Free ball or what??

[PatFitz]

Hi, I was playing last night and my opponent had a free ball following a foul shot and, had only 2 reds left which he couldn't hit both sides of, so he clained a free ball and played the brown and snookered me on both remaining reds, one behind the green and the other behind his object ball, the brown.
I thought this might be a foul because I was snookered behind his object ball on one red with a legitimate snooker on the other.
Any thoughts??

[DeanH]

I think it is not a foul as you have not been snookered ON ALL REDS behind the nominated free ball.
see diagram 5 and text in http://www.thesnookerforum.com/board...-t)-do-with-it

see also http://www.thesnookerforum.com/board...f-you-have-one

[mooneyy]

Correct DeanH

[tommygunner1309]

Hi, I was playing last night and my opponent had a free ball following a foul shot and, had only 2 reds left which he couldn't hit both sides of, so he clained a free ball and played the brown and snookered me on both remaining reds, one behind the green and the other behind his object ball, the brown.
I thought this might be a foul because I was snookered behind his object ball on one red with a legitimate snooker on the other.
Any thoughts??

No Patfitz it is not a foul - it would only be a foul if the free ball (brown) snookered BOTH reds. As one was snookered by the green it was a legitimate shot

[tommygunner1309]

I should add that the snookering ball is the one considered to be nearest the ball ON. Hence with green being nearest snookering ball to the second red it was a lawful shot

[nrage]

I should add that the snookering ball is the one considered to be nearest the ball ON. Hence with green being nearest snookering ball to the second red it was a lawful shot

17. Snookered
...
(i) the ball nearest to the cue-ball is considered to be the effective snookering ball

I think you meant to say.

[tommygunner1309]

Yes Nrage I worded that incorrectly. Its always difficult to make a decision here when the position of the balls are not clear. If the green was up the table between blue spot and pink and the red was behind it, and the Brown was on its spot with the second red behind that, then nudging up to the brown would not be a foul. If all four balls were in the baulk end, it may well be a different story. If Patfitz could give a description of where all the balls were placed then it would be easier to make a decision

[PatFitz]

Yep, I should have explained the ball positions better. Actually there wasn't a lot between the green and brown but the green was probably a bit nearer to the right of my cue ball with the brown having been pushed down the table towards the other red.
So I guess it was a legal snooker on the red behind the green but had he just rolled up quietly and laid it on the brown would that have been a foul?
Thanks for you help.

[DeanH]

The aspect of the distance and which is closest does not apply in this instance as it is the fact that ALL the Reds are NOT snookered by the nominated free ball.
sec 3 Rule 12 (b)(ii)
(b) It is a foul if the cue-ball should:
(ii) be snookered on all Reds, or the ball on, by the free ball thus nominated, except when the Pink and Black are the only object balls remaining on the table.

[nrage]

Yep, I should have explained the ball positions better. Actually there wasn't a lot between the green and brown but the green was probably a bit nearer to the right of my cue ball with the brown having been pushed down the table towards the other red.
So I guess it was a legal snooker on the red behind the green but had he just rolled up quietly and laid it on the brown would that have been a foul?
Thanks for you help.

What you have to do is consider each red in turn, decide for each red if it is snookered, if so which is the closest ball doing the snookering. If, for all reds (balls on) the brown is the snookering ball, then it's a foul. If, for any red, there is another ball which is the snookering ball, then it's not a foul. So, if the green is closer to the white than the brown and snookers any red at all, then it's not a foul.

[tommygunner1309]

Indeed. Nothing to add as DeanH and Nrage have hit the proverbial nail on the head.