Frustating table- help.

[jonny66]

Have the cushions been undercut at the pocket curve? By that I mean are they thinner where the pockets curve in.

[Sea Chief]

Many thanks to Terry for his superb info (emailed).. & other ideas on here.

I'm still struggling with this situation. Jonny66 yes they are undercut, they do get thinner: this was done by the fitter & before (as the centre pockets still are/ cant redo these/ too much faff so Absolute say) were the usual 1/2" straight vertical face. So the cnr jaw cushio profiles have been reshaped. And widened. But even so.. the probs seem infuriatingly almost exactly as before- hit a straight shot in, no issue, you can even just hit off centre if you need to squeeze the white over a wee bit etc. BUT as soon as you go oblique into cnrs, the probs remain (wobbling/ pocket refusing/ spits out 2/3rds of time you try).. getting worse & worse the more oblique the angle is, to nigh on impossible if red is even 2" off cushion.

So boiling the possible reasons for this intractable issue seems to come to only these 2 factors, based on my logic alone (& a hell of alot of thought even tracing a local halls' pocket shape [bar 1/4" narrower, the same curves as ours], also the cushion H [identical], also the cushion face [same, even the undercut is similar]).

1) the cushions are OTT bouncy, meaning once a ball is hit into jaws they are more preventative of ball dropping as they are pinging the ball -across- the drop point due to excessive spring.

2) the wood undercut beneath the cushions are somehow obstructing the ball dropping: thye are indeed more vertical in angle as being a billiards table.. BUT.. I can say that the ball DOES NOT contact the wood area below cushion QUITE.. ie its close but there's still a gap to safely say no contact (even pressing a ball hard into the jaw rubber to simulate a hard shot). Terry is of the belief that even so, the bevel/ wood area is primary suspicion as to issue's reason.

These possible reasons 1) & 2) are only my reasoning. If anyone can share their opinions on whether these have any validity I'd be grateful. I'm at at total loss as to the cause at this moment, still, after SO much effort, time, fitter's wok.. Im almost at point of giving up & calling it an unfixable/ unplayable table/ cannot be remedied.

My last idea is that if 1) is the culprit.. then somehow mitigating against the excessive spring is the only conceivable answer. How is then therefore the Q. Maybe redoing/ really exaggerating the undercut to lessen as much as poss the 'rebound' nature in the jaws??

[DeanH]

any pictures? much easier showing that saying

you can use ImgBB and TinyPic (others available), without registering, to upload a picture and copy the sharing-code given; paste this code into your post for all to see

[inevermissblue]

Yes but this isnt fun. Im not interested at all in competitiveness. Actually I dont even like using the scoreboard (apart from as a Swearometer) even in clubs really. Tbh if the pockets were opened up to silly US pool size.. Id be perfectly ok with it: getting 40-50 breaks, whether it bears -any- relation to other normal pocket size, is totally cool with me. Im not interested in getting myself up to better snkr std per se or honing my perfect technique. Im too old for that. I just want to have a fun game, which basically means potting alot, & get others to enjoy it too > to bring in some money for the village & just get the damn thing used.

I'm not being funny in the slightest here. If you want fun and instant gratification then you should play pool. Why these club owners think that opening up pockets is an acceptable procedure is beyond me. Snooker is the only game I'm sure, that alters/simplifies to satisfy those who struggle to play it. I'm not suggesting you can't play at all by the way. I'm merely pointing out that these alterations take away slightly from the natubal difficulty of the game, and it does in my opinion harm the games deserved respect. I find it funny how peoplet don't demand that dartboards areally made with varying difficulty levels. That's probably becausee it's not possible. As a result, everyone holds that game with high regard due to its instant level of skill required.

[Terry Davidson]

I'm not being funny in the slightest here. If you want fun and instant gratification then you should play pool. Why these club owners think that opening up pockets is an acceptable procedure is beyond me. Snooker is the only game I'm sure, that alters/simplifies to satisfy those who struggle to play it. I'm not suggesting you can't play at all by the way. I'm merely pointing out that these alterations take away slightly from the natubal difficulty of the game, and it does in my opinion harm the games deserved respect. I find it funny how peoplet don't demand that dartboards areally made with varying difficulty levels. That's probably becausee it's not possible. As a result, everyone holds that game with high regard due to its instant level of skill required.

