free ball

[nasher]

Red is ball on and a foul is committed - there are 2 reds remaining on table however a colour is directly situated between the cue ball and reds. The player can see the extreme edge of one of the reds and the opposite extreme edge of the other red. Please clarify if this is a free ball (this caused quite a stir at a match last night!)

[DeanH]

Your scenario depends on whether the cue-ball is snookered on the ball(s) on, the Reds:

Section 2 - 17. Snookered
The cue-ball is said to be snookered when a direct stroke in a straight line to every ball on is wholly or partially obstructed by a ball or balls not on. If one or more balls on can be struck at both extreme edges free of obstruction by any ball not on, the cue-ball is not snookered.

From your description an extreme edge can be played with a direct straight line stoke on one or more ball on; therefore no snooker, therefore no free ball.
Obviously, the usual options of a foul apply, so he can have the opponent play again, etc., etc.
If the situation was that only one extreme edge can be seen of one Red, again no snooker, no free ball, normal foul options apply.
If the extreme edge cannot be hit on any ball on, snooker after the foul then a free ball is called, and free ball options apply.

[nasher]

Thanks DeanH

I interpreted the rule as not a free ball but another player interpreted statement If one or more balls on can be struck at both extreme edges free of obstruction as meaning that if both extreme edges of either red could not be struck in a straight line then it was a free ball

Anyway it did cause a fun debate for about 15 minutes!!

[neilcounter]

I thought that you had to be able to see both side of the reds?

[jrc750]

.....If the situation was that only one extreme edge can be seen of one Red, again no snooker, no free ball, normal foul options apply.

Are you sure about that ????

I thought that you had to be able to see both side of the reds?

So did I !!!!!!

[coomsey76]

You are right there Neil and jrc.....

The way I'm reading the opening post is that the striker can only see the one side of 1st red and only one side 2nd red, therefore the striker can't not hit both edges of one red..... so its a free ball.

[shanerayner28]

free ball

wot dean as said sounds like the snooker rule in world pool rules to me or is it wen u don't need to hit the cushion in a total snooker

[DeanH]

"both" the important word here that I missed.

snookered, free ball as per your scenario.

The OP mentions that you can see one edge of one ball and the opposite edge of another, that is regardless, they are different balls so the "both" edges cannot be combined from different balls.

[DeanH]

wot dean as said sounds like the snooker rule in world pool rules to me or is it wen u don't need to hit the cushion in a total snooker

the rule was from the World Snooker book - which obviosuly I need to read again
World Rules Pool - you are correct that if Total snookered you do need to hit a cushion after hitting the object ball. But the definition of a snooker is the same "1. Definition: A player is Snookered when it is impossible to play the finest cut possible on both sides of any of that player's own Colour by way of a "straight - line" shot. Snookering an opponent is not a foul." this applies for a Foul Snooker
But the definition of a Total Snooker is different "i. Definition: A player is in a Total Snooker when it is impossible to play any part of any of the player's own Colour by way of a "straight line" shot. Leaving an opponent in a Total Snooker is not a foul."

[nasher]

As with any rule there is often more than one interpretation! It would be much clearer if the rule referred to a single ball on rather than "one or more" - if indeed that is the intention

[The Statman]

My article Free Ball – How to judge if you have one may be of help.

When there are 2 or more reds on the table, what you must do is judge each one individually, as if it were the only one on the table.

If every red comes back as a "YES", then it's a free ball.
If any red comes back as a "NO", then it isn't a free ball.

In your situation, I'm assuming the scenario is:

.O (white)

.• (pink)
•• (two reds)

...in which case YES, it's a free ball, because you can't hit both sides of one red (if it was the only one), and you can't hit both sides of the other red (if it was the only one).

[DeanH]

brill!

[pottr]

Lovely use of colours!

[Souwester]

Statman is spot on, as usual. It is a free ball because you can't see both sides of any particular red.

[bally969]

yep/ It's a free ball, you are snookered on both reds by not being able to hit both sides of a red,
Let's say only one red on after a foul, you can clearly hit three quaters of that red as it is behind
a colour, this would be a free ball would it not, so the situation is just the same.