snookers a whole load easier....