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Cue Deflection / Food for thought finding when trying to find the right cue

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  • Cue Deflection / Food for thought finding when trying to find the right cue

    I was asked to post my reply to an email on here to see what other players feel about my comments !!

    I've had an email this morning asking about a shafts stiffness and playability, in the reply I ended up going into a bit of detail about deflection !!
    I believe deflection is probably one of the most important factors to why players can or can't get on with a cue.
    When players are looking for new cues they generally have an idea to design, size and weight of the cue they want but deflection is never mentioned ?
    Stiffness of shaft is brought up by some players but that doesn't always give a true indication to how the cue will play.
    Players with knowledge about cues will have learned that a cue with a stiff shaft will create less deflection, or that is what they are to believe, the fact is this is very inconsistent !
    There are players using stiff shaft cues that have a good amount of throw / deflection, and players using cues with a lot of flex in the shaft that producing very little throw / push / deflection.

    There are countless players looking for new cues every day, looking for the perfect cue, for players who want the right cue for them to play with it's important that they read this post !

    It comes down to a combination of experience & expectation
    Less experience less expectation
    More experience more expectation.
    Able to adapt / compensate, some players do this well some don't.

    We do deflection test on cues day in day out in the shop, this is to help give an indication of how the cue plays.

    Here is how we do it, test your cues deflection to see how much throw / push / deflection your cue produces, you might be surprised !!

    This was what I wrote to the gentleman this morning.......

    It's hard for me to say/ give advice to which will be best for you, it's personal preference.
    What you are used to / know I can't say.

    You can check your current cue to see how much deflection your cue is producing by placing the cue ball on the brown spot, aim your cue to play directly down the line of the spots over the black spot, now move your cue to either the left or right of centre ( which side you are most comfortable with ) to add side spin, now move your cue over to the side of the cue ball making sure you keep your cue parallel to the line of spots, so you should be aiming your cue just a little to the left or right of the black spot depending which side you've chosen keeping your cue parallel to the spots, ( I hope this makes sense ) Make sure you cue straight through the cue ball keeping your cue on the line of shot - finishing delivered tip towards the side of the black spot you've been addressing.
    What will happen next is the cue ball will travel down the table towards the black spot, watch carefully to see how the cue ball travels down, also where the cue ball goes when it gets to the black spot, this will give you an indication to how much your cue is deflecting when using side.
    Repeat this a few times to check consistency.
    Things to make sure you keep the same, the height / position you strike through the cue ball, ensure you do the same amount of off centre striking, height is very important as well as when striking below centre you create drag which lessens the deflection, striking above centre will create slightly more deflection, so try and keep central height.

    After doing this you will have had the chance to see how your cue is reacting using side and the deflection being created, this is one of the main reasons that players can or can't get on with new cues, players with experience have an expectation to how they expect a cue to play when using side or shots at distance.

    If you've been using a cue with a lot of deflection it's very difficult to use, players do get used to them over time and learn to compensate.
    A cue with little deflection is easier to use and get used to, most cues will naturally create deflection, about half a cue ball ( the edge of the cue ball will go over the black spot ) when doing the deflection test correctly.
    Less than half a cue ball is good, very few cues produce no deflection.
    Last edited by GreenBaize; 22 November 2016, 12:32 PM.
    www.greenbaize.com

  • #2
    very interesting read but also needs a straight table.

    Our match table rolls off more than half a ball on the straight up or down shots
    http://e.imagehost.org/0813/Mellow_yellow_sig1.jpg

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    • #3
      The speed we play the stroke is a little firmer than a lag up and down, making sure to get a nice stroke / contact on the cue ball. The table roll won't come into the equation as it's the first 8ft traveling distance that we get the feed back from. ( Brown to Black spot )
      Last edited by GreenBaize; 22 November 2016, 04:10 PM.
      www.greenbaize.com

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      • #4
        This is completely theoretical without any science. Which imo creates many other issues and confusion for players :snooker:
        "I got injected with the passion for snooker" - SQ_FLYER
        National Snooker Expo
        25-27 October 2019
        http://nationalsnookerexpo.com

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        • #5
          Originally Posted by the lone wolf View Post
          This is completely theoretical without any science. Which imo creates many other issues and confusion for players :snooker:
          It's a comparison so you have a chance of getting a cue that plays the way you want it

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          • #6
            Good post GBL, thanks.

