Are high deflection cues better when you are in the balls?

[Shockerz]

Being able to move the ball around more in a tighter space can give you lots of options but as the majority of shots should be in a smaller space isn;t this the priority over a stiff cue and the odd long shot to get you in?

Everyone has a tempo that they need to match to the cue to accommodate throw so surely a high deflection cue is more important?

I say this with tongue in cheek but interested to see why it's not a higher focus than a stiffer cue....

[Ramon]

interesting topic Marc.
Amount of deflection. the longer the distance between CB and OB, the easier to determine amount of deflection.
I would say the density of the wood is realy important.
Some players (even coaches) do belive that more density leads to more deflection.
Sumthing i completely disagree.
A Whippy cue could give you sum trouble due to the deflection , imo.
Although , most of the time decent players are able to get used to it and deal with it ( depending on amount of deflection of crs ).

[itsnoteasy]

I play with quite a springy cue, until you are getting outside the main meat of the cue ball it makes no difference to the deflection compared to my other cues.

[Shockerz]

interesting topic Marc.
Amount of deflection. the longer the distance between CB and OB, the easier to determine amount of deflection.
I would say the density of the wood is realy important.
Some players (even coaches) do belive that more density leads to more deflection.
Sumthing i completely disagree.
A Whippy cue could give you sum trouble due to the deflection , imo.
Although , most of the time decent players are able to get used to it and deal with it ( depending on amount of deflection of crs ).

This is the point of the thread really. I like to play most shots with side etc and rarely hit the ball in the middle but as soon as I play longer shots the deflection (throw) increases which I expect.

I have only ever owned 2 cues I have played with and am not a guy whose generally a searcher for the Holy Grail of cues but........My cues is really whippy and I sometimes get a little too much throw in the balls when I get carried away even over a short distance (not often but you can tell when the ball moves off line (obviously I'm cueing perfectly!!)

I have considered going to a stiffer cue next summer and getting used to it over the off season just to prove it will decrease long ball deflection and still be good in the balls.

I like how I can get the ball to move off line a fair bit when you are in the balls as it gives you scope (although at present my game is pants).

Just interested whether some of you guys would rather a whippy cue in the balls compared to a stiff shaft or whether you feel you get more throw with a stiff shaft?

[Shockerz]

I play with quite a springy cue, until you are getting outside the main meat of the cue ball it makes no difference to the deflection compared to my other cues.

I used to play a fair bit of billiards years ago with a good player and he would hit the cue ball at 3 o'clock sometimes as far right as you could get and the ball would throw loads of his springy cue.

The poor old guys been dead over 20 years but I still remember watching him cue and the sound it made before sliding off at a ridiculous angle.

You say it makes no difference in the meat of the cue ball so I wonder if you had a stiffer cue whether it does makes a difference with them.

There are so many opinions on this!

[vmax4steve]

You get used to your cue over time and it's deflection becomes ingrained into your subconscious. Getting a noticeably lower or higher deflecting cue would take some getting used to, and even if you do you run the risk of sinking back into your subconscious game.

I learned to use side from the get go, the natural angles are somewhat unknown to me because of this, I always use side to escape snookers for example, use running side for thin cuts, and not just a tip off centre either, I really strike the outside edge of the cue ball.
If I switched to another cue it simply wouldn't work.

[Ramon]

This is the point of the thread really. I like to play most shots with side etc and rarely hit the ball in the middle but as soon as I play longer shots the deflection (throw) increases which I expect.

I have only ever owned 2 cues I have played with and am not a guy whose generally a searcher for the Holy Grail of cues but........My cues is really whippy and I sometimes get a little too much throw in the balls when I get carried away even over a short distance (not often but you can tell when the ball moves off line (obviously I'm cueing perfectly!!)

I have considered going to a stiffer cue next summer and getting used to it over the off season just to prove it will decrease long ball deflection and still be good in the balls.

I like how I can get the ball to move off line a fair bit when you are in the balls as it gives you scope (although at present my game is pants).

Just interested whether some of you guys would rather a whippy cue in the balls compared to a stiff shaft or whether you feel you get more throw with a stiff shaft?

Welcome to the world of snooker trouble, Marc!!

AS already mentioned, you can get used to your cue.
The problem is, once you decide to swich to another cue takes time to get used to it again. Bcuz every cue deflect differently.
Sometimes your game can suffer cuz of this. of course, the technique of the player is realy important. Decent players are usually able to notice the amount of deflection the cue have, in a very short time , Not to mention, be able to find out which cue does suits their game in a short time as well.

While Players who are not able to feel the shot, players with a Robatic cue action need more time to figure that out, imo.
I think every cue have some amount of deflection. the one more, other one less. Choose for a cue with less deflection is important imo. This in order to make your job more comfortable, not to mention much easier once you decide to change it.

For me, A stiff and dense shaft (Dense, NOT whippy), is the perfect combination to play snooker. Stiffness in order to get a solid hit and density in order to create spin .

I think, it's a matter of personal preference. you gonna have to try the cue and find out which one suits your technique .

Whatever you do , please do not buy a accurate 147 cue !! :snooker:

[Shockerz]

Welcome to the world of snooker trouble, Marc!!

