Touching ball

[steve clarke]

I need a bit of help with the touching ball rules.

The rules state that if the white comes to rest touching a ball that is on, or could be on, the player can play away from it without incurring a penalty.

Suppose I pot a red and the CB comes to rest touching the yellow.

I then play away from the yellow and pot the green, all in the same stroke.

Have I committed a foul?

Cheers.

[DeanH]

Well, firstly, When a touching ball has been called, the striker must play the cue-ball away from that ball without moving it or it is a push stroke.
In your scenario, touching yellow, playing green, is fine (no foul) as long at the striker has declared that the ball he wants on is the green. Just because the cue ball is touching a ball, it does not mean that ball is on.
Take the scenario that your turn starts and the cue ball touching a colour, obviously the ball on will be a red, as long as the ball touching the cue ball does not move, this is a scenario that the striker does not have to indicate which ball he is declaring on as it is automatically red, the other is when only the colours are left, so the order of colours dictates the ball on.

[Souwester]

DeanH seems to have summed it up quite well.

When you've potted a red and come to rest touching a colour, or come to the table with a free ball wghen the cue ball is touching a colour, then it is essential that you declare which colour you're going to play. You can. of course, nominate the colour the cue ball is touching and simply play away, or you can legitimately nominate another colour and pot it. As with any nomination of a ball, that is the colour you have to strike first.

[steve clarke]

Thanks very much DeanH and Souwester.

Much clearer now!

[steve clarke]

Sorry to resurrect this but I've been mulling it over and I'm still not 100% clear.

I follow everything that's been said so far but:

If it's now my turn and my opponent has left me with a ball touching the yellow - do I HAVE to hit a red or can I just play away and not hit anything?

Cheers.

[DeanH]

Yes you do, if there are reds and the start of your turn, you must play to the ball on, in this case any Red.
If you do not contact a red or the Yellow moves (or both), foul and four away.

[Souwester]

Yes you do, if there are reds and the start of your turn, you must play to the ball on, in this case any Red.
If you do not contact a red or the Yellow moves (or both), foul and four away.

A proviso to that statement: if the referee is satisfied that the player has played away from the ball, but the ball which the cue ball had been touching moves as he plays his shot because of imperfections of the table (such as it rolling into a little divot as the cue ball moves away) then it is not a foul.

[Souwester]

Sorry to resurrect this but I've been mulling it over and I'm still not 100% clear.

I follow everything that's been said so far but:

If it's now my turn and my opponent has left me with a ball touching the yellow - do I HAVE to hit a red or can I just play away and not hit anything?

Cheers.

You have to consider the question: 'what is the ball on (or can be on)?'. If you come to the table when there are reds on the table (and the previous player hasn;t left you a free ball) then red is the ball on for your first shot. Therefore a red must be the first ball you make contact with. If when you come to the table your cue ball is touching a red, then you're deemed to have automatically made contact with a ball on, and you can, therefore, simply play away from the red without making contact with any other ball. You don't even need to nominate anything.

Now, consider the situation when you've just potted a red. The ball on is a colour of your choice: ie any of the six colours. If you've left yourself touching a red, then you're not touching a ball on, so you must play and hit one of the six colours (the referee will not call 'touching ball' in this mscenario, because the red is not a ball on).

If, having potted a red, you're left with the cue ball touching a colour, (and the referee will have called 'touching ball') then you still have a choice of any of he six colours, so you must choose which one you want as your ball on, and state to the referee. If you choose the ball the cue ball is touching, then as in the first scenario, you can simply play away from it withot touching another ball. It would be perfectly legal if the cue ball travels round the table and hits or even pockets the colour you chose. If you choose one of the other five colours then you must play away from the touching ball and the cue ball must hit the colour you chose.

The other scenario is when you come to the table when a free ball has been declared, when red is the ball on, and the cue ball is touching a colour. You then have to make a choice of playing a red or any of the six colours, and must state your choice.

[steve clarke]

Thank you gentlemen!

Perfect!!

[throtts]

The other scenario is when you come to the table when red is the ball on, and the cue ball is touching a colour. You then have to make a choice of playing a red or any of the six colours, and must state your choice.

Wow, is that correct ? .. Red is ball on so the player has to hit a red surely. I cannot remember seeing this scenario .. Interesting ..

[DeanH]

A proviso to that statement: if the referee is satisfied that the player has played away from the ball, but the ball which the cue ball had been touching moves as he plays his shot because of imperfections of the table (such as it rolling into a little divot as the cue ball moves away) then it is not a foul.

yep, you are right (8(f)), i.e. the cue-ball was stopping the touching ball from rolling into a divot and so moves towards where the cue-ball was and not away - as it would if "hit" by the cue-ball moving - is a definite proviso and a close one for the ref to watch out for.

[DeanH]

The other scenario is when you come to the table when red is the ball on, and the cue ball is touching a colour. You then have to make a choice of playing a red or any of the six colours, and must state your choice.

Wow, is that correct ? .. Red is ball on so the player has to hit a red surely. I cannot remember seeing this scenario .. Interesting ..

hm... you say "you come to the table" so do you mean your start of turn, red ball on, so regardless of the touching ball being a colour the ball on will be red, as per your first statement. I would say that declaration would not be required. yes?
Can you clarify this scenario? cheers

[Souwester]

Wow, is that correct ? .. Red is ball on so the player has to hit a red surely. I cannot remember seeing this scenario .. Interesting ..

Apologies, I omitted a crucial phrase. It should have read:

The other scenario is when you come to the table when a free ball has been declared when red is the ball on, and the cue ball is touching a colour. You then have to make a choice of playing a red or any of the six colours, and must state your choice.

[Souwester]

hm... you say "you come to the table" so do you mean your start of turn, red ball on, so regardless of the touching ball being a colour the ball on will be red, as per your first statement. I would say that declaration would not be required. yes?
Can you clarify this scenario? cheers

I've corrected myself! I missed a rather important phrase. The scenario exists only when a free ball has been declared!

[DeanH]

I was thinking that may have been the case.
cheers for the confirmation.

as per your scenario, you come to the table and your opponent has left the cue-ball touching a colour and there are still red(s) on the table. As the turn is starting, reds would be automatically on and the striker would not have the choice of red or colour but red only? No?