Higgns vs Lee Ref decision controversy

[Billy]

You do find some fascinating snooker clips on youtube, and I came across such a clip earlier.

I was wondering if our resident refs here could offer their view on this, and whether it's as clear cut as Thorne, Foulds and Davis are saying. If it is this clear cut, then I'm amazed both Higgins and more so the ref weren't aware of the finer points of the rules.

Interestingly, you see Higgins look to see if the pink will pot at 0:29, so why did he not say anything then?

[cueman]

Thorne is right, you can only query the spotting of the ball immediately after it has been potted and re-spotted. As soon as you complete the next stroke that ball is deemed to be in the correct position and the only way a ref can move a ball is if he cleans it and uses his ball marker. Its a bit of an anomoly though because a player could ask for a ball to be cleaned and quite often the ref if he knows that the ball is on its spot he won't use his marker. The trouble with spots on a snooker table is they create a divot and quite often can move or rock into the divet and sometimes balls pot that never did before and vice versa. The ref on this incident was wrong though because Higgins asked him to re-spot it.

[Billy]

Mmm, I still don't understand why, when Higgins looks to see if the pink will pot into the corner at 0:29, immediately after the ref has respotted it, he doesn't mention it then.

[wildJONESEYE]

Mmm, I still don't understand why, when Higgins looks to see if the pink will pot into the corner at 0:29, immediately after the ref has respotted it, he doesn't mention it then.

maybee as cueman said the ball did rock back a bit.

either way it should not be put back.

[cueman]

As I said its possible that because the spot creates a little divot that the pink would pot. But then John plays the next shot so that pink cannot be re-spotted again because its deemed to be in play now. John possibly by bridging close to the pink and red on the next shot could have pushed his fingers firm enough into the bed of the table to cause the pink to rock back into the divot and then the next time he looks he notices the pink now doesn't spot. Its unfortunate but you can't just move the balls to your advantage over something like that.

Its a bit like the rule when a colour is potted but its spot is not available and has to go as close to its spot beneath it. Sometimes the ball can rock slightly so quite often a player will always check because the balls are so close together as they were in the instance with the pink. You simply cannot play a stroke after and then ask the ref to move the ball, you have to do it immediately after it has been spotted and not after the next shot has been played.

[Billy]

John possibly by bridging close to the pink and red on the next shot could have pushed his fingers firm enough into the bed of the table to cause the pink to rock back into the divot and then the next time he looks he notices the pink now doesn't spot.

Ahh, gottcha. That does sound the most feasible. Still unbelievable to think that a professional snooker player and referee deemed it perfectly acceptable to put the pink back into a pottable position.

[ADR147]

i think the ref moved it a fraction when he pulled his hand away when respotting it, it happens.

[mythman69]

Yes the ref made a mistake, Lee could have challenged it but didn't. Play on . . .

; )

[TheRowdyOne]

What would be the outcome of Lee's challenge? Re-Re spotting the pink onto it's spot.... Same outcome don't you think? I don't see how Lee could ask for the pink to be put back to not being on the spot.

[mythman69]

He would have to challenge before the ball was re-spotted - and the ref should have then not moved it - play on . . .

[TheRowdyOne]

Yes I understand that Should have happened before the ref touched the ball, but after the ball has been moved there isn't much that can be done is there?

At 1:50 someone says " Stephen Lee is entitled to have a word to him about that". After the ball has been moved. In the clip Stephen looks completely confused.....