AS already mentioned, you can get used to your cue.
The problem is, once you decide to swich to another cue takes time to get used to it again. Bcuz every cue deflect differently.
Sometimes your game can suffer cuz of this. of course, the technique of the player is realy important. Decent players are usually able to notice the amount of deflection the cue have, in a very short time , Not to mention, be able to find out which cue does suits their game in a short time as well.

While Players who are not able to feel the shot, players with a Robatic cue action need more time to figure that out, imo.
I think every cue have some amount of deflection. the one more, other one less. Choose for a cue with less deflection is important imo. This in order to make your job more comfortable, not to mention much easier once you decide to change it.

For me, A stiff and dense shaft (Dense, NOT whippy), is the perfect combination to play snooker. Stiffness in order to get a solid hit and density in order to create spin .

I think, it's a matter of personal preference. you gonna have to try the cue and find out which one suits your technique .

Whatever you do , please do not buy a accurate 147 cue !! :snooker:

Nice post mate.

I'm pretty much signed onto using another cue but am frightened to get on the search for the Holy Grail as that can lead to swapping cues every couple of weeks as you're not getting that Eureka moment.

I took a laminated low deflection cue to the club today and measured it against mine and over 12ft the difference was half a ball on the low deflection cue and a full ball on mine.

A full ball is a lot to allow for with any brain in my opinion.

I don't have a problem having to wait to get used to a new one as I've always been a nose to the grindstone sort of guy (I used to have a large hooter but not now!).

[itsnoteasy]

I used to play a fair bit of billiards years ago with a good player and he would hit the cue ball at 3 o'clock sometimes as far right as you could get and the ball would throw loads of his springy cue.

The poor old guys been dead over 20 years but I still remember watching him cue and the sound it made before sliding off at a ridiculous angle.

You say it makes no difference in the meat of the cue ball so I wonder if you had a stiffer cue whether it does makes a difference with them.

There are so many opinions on this!

Yep it does make a difference once you are over a tip outside centre but 99.99% of the time you don't need to be a tips width to get enough side on the cue ball in the balls, so for me I play with a springy cue because it feels right, those poker stiff cues just feel dead, the noise, the hit, the feel through the cue , its just all wrong to me, although I started with them and thought that's how a cue should be, until I got this one and it just changed my mind instantly, it just felt right.The only thing against it , is if you cue poorly it punishes you, there is no leeway with it, especially if you grip early, but that's no bad thing imo.
I would add I'm not a great side player, just trace amounts to widen or narrow angles off the black Cush etc.

[Ramon]

Nice post mate.

I'm pretty much signed onto using another cue but am frightened to get on the search for the Holy Grail as that can lead to swapping cues every couple of weeks as you're not getting that Eureka moment.

I took a laminated low deflection cue to the club today and measured it against mine and over 12ft the difference was half a ball on the low deflection cue and a full ball on mine.

A full ball is a lot to allow for with any brain in my opinion.

I don't have a problem having to wait to get used to a new one as I've always been a nose to the grindstone sort of guy (I used to have a large hooter but not now!).

abit too much indeed. i would'nt be happy with that either.

LM shafts are generaly good players . I had one of them as my playing cue and traid 3 other ones .
The only problem is density. to find one with the right spring in the shaft .

Personally, I prefer a good quality plain Maple wood. Which is very hard to come by.
As a snooker player and Maple lover, I consider myself as blessed if i can find a decent piece of Maple.

[Hello, Mr Big Shot]

interesting topic Marc.
Amount of deflection. the longer the distance between CB and OB, the easier to determine amount of deflection.
I would say the density of the wood is realy important.
Some players (even coaches) do belive that more density leads to more deflection.
Sumthing i completely disagree.
A Whippy cue could give you sum trouble due to the deflection , imo.
Although , most of the time decent players are able to get used to it and deal with it ( depending on amount of deflection of crs ).

Deflection is determined by end mass, and not a lot else.

[Shockerz]

Deflection is determined by end mass, and not a lot else.

Do you mean tip, cue or both?

[Hello, Mr Big Shot]

Do you mean tip, cue or both?

I mean mass at tip end, so both, although tip mass is marginal at best.

Easy way to think of it: a toothpick will provide very little deflection, whilst a broomstick will produce loads.

Low deflection shafts eg Predator, are pie shaped laminations glued together. This gives the shaft enough strength to enable them to hollow out the first few inches at the tip end, thereby reducing its mass. They also use very lightweight ferrules.

[Shockerz]

I mean mass at tip end, so both, although tip mass is marginal at best.

Easy way to think of it: a toothpick will provide very little deflection, whilst a broomstick will produce loads.

Low deflection shafts eg Predator, are pie shaped laminations glued together. This gives the shaft enough strength to enable them to hollow out the first few inches at the tip end, thereby reducing its mass. They also use very lightweight ferrules.

Ah.

It would be great to see a more scientific test on each of the top makes to put this together for good as there isn't really a benchmark to refer to which is why there's always gonna be debate.

[itsnoteasy]

I mean mass at tip end, so both, although tip mass is marginal at best.

Easy way to think of it: a toothpick will provide very little deflection, whilst a broomstick will produce loads.

Low deflection shafts eg Predator, are pie shaped laminations glued together. This gives the shaft enough strength to enable them to hollow out the first few inches at the tip end, thereby reducing its mass. They also use very lightweight ferrules.

Great info there Biggie, I never knew that, could you get away with that on a 9.5 mill tip? Would there be enough strength there?