law/ruling please

[shadow]

blue ,pink and black are left on table.player 'A' fouls and in doing so snookers player 'B'. a free ball in called......my question is can player B nominate pink[or black] as his free ball and plant it onto the blue and pot it legally???????????????????? my point would be that blue is the colour on and blue is the ball potted???? any refs out there know the answer????

[DeanH]

Potting the Ball On with the nominated free ball, is OK.
The Free Ball is for this shot, in essence, a Blue, so Blue (Free Ball) onto Blue (Blue) to pot Blue (Blue) is acceptable.
In this situation, the Blue would stay in the pocket, and Pink would be the next Ball on.
If the Free Ball was potted (the Pink or Black), this ball would be spotted and Blue would be ball on.

[DawRef]

If the Free Ball was potted (the Pink or Black), this ball would be spotted and Blue would be ball on.

Also remember that in this situation, if the free ball was also potted (as well as the blue), the player would only get 5 points and not 10.

[tomw]

True.

I once won a frame that way...
Only pink and black on the table, and I was 3 points behind. My opponent fouled and left a free ball. I started smiling, he didn't know why... I nominated the black and planted the pink with it. Only the black left on the table and I'm 9 points ahead, so frame over :-)))

I think my opponent still has nightmares over that ;-)

[shadow]

Also remember that in this situation, if the free ball was also potted (as well as the blue), the player would only get 5 points and not 10.

this would be legal???......would the pink be respotted??????

[mooneyy]

Yes and yes... next ball on would be pink

[misspentoldage]

No, that's not right, is it? Next ball on would not be pink as it has been legally potted via the free ball. Next ball on would be black, but in tomw's example there would be no next ball as he is 9 points ahead with only black left. Game over.

[tommygunner]

No, that's not right, is it? Next ball on would not be pink as it has been legally potted via the free ball. Next ball on would be black, but in tomw's example there would be no next ball as he is 9 points ahead with only black left. Game over.

Not quite sure if I have the scenario in mind here, so I might be seeing it wrong. If only pink and black remain, and a free ball is called and the player chooses black as the free ball, hits black and knocks pink into pocket via a plant then it is a legal pot and pink stays down. If aggregate scores do not count then the black need not be played.

[mooneyy]

misspentoldage and tommygunner: I referred to Shadow's post who reffered to DawRef, who in turn referred to the original one where blue, pink and black are left on the table.

A player can legally nominate pink or black as free ball and plant it onto the blue in order to pot it.

If the player not only pots the blue, but for instance pink (nominated free ball) as well, 5 points (and only five, as stated by DawRef) are scored. Blue stays in the pocket, pink is spotted...

12. Snookered After a Foul
After a foul, if the cue-ball is snookered (see Section 2, Rule 17), the referee shall state FREE BALL.
...
(e) If both the nominated ball and a ball on are potted, only the ball on is scored unless it was a Red, when each ball potted is scored. The free ball is then spotted and the ball on remains off the table.

[misspentoldage]

Sorry, mooneyy, I thought you were referring to tomw's post where the scenario was only the pink and the black were left on the table when he took the free ball. Crossed wires now sorted - of course you're quite right.

[misspentoldage]

different scenario

How about this as a slightly different scenario - after failing to get out of the snooker my opponent has left me with the final red touching the black and in a position where I can plant the black with the red. I am on a free ball because I can't hit the side of the red that's touching the black. Can I nominate 'black' as my free ball but actually strike the red, thus potting black via the plant? My thought is that nominating the black makes it the extra red, so I'm effectively potting one red with another. Correct?

[DeanH]

How about this as a slightly different scenario - after failing to get out of the snooker my opponent has left me with the final red touching the black and in a position where I can plant the black with the red. I am on a free ball because I can't hit the side of the red that's touching the black. Can I nominate 'black' as my free ball but actually strike the red, thus potting black via the plant? My thought is that nominating the black makes it the extra red, so I'm effectively potting one red with another. Correct?

The nominated ball must be the first ball hit by the cue ball, so I don't think your scenario is legal. [12(b)(I)]
now if the Red/Black were struck simultaneously, that is ok, I think this is one of the two situations when simultaneous hitting of two balls is allowed, i.e. the ball on and nominated free ball. The other is two reds.

[tommygunner1309]

How about this as a slightly different scenario - after failing to get out of the snooker my opponent has left me with the final red touching the black and in a position where I can plant the black with the red. I am on a free ball because I can't hit the side of the red that's touching the black. Can I nominate 'black' as my free ball but actually strike the red, thus potting black via the plant? My thought is that nominating the black makes it the extra red, so I'm effectively potting one red with another. Correct?

You can not nominate a ball and hit another ball first. You must hit the nominated ball or a foul will be called. As DeanH says, you can hit two balls simultaneously as long as it is ball on with nominated free ball, or two reds. Yes, after a foul and free ball called, you can nominate black as the free ball - but as I said - you must therefore strike black first - or both simlultaneously - but you cannot hit the red first.