            Cues will also throw for many reasons that you don't mention. Ferrule thickness and material (thin = less throw, plastic/fibre = less throw), thickness of end mass (thicker shafts will throw more), weight of cue, tip type (GBL pro granite tips throw more than any tip I've used, others less so). Shaft material (laminataed shafts throw less - Ramon!) is also important, not forgetting cue action and how sweet with great timing we hit the ball (whackers will get more throw!).

            But what you say about adaptation is important. For those who can't adapt or hit the ball too firmly, choosing a lighter, laminated cue with a smaller tip with a fibre ferrule may be useful.

            That's..............................

            THROW!
            Last edited by Big Splash!; 22 November 2016, 07:39 PM.

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            • #7
              well,

              this one is a very interesting topic.

              sum players do believe the less stifness, the more density.
              something I personally not agree with.

              interesting topic.
              hope we get more comments here.
              we may learn sumthing.

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              • #8
                Originally Posted by Big Splash! View Post
                Good post GBL, thanks.

                Cues will also throw for many reasons that you don't mention. Ferrule thickness and material (thin = less throw, plastic/fibre = less throw), thickness of end mass (thicker shafts will throw more), weight of cue, tip type (GBL pro granite tips throw more than any tip I've used, others less so). Shaft material (laminataed shafts throw less - Ramon!) is also important, not forgetting cue action and how sweet with great timing we hit the ball (whackers will get more throw!).

                But what you say about adaptation is important. For those who can't adapt or hit the ball too firmly, choosing a lighter, laminated cue with a smaller tip with a fibre ferrule may be useful.

                That's..............................

                THROW!
                my friend , how do you do ? glad you have sum time for us.

                Assuming we are dealing with a piece of decent Maple?

                Yes i do believe maple has more density comperd to ash not to mention a solid hit as well ( less deflection ).
                I think JP is one of the cue makers who has explained this very well at his web site.

                good post , btw.

                Comment


                • #9
                  Maple is on average slightly denser than ash, which would mean more end mass and more deflection but at an educated guess going down in diameter by .25mm would even it out, and dump the brass ferrules they are so last century

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                  • #10
                    Originally Posted by Slasher View Post
                    Maple is on average slightly denser than ash, which would mean more end mass and more deflection but at an educated guess going down in diameter by .25mm would even it out, and dump the brass ferrules they are so last century
                    First time we both agree about something.

                    which i consider as an honor.

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                    • #11
                      Ramon, can you tell us again about throw from your laminated cue, that was made by the doc? I could be wrong, my memory is messy.

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                      • #12
                        Originally Posted by Big Splash! View Post
                        Ramon, can you tell us again about throw from your laminated cue, that was made by the doc? I could be wrong, my memory is messy.
                        Solid hit/less deflection. great CB control. amazing finish.

                        Atsanan (Niche Cue) made exactly the same cue for my brother. also from maple.
                        diff design/spsc as mine.
                        Excellent job. high quality maple was used to make that cue .
                        I treid few shots with it. Abit more responsive comperd to mine, though.
                        Last edited by Ramon; 22 November 2016, 09:35 PM.

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                        • #13
                          Originally Posted by Ramon View Post
                          Solid hit/less deflection. great CB control. amazing finish.

                          Atsanan (Niche Cue) made exactly the same cue for my brother. also from maple.
                          diff design/spsc as mine.
                          Excellent job. high quality maple was used to make that cue .
                          I treid few shots with it. Abit more responsive comperd to mine, though.
                          do you think the lamination helps? or is it the fact that its maple?
                          http://e.imagehost.org/0813/Mellow_yellow_sig1.jpg

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                          • #14
                            All cues have varying amounts of throw/deflection. Which is of no real importance. As its also affected by the standard/shape of a good tip and also the condition of the playing surface. I always preferred a cue with very little whip. Although I have been able to pick up just about any cue and play well with it. With no concern about the throw, as a good tip often makes a good cue!!!
                            One occasion...new club...unkept table...dodgy aramith premiers(dirty)...rack cue...all alien! Still was on for a century! Missed long brown on 78!
                            So all this trepidation regards cue length, stiffness, tip size, ferrule material blah blah...is all just an excuse building exercise imo!
                            Just get on with it chaps! ;-p
                            Last edited by inevermissblue; 23 November 2016, 10:03 AM.
                            Cheap and Cheerful! 😄
                            https://wpbsa.com/coaches/simon-seabridge/

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                            • #15
                              Originally Posted by Mellow Yellow View Post
                              do you think the lamination helps? or is it the fact that its maple?

                              They are made of few pieces of maple.
                              So at the end, it "comes to the quality of Maple (wood).

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