Screwing Back : I'm ending up with no back spin when I hit the object ball

[throtts]

Yep,, and so many players think they are getting through the CB when really they are not. If the grip tightens mid way on the delivery then that player will not go through the CB like he should, imo...Timing is crucial too.

Very true Terry regarding tip position.

[pottr]

While obviously not at Pottr and Toms standard , but I have found even screwing around the black area, say on and off the cushion back in to the middle or the other side of the table, is so much easier with a light grip, I feel it helps keep me still as well, and I Im much more accurate on the cue ball. I don't think a lot of us hit the cue ball where we think we do, I know I don't every time and it shows in the different reactions I get on the cue ball.

It's what I've said all along... How you hit it is far more important than where and even the pace of the shot.

Learn how first, then you can increase the amounts of pace and the severity of lowness on the white.

Possible causes are he's just not lowering his bridge hand enough

No, I disagree... Not because it's not possible, but because I think that even a beginner would be able to work that out on his own...

It's the grip... He'll be holding the cue too tight which causes the butt to lift on the backswing... the effect it has is that when he delivers the cue it's already moved off the line and he's not hitting where he wants to... And on the odd times he does hit where he wants, the cue being lifted guarantees the follow through will be poor.

I've seen it too many times in beginners to think it's anything else although I could be wrong x

[itsnoteasy]

I know when I'm playing **** poor, its ninety percent of the time my grip , either not opening the back of my hand, causing what Pottr said above ,or closing to early with all the problems bad timing causes.
Aww come on how is that a swear word?

[Terry Davidson]

I have seen a lot of poorer players who do not alter their bridge hand and raise the butt or think thay are at the bottom of the cueball when they're actually quite nearer centre ball. Some students I've had who couldn't screw I corrected by loosening the grip first, then dropping the bridge and then telling them not to use a lot of power at first but try and hit the object ball with their tip. This approach has worked with every last one of them.

As an example, within a few shots I have them screwing off the brown from 1ft behind it and hitting the side cushion easily and even bouncing off the side cushion. The final point on the lesson is keep the cue on the chin and the head down until the shot is complete.

[Little Reggie]

I know when I'm playing **** poor, its ninety percent of the time my grip , either not opening the back of my hand, causing what Pottr said above ,or closing to early with all the problems bad timing causes.
Aww come on how is that a swear word?

The biggest issue is not one opening one's grip enough but missing the shot entirely because we've pulled the cue across the line with a hammer fist. This means we should open the grip with just the pinkie tip on the cue for extreme shots. Keep a vertical thumb throughout the shot. You aim to stroke the cue as flat as possible with no rotation, at all.

Lots of follow through is not technically necessary and a robot would just stab the bottom of the ball but most players require follow through for a sweet hit. The quality of contact is important as Mr Stark says, so a smooth cue action with smooth acceleration (and maximum speed on contact) is essential and will lead to less CB jump. The cue should decelerate after contact. So, we have a sine wave. Concentrate on the point of contact. Just half a tips difference can ruin the shot. If you hit the CB as low as poss without jumping and follow through long and sweet, you may end up with Jimmy power; the king of spin.

Plenty of videos of stabbers and whackers failing to screw 3ft on youtube, even a few coaches. Do the opposite in every respect and you'll be screwing 12ft in no time, maybe even 24ft. :biggrin-new:

[ace man]

Anxiety kills screw backs. Those who stab at the ball are probably stiff before even getting down on a shot.
I'd say try to hit it low and smooth. Practise until you're blue in the face.
If you miscue on a few attempts, no worries except maybe for club owner. Therefore it might be a good idea to put some additional cloth underneath the cue ball to protect your precious Strachan or whatever you're using.
One thing I'm not sure about is which approach might be better suited for a beginner on learning a screw back. Go for limit at the bottom of the cue ball right away and maybe suffer a few miscues, or work your way from just below centre and then slowly build up confidence by striking lower and lower? I wonder which approach coaches use with their students when it comes to screw backs?

[Little Reggie]

Anxiety kills screw backs. Those who stab at the ball are probably stiff before even getting down on a shot.
I'd say try to hit it low and smooth. Practise until you're blue in the face.
If you miscue on a few attempts, no worries except maybe for club owner. Therefore it might be a good idea to put some additional cloth underneath the cue ball to protect your precious Strachan or whatever you're using.
One thing I'm not sure about is which approach might be better suited for a beginner on learning a screw back. Go for limit at the bottom of the cue ball right away and maybe suffer a few miscues, or work your way from just below centre and then slowly build up confidence by striking lower and lower? I wonder which approach coaches use with their students when it comes to screw backs?

I would say get the novice to cue half a tip up from where he should be so they're not nervous of wrecking the cloth or do wreck the cloth. They can begin by screwing the CB back off the blue a few inches, then work on them from there. Work on one fault at a time, whether that be grip or alignment, snatch, stab, smoothness, bridge, etc. Give them a month to improve it with regular exercises. Then move on to the next fault if they've eliminated the first fault. After a year, they should be screwing back really well. If they're of a certain type or age, give them some turps and a box of matches instead.

[blahblah01]

Whether you practice elbow drop ala Lee and ROS is moot as lots of 'coaches' have poo pooed it. What do they know eh?

I think that it is one thing to practice\develop a good\long follow through which causes the elbow to drop\follow the shot\hand\cue than to practice dropping\pushing the elbow through. The latter causes timing problems, and is something else to think about (grrrrrrr) whereas the former is about the hand\cue going through the shot.

[alabadi]

I have found even screwing around the black area, say on and off the cushion back in to the middle

Jim, Stop screwing around the black area, it's bad for your health ...Lol

[blahblah01]

Jim, Stop screwing around the black area, it's bad for your health ...Lol

He should stick to the pink and brown? :distracted:

[alabadi]

ahh the pink area is where you can score....

[Terry Davidson]

I think that it is one thing to practice\develop a good\long follow through which causes the elbow to drop\follow the shot\hand\cue than to practice dropping\pushing the elbow through. The latter causes timing problems, and is something else to think about (grrrrrrr) whereas the former is about the hand\cue going through the shot.

If you didn't learn originally when you were young to drop the elbow you have to be very careful when you try and develop it as an adult. You have to ensure you don't drop the elbow before the strike as it has a tendency to 'creep up' in the delivery. A good way to counteract that is to ensure you keep the cue on the chest until after the strike but it's still difficult to coorfdinate.

[stemidd]

Try to imagine you have to hit a second cue ball 9 inch further on from the actual cue ball,as long as you hit 1-2cm below centre you will screw back,then increase acceleration to screw back more distance