What’s the rule in this situation.

[Ricky2112]

While playing a league match my opponent played a shot and screwed the white back towards the middle pocket but just before it went in he swung his cue in anger and whacked the white ball with the side of his cue and sent the white flying around the table. Fortunately the white never hit any other balls.
Where the white stopped was down by the black perfect on a red, he said the white went in the middle and I was to be returned to the D.
Two things went through my head, first being, is that not loss of frame?
I was way ahead and thought at first he had conceded.
Second thought was could I play from where the white stopped as it never entered the pocket and it wasn’t me that hit it.
Anyway to save any argument and ruining a match I lifted it and put it in the D and played from there.
What’s your thoughts on this situation, a ruling would be good.
He did apologise later for his actions.

Cheers Ricky

[DeanH]

What’s the rule in this situation.

Ball in hand is only when the cue ball leaves the bed of the table; dropping into a pocket or forced off the table.
In your situation the cue ball did not leave the bed of the table and you should have played from where the balls came to rest.
You don't say but you did get penalty points for the foul on the cue ball (being hit more than once in a stroke)?

[Ricky2112]

I got 4 point for the white supposingly going in the middle pocket. Cheers Dean that’s what I thought.
Put me right of my game, I was two nil up and ended 2-2 but was hard not to let that situation affect my game.
Cheers for reply,
Ricky

[DeanH]

What’s the rule in this situation.

I assume then he had played a red (or a baulk colour).
It is a game-lesson to be able to move on without these situations staying in your mind and affecting your game.

[vmax]

Put me right of my game, I was two nil up and ended 2-2 but was hard not to let that situation affect my game.
Cheers for reply,
Ricky

That's why he did it.

[Ricky2112]

Ok spoke with my mate, he is 100 % sure that it is lose of frame by my opponent striking the cue ball for a second time in anger. Can someone show me the ruling on the situation?
Cheers Ricky

[Nifty50]

Would be covered by Section 4. The Players. 4.1 Conduct. Ref could deem this to be "ungentlemanly" conduct and either warn the player OR award the frame OR if sufficiently serious award the match.

[DeanH]

As nifty says, Conduct - a warning first on first occurrence and apply appropriate penalty points; if behaviour continues, then ramp up penalty of awarded frame, then possibly Match.

[Nifty50]

PS. Last year in a local tournament a player was snookered. He was a bit frustrated so, swore, then smashed the cue ball at the snookering ball, making no attempt to escape from the snooker. The ref awarded the frame to the other player. NO prior warning. Immediate loss of frame for ungentlemanly conduct. Ref was a qualified ref who is sh** hot on the rules.

[DeanH]

Ok spoke with my mate, he is 100 % sure that it is lose of frame by my opponent striking the cue ball for a second time in anger. Can someone show me the ruling on the situation?Cheers Ricky

Sec 4
1. Conduct
(a) In the event of:
(i) a Player taking an abnormal amount of time over a stroke or the selection of a stroke; or
(ii) any conduct by a Player which in the opinion of the referee is wilfully or persistently unfair; or
(iii) any other conduct by a Player which otherwise amounts to ungentlemanly conduct; or
(iv) refusing to continue a frame;
the referee shall either:
(v) warn the Player that in the event of any such further conduct the frame will be awarded to his opponent; or
(vi) award the frame to his opponent; or
(vii) in the event that the conduct is sufficiently serious, award the game to his opponent.
(b) If a referee has warned the Player under (v) above, in the event of any further conduct as referred to above, the referee must either:
(i) award the frame to his opponent; or
(ii) in the event that the further conduct is sufficiently serious, award the game to his opponent.
(c) If a referee has awarded a frame to a Player's opponent pursuant to the above provisions, in the event of any further conduct as referred to above by the Player concerned, the referee must award the game to the Player's opponent.
(d) Any decision by a referee to award a frame and/or the game to a Player's opponent shall be final and shall not be subject to any appeal.


For the ruling to go straight to loss of frame it would have to be more than just striking the cue-ball a second time - even in anger!
More like throwing the cue-ball across the room! #
Which I have seen - and the perfectly circular dent in the wall is still there!

[Nifty50]

Agreed Dean, striking the cue ball twice isn't that bad. Saw someone throw their chalk accross the room once. No warning. Also saw someone violently kick the table legs. Complaint put in after the event and 3 match ban issued by league.

[snooker_bhoy]

Hi Ricky

Was it between you and your opponent to work out what should happen, or did you have a ref overseeing the game?

Cheers
Ollie

[LoungeChair]

That's why he did it.

Rules should change to nip this behavior, suggest forfeiture of frame for 1st incident, one more time it's forfeiture of match.

[Londonlad147]

Ball in hand is only when the cue ball leaves the bed of the table; dropping into a pocket or forced off the table.
In your situation the cue ball did not leave the bed of the table and you should have played from where the balls came to rest.
You don't say but you did get penalty points for the foul on the cue ball (being hit more than once in a stroke)?

Dean, you're wrong here. The situation is covered by the 'forced off the table' definition at 2.14:

14. Forced off the table
A ball is forced off the table if it comes to rest other than on the bed of the table or in a pocket, or if it is picked up by the striker, or intentionally moved by hand whilst it is in play except as provided for in Section 3 Rule 14(g).

Although it says 'intentionally moved by hand' this is to be interpreted as including deliberately using something other than one's hand to move a ball.

[DeanH]

thanks for the correction