Miss in amateur league

[frigopie]

First of all, hi all! it's my first message here

We have (ok, in fact it's a me VS the rest of the my club) a discussion topic in my snooker/pool club about the miss rule. We don't have referee, and our level is about 30 best break in a match. Well, the problem, from my point of view, is that, as we don't have a referee, we call MISS always, even if there was a very though snooker to save and tried my best to hit the ball 'on'. In my opinion, we should only call miss if there was a direct shot to a ball 'on', but my mates (that have more Snooker experience and culture) say that it is always a miss because they see it on TV (i know very well the official snooker rules, for other reasons). I have tried to explain them, that they see the referee call a miss mostly because a pro should be able to hit the 'on' ball no matter the shot difficulty, but that is not the case, we are amateurs, low level amateurs in fact, and we are applying the rule even harder than for the pro players. What do you think? if there is any pro referee here, I would love to hear his/her opinion about this topic.

Thank you

[jrc750]

Some people say everybody should play the miss rule, as it is in the rule book, but maybe not enforce it as strictly as for the pros.
In my leagues we do not use it, as without a ref to take control, all you end up with is lots of arguments and people fall out, your supposed to enjoy the game not end up accusing your opponent of cheating lol, in my eyes nothing wrong with playing the shot yourself or if you don't like it, put him back in, works just fine

[itsnoteasy]

We play the miss rule and it's a nightmare , the home team refs, different ref for each game, some are strict some never call it and that's all on the same night, never seen it questioned though which is a good thing, we might moan amongst ourselves if we feel hard done by, but never to the ref or the other team. As Terry says the pros don't play the miss rule, they play the must hit rule, that's not on at local league level.

[SnkrRef]

I don't see a problem with at least part of the miss rule being applied in any game: ie where the striker can see at least some part of a ball on and he fails to hit it, there should be no arguments. However, when the striker is snookered then due regard must be had for the ability of the player and the difficulty of the snooker. That's where arguments can occur.

The league I play in has always played the 'foul and a miss' rule ever since it was introduced in the 1992 rule book (is it really over 21 years ago?!?) and by and large there are no arguments. Most opponents know that the striker is playing to the best of his ability to get out of a snooker, and very few misses are actually called. Having said that there is one player who is one of the best in the league who will always try to get whatever advantage he can from the rules (including cheating!), and he probably calls more misses than all the other players put together. I've not really know any arguments when misses have been called.

[Byrom]

Personally it has cost me big time on more than one occasion some leagues use it some dont but if it is the same for all players then there are no complaints - problem is in the refs understanding what constitutes a miss - I still I think they should play it but for example if there is no real natural angle without making it possible by using side then that is one way a miss might not be called but how many refs know that?

What about the discretion of playing to hit the last red full length of the table when snookered behind green like I was once in a final - I tried to hit it using two cushions missed it by less than an inch three times missed 6 in total trying hard to hit it obviously but got called a miss 6 times. lost frame cost me 200 pounds that one. I did not complain it was an ESB ref I think they call them - I did not complain as he was right and I never over rule or argue the toss with any ref even if they are wrong because they know best and I am a gent that way - he understood too and actually said sorry to me after the match which I appreciated but its a harsh one to take for many am players and I understand this point of veiw too.

Other things contributed to my downfall in the match like him fluking the last three balls and me giving 40 start a frame but these are the joys of snooker - made a 67 break in that last frame and still lost - no complaints.

Well one - Chippy was shut on my way home.

[jrc750]

.... - no complaints.

Well one - Chippy was shut on my way home.

Lol very unlucky, kebab ????

[DrumBass]

In our league we have so called 3 misses rule. Oponent can only place it back 3 times. We don't have a referee but so far I haven't seen anyone complain (all gentelmens)

[chrisoverson]

None of our local team/doubles/singles events here use the miss rule, generally because we know you can't always guarantee it will go back in the right place, and a lot of refs wouldn't always implement it properly.

It's generally acknowledged that you must try your hardest to hit the object ball though, and it's very rare to see any deliberate fouls. The only argument I've seen is where a low handicapper was irritated that his opponent had deliberately tried to play off two cusions to glance off the reds, rather than hit the pack full. He missed but the ball landed safely on the baulk cusion, so he "got away with it", so to speak.

[jb134]

The rule is ok at the top level or in scratch events when everyone is deemed to be at the same level. In the amateur game I'm sick of seeing guys who can't score 30 getting 32 points in misses for rolling up behind the green. It's a joke rule to stop cheating at high levels and shouldn't be used in local events.

[vmax4steve]

The rule is ok at the top level or in scratch events when everyone is deemed to be at the same level. In the amateur game I'm sick of seeing guys who can't score 30 getting 32 points in misses for rolling up behind the green. It's a joke rule to stop cheating at high levels and shouldn't be used in local events.

Good point, so why not implement a rule of cushion must be touched by any ball for every stroke played to prevent that cowardly roll behind the colour.

[chrisoverson]

Good point, so why not implement a rule of cushion must be touched by any ball for every stroke played to prevent that cowardly roll behind the colour.

In snooker that's not practical. Other than the fact it greatly increases the difficulty because of the table size, it's not really necessary. Gentle roll-ups etc are a vital part of the safety side of the game, it's only a problem when the opponent is too low a standard to hit their object ball and continually suffer from "foul and a miss". This is why we're saying it shouldn't be played at a amateur level.

[vmax4steve]

In snooker that's not practical. Other than the fact it greatly increases the difficulty because of the table size, it's not really necessary. Gentle roll-ups etc are a vital part of the safety side of the game, it's only a problem when the opponent is too low a standard to hit their object ball and continually suffer from "foul and a miss". This is why we're saying it shouldn't be played at a amateur level.

It's very practical, it was used in the recent snooker shoot out. Gentle roll ups behind a colour are cowardly and the pros use them now to simply gain points from the miss rule, stretching out every frame with miss after miss until a red is finally hit leaving it safe.

Such shots are only vital for those without the ability or imagination to come up with anything else or those simply wanting to gain points from misses.

[jb134]

Good point, so why not implement a rule of cushion must be touched by any ball for every stroke played to prevent that cowardly roll behind the colour.

Don't get me wrong, am not saying its cowardly. In many cases it's the way the game should be played. However the shot is not worth more than four reds and four blacks.

[guernseygooner]

We play the miss rule in our top division but unfortunately it is not consistently applied by all. The top players understand it fully as amateurs and won't call one when reffing if, for example someone is faced with a 2 cushion escape and they get within 6'' or so and the attempt had enough power in it.

The less knowledgeable call it for everything and it causes a lot of friction. There argument sometimes is that ''it was a 1 cushion escape". The fact there might be 10 feet of table between the 2 balls and loads of side was required isn't taken into consideration. My worst gripe here is there are some players who when left plum in the balls with an easy starter will take the miss instead to try and get as many fouls as possible.

[andyco999]

Hi All
I have joined my local league for the first time and we play the miss rule.

It has brought on some raised eyebrows at times but hasn't ended up with much more than the odd groan.

I feel that playing the miss rule is a good thing at most levels, it helps a player understand the angles better and installs the importance of a tactical game, which snooker is. A few players I have come across just want to pot balls and go for every shot, they then feel hard done by when there opponent plays good safety.

A good coach will always advise regarding shot selection at the individuals personal level (cant pot like Ronnie so don't try).

If you play a very good snooker on your opponent you should be rewarded for it, rather than, that was a very difficult snooker you got me in so you cant call a miss.

Remember the clues in the name, SNOOKER.