Miss Rule question from last night

[Oldgit]

My mate and I always play the miss rule when we play each other and last night a situation happened where we were not 100% sure about.

Only blue pink and black remained and I was 21 ahead. My mate snookered me and I missed the snooker by a whisker!! As a snooker was required I said that he couldn't call a miss but my mate said that because I had missed the snooker he was now only 16 points behind and a miss could be called.

Who was correct?

Thanks
Oldgit

[DeanH]

edit - because penalty points were required BEFORE the stroke, a Miss would not be called.




my previous response below is incorrect - please ignore - see following discussion posts.


your friend is correct, a Miss would be called as penalty points are no longer required as a result of the stroke played.
sec 14
(a) ... If the referee considers the Rule infringed, he shall call FOUL AND A MISS unless:
(i) any player needed penalty points before, or as a result of, the stroke
being played;

[Oldgit]

Thanks Dean, oh dear I won the frame so I may keep quiet!!

your friend is correct, a Miss would be called as penalty points are no longer required as a result of the stroke played.

sec 14
(a) ... If the referee considers the Rule infringed, he shall call FOUL AND A MISS unless:
(i) any player needed penalty points before, or as a result of, the stroke
being played;

[Odrl]

your friend is correct, a Miss would be called as penalty points are no longer required as a result of the stroke played.

sec 14
(a) ... If the referee considers the Rule infringed, he shall call FOUL AND A MISS unless:
(i) any player needed penalty points before, or as a result of, the stroke
being played;

I think you highlighted the wrong part there. Oldgit's opponent needed penalty points before the shot was played, so the miss wouldn't be called on that shot. Oldgit was then 16 points ahead with 18 on, so if there was another snooker and he missed the escape again, the snooker could then be called, because neither player needed penalty points before or after the shot. Or am I missing something? :wink:

[DeanH]

you may be right, this is the problem with the words used in the rule book sometimes, where you have the "unless" scenario, i.e the indirect scenario; instead of using words to stay in the direct scenario.
My reading of this is, as a result of the stroke penalty points are no longer required, a Miss would be called. Yes, penalty points were required before the stroke BUT as result of the stroke they are no longer required...

I see where you are are coming from, I am re-reading and re-reading the passage....
To me with the words used there is an inference that "as result of the stroke there is no longer penalty points required situation, a Miss shall be called".


shall await SnkrRef's contribution

Oldgit - jury out still

[SnkrRef]

Sorry Dean your first post was incorrect. The important word in the rule quoted is 'OR'. If either of the two situations exist then no miss is called - ie one of the players needed penalty points beforfe the shot OR after it.

[DeanH]

Sorry Dean your first post was incorrect. The important word in the rule quoted is 'OR'. If either of the two situations exist then no miss is called - ie one of the players needed penalty points beforfe the shot OR after it.

SnkrRef - many thanks for that clarification. (no need to apologies )
Oldgit - you won the frame fair and square.