Not sure I agree with you. If you have 2 snooker clubs in a town, one with tighter pockets and one with really generous pockets the players will gravitate to the club with the bigger pockets and since the club owner is in the business of making money and getting more customers it would be a wise decision to have open pockets. Remember players like to brag about their high breaks.

[Sea Chief]

inversubmersible,

pockets have been opened up a good 1/2" each. The table plays the same. This means WIDTH has been ruled out as being either A) the main cause (in our eg) &/or B) of any need for natter tbh.

The Co did flippantly say "well we'll have to open the up as much as poss then" when I mentioned their attn hadn't resolved the issue, but I don't want or as its been proven there is no need, to open them up more than the 3-5/8" they are. Even up to snkr table max of 3-3/4" will be n/a, as its NOT WIDTH & LACK OF that is the cause of the prob.

It is -other- factors which are -only- in consideration now.

[vmax]

It could be that the fall of the slate is too far back from the pocket opening. A long time ago now our club bought a pool table rather than rent one and it had the tightest pockets I'd ever encountered on a pub pool table. Ball on the cushion wouldn't drop even if struck at pocket weight hugging the cushion.

The steward and myself had a discussion about it and decided that the fall of the slate was to blame and one night after closing time, peeled away the cloth from the pockets and with a half round file made a one inch wide by half inch deep chamfer along the edge of each pocket fall.
Vacuumed up the dust, stuck the cloth back down with spray adhesive and had a game and the balls dropped in no trouble.

[Sea Chief]

Vmax,

good idea. But this job was done, drops were filed fwd a good 1/2", clearly using a template as when I traced our local 'bit ropey' club tables the shape of both jaw curve & drop points matched ours (actually their tables 3-3/8" W & ours now 3-5/8"). They have no issues like ours.

So: W of pockets, & drop points both ruled out as cause.

This leaves only shape of cushion, & nature of rubber left as possibilities.. I surmise.. but as I say I'm far from the one to likely have the answer if we have fitters with decades of experience, Co's whose chaps bleat on about how they just got a ton break so they know best & I know jack-all (well.. I have bet every penny I have he'd have got no more than 25 on our table), & all you guys with alot more knowledge than I.

More mullings greatly appreciated.

[vmax]

Basically we need pictures to compare the angle of the jaws to compare to others.

[inevermissblue]

Sea Cheif.
What is the condition of the table cloth? Is it brand new? If not, just exactly how long has it been on? The bed cloth condition, does affect the pockets.

[Sea Chief]

Sea Cheif.
What is the condition of the table cloth? Is it brand new? If not, just exactly how long has it been on? The bed cloth condition, does affect the pockets.

Its been on 20 years- but no-one's played on it.. for 20 years.. cos table's so annoying. Absolute couldn't believe the VG condition of it. Another factor ruled out then.

What I need, idealy, is a fitter's opinion. I think maybe all else is guesswork. Even Terry has drawn a blank, & with all the fab info he's emailed me, & his wealth of knowledge. I think only a fitter could answer the Q now tbh.. but all opinions considered nevertheless.

Appreciated, SC

[Sea Chief]

Basically we need pictures to compare the angle of the jaws to compare to others.

I can't add a pic, the max is 200 s'thing & each of my pics are 700 or so. Kb I think.

[jrc750]

I can't add a pic, the max is 200 s'thing & each of my pics are 700 or so. Kb I think.

Create a tinypic.com account and then post the IMG code from there

[Sea Chief]

How can anyone post a pic here, if its only 200kb limit? I cant open a bucketpic site account.. it just takes soo long/ to then get from there to here to there- it makes me go insane.

[DeanH]

I think without the minimum of photos and possibly a physical visit; even a table fitter will be hard-put to explain exactly what you need to do by the words alone