Question re 'Free ball'

[DeanH]

or something like that

[bluenose1940]

At the club this afternoon a group were discussing something that they had seen on TV re a free ball situation.

It seems that the person who raised the point had been watching a game whereby a free ball had been granted and the player nominated the black as the free ball. The Black was duly potted but the white went on to hit another red and duly potted that too. The group all thought that the player at the table had therefore scored two points and could then go on to nominate a colour but, he was halted at that point and told that he had fouled and the penalty was 7 away. Was that correct and could someone throw a little more light on the situation please.

[DeanH]

Question re 'Free ball'

The black as the free nominated free ball is regarded as the same as the ball on, in this case a red. So it is the same as potting 2 reds, 2 points scored. No foul. Black is spotted. Red stays in the pocket.
Continue to then play colour of choice.

[DeanH]

In addition, if the ball on is a colour (i.e. no reds left) say yellow and the black is nominated as free ball, black is potted and so is the yellow on the same stroke - no foul, 2 points scored, black is spotted and yellow stays off the table. Green next ball on as usual.
Now, it is just 2 points and not 4 because unlike reds there is only one of each colour at the start of the frame so no multiple score for potting in effect 2 balls of same value.

[bluenose1940]

DeanH, your line of thinking is exactly the same as mine but, it seems that the referee in this instance called a foul and awarded 7 points to the opponent. Apparently this was in a match involving Selby, did he play today?

[DeanH]

Well by your description the referee was wrong. By all I have read and seen the scenario is as above. Do you know the match and frame when this happened?
Got to say as well that in the rules the referee's decision is final so no comeback but definitely something for the ref association to review it the scenario is as you describe and send out a communique to the membership.

[itsnoteasy]

DeanH, your line of thinking is exactly the same as mine but, it seems that the referee in this instance called a foul and awarded 7 points to the opponent. Apparently this was in a match involving Selby, did he play today?

He did he played Mark Allen. The thing that confuses me is why on Earth he got penalised seven? At worst it's four( although it's not a foul) as the black is a red in this instance,so a double mistake by the ref.

[Big Splash!]

Sounds like the ref had memory loss there. Did he forget that he'd indicated a free ball and that the black had been nominated? Momentary lapse of reason. That's a big blunder though. Didn't the player at the table question it?

[bluenose1940]

Thanks for your input folks. Its interesting because the chap that actually watched it on TV described what had happened regarding the balls potted etc and then he asked us all in turn what we thought was the outcome and, most of us thought that the player had scored two points and would then proceed to nominate a colour. he then told us that we were all wrong and that a penalty of 7 points had been award to the opponent. This was all discussed around mid=afternoon today and so he had obviously been watching it just a little earlier.

Does anyone know if a re-run or highlights of the match can be seen anywhere. I'd love to get this sorted.

[itsnoteasy]

I'm sure it will be on YouTube soon, I had a quick look only saw the Smurph/Fu QF .

[DeanH]

Question re 'Free ball'

I will see if the match is on YouTube somewhere

Found it, which frame?
https://youtu.be/kTun0Vkb2M4

[Londonlad147]

Got to say as well that in the rules the referee's decision is final so no comeback

The player could always ask for the opinion of the head referee/ TD. They have been known to overrule the referee on a matter of fact, but 99% of the time will beck the referee where it is a judgement call.

One incident which comes to mind was the China Open 2015 (I think) where there were various wrong calls under the F&M rule, one of which involved the referee calling a miss and balls being replaced, only for Selby (I think) to turn round and say you can't call a miss, and asked for Jan Verhaas to be consulted. He agreed the miss shouldn't have been called and the balls shouldn't have been replaced so they were placed back to where they were!

[jonny66]

Remember the good/bad old days when there was about 4 different referees in professional snooker?

[DeanH]

At the club this afternoon a group were discussing something that they had seen on TV re a free ball situation.

It seems that the person who raised the point had been watching a game whereby a free ball had been granted and the player nominated the black as the free ball. The Black was duly potted but the white went on to hit another red and duly potted that too. The group all thought that the player at the table had therefore scored two points and could then go on to nominate a colour but, he was halted at that point and told that he had fouled and the penalty was 7 away. Was that correct and could someone throw a little more light on the situation please.

I think I have found it, unless in one match have the same scenario twice of cannoning a red in off the black!?
https://youtu.be/kTun0Vkb2M4?t=38m53s
I think your friend must have turned away or looked at his facebook/twitter or something
The scenario in the match frame 3 (39mins into the video), Allen fouls and Selby had free ball option. Which he takes and nominates the BROWN (not the black), he pots the Brown, 1pt, Selby then decides to play the Black which is over the green-side black corner pocket, which he does and then cannons into the reds and pots one of those. Foul 7pt penalty.
The Black was not the nominated free ball, so if the OP scenario was this event in frame 3, then it was not what happened as described in the post quoted.

Now, if there is another black/cannoned red in this same match, someone else can find it and tell where it is

[bluenose1940]

I think I have found it, unless in one match have the same scenario twice of cannoning a red in off the black!?
https://youtu.be/kTun0Vkb2M4?t=38m53s
I think your friend must have turned away or looked at his facebook/twitter or something
The scenario in the match frame 3 (39mins into the video), Allen fouls and Selby had free ball option. Which he takes and nominates the BROWN (not the black), he pots the Brown, 1pt, Selby then decides to play the Black which is over the green-side black corner pocket, which he does and then cannons into the reds and pots one of those. Foul 7pt penalty.
The Black was not the nominated free ball, so if the OP scenario was this event in frame 3, then it was not what happened as described in the post quoted.

Now, if there is another black/cannoned red in this same match, someone else can find it and tell where it is

Well spotted DeanH, that must have taken a bit of patience to find that! I would think that you are absolutely right when you say my friend must have looked away and missed the critical point. I can't imagine that it would have happened again in the same match.
When I next see him I will talk him through what I have just watched.
Thanks for your efforts.