Thurston table fitters

[Leo]

I have seen TCs from £90 (inclusive) to £150 (inclusive) depending on supplier...

Yep £100 vat included is a good price

[itsnoteasy]

Where are they for £100 ?, I'm sure these are £96 plus vat to the trade.

[mythman69]

Where are they for £100 ?, I'm sure these are £96 plus vat to the trade.

Just wondering if there are any 'fakes' on the market?

[itsnoteasy]

Couple of lads at our club bought sets, and the club got a few 1g sets, I'm sure it said in the catalogue , 96 plus vat. The 1gs, were around 150 odd all in plus postage, they got a decent deal as the club picked up the postage for them.

[itsnoteasy]

Karnehm and Hillman tables are very good for a modern make , they should have put adjustable slate bearers on them though so would recommend this upgrade if anyone should buy one .

they had hand floated slates so trueness from new where good , but they can ( sag ) bow and dip down after time due to the fact that the centre slate muntins do not support the centre of the slate .

Early tables suffer from leg delamination and cracking . later ones seem to be ok , but you can also get this on any table that has used 2 inch sections of wood glued together to form a 8inch by 8inch block to turn down or shape a square leg out of if the wood is not dried out properly or kiln dried . I have seen a few Riley Chinese aristocrats with cracking legs mainly in oak .

I like the buttons feature in place of slide out panels and some have the scroll work between the legs .

The turned tulip leg table is called the Buckingham .

at the end of the day a square leg plays as good as a turned leg as they all used the same slate and cushion construction .

You can pick these tables up from just £250 off eBay , they are rare to find in 9ft and 10ft versions , and these smaller K&H tables also had 5 section slate beds , which makes it easier to get them upstairs or into an attic .

like all major manufacturers during the 90s , the chinese lower priced tables flooded the market and the snooker club openings suddenly stopped and they started to close down , that's when K&H stopped production and went out of business

Which is a shame as they are good easy tables to work on .

here is a link to a 10ft that I renovated for a guy from London . http://gclbilliards.com/10ft-karnehm...land-to-essex/ note the adjustable muntin conversion

Someone is selling what looks like one of these tables on Gumtree, a ten footer, looks in very good Nic from the pictures, and a very decent price £650, it's in the Derby area, if anyone's interested.
http://www.gumtree.com/p/for-sale/an...10f/1072878788

[philip in china]

Just wondering if there are any 'fakes' on the market?

Just let me know what you want faking and I will arrange.

[Geoff Large]

Someone is selling what looks like one of these tables on Gumtree, a ten footer, looks in very good Nic from the pictures, and a very decent price £650, it's in the Derby area, if anyone's interested.
http://www.gumtree.com/p/for-sale/an...10f/1072878788

Sorry to say this is not a K & Hillman . as it only has 4 cushion bolts in each cushion , look at the 10ft in my link http://gclbilliards.com/10ft-karnehm...land-to-essex/ and you can see all cushions have 5 bolt holes .
The legs are also not a K & Hillman design , although I can forgive people for mistaking it for one as scrolls look the same , a better photo in more light will show up the differences.

[Leo]

Sorry to say this is not a K & Hillman . as it only has 4 cushion bolts in each cushion , look at the 10ft in my link http://gclbilliards.com/10ft-karnehm...land-to-essex/ and you can see all cushions have 5 bolt holes .
The legs are also not a K & Hillman design , although I can forgive people for mistaking it for one as scrolls look the same , a better photo in more light will show up the differences.

that K&H table looks the biz,note to self move into my next property that has enough room inside or outside

[itsnoteasy]

Sorry to say this is not a K & Hillman . as it only has 4 cushion bolts in each cushion , look at the 10ft in my link http://gclbilliards.com/10ft-karnehm...land-to-essex/ and you can see all cushions have 5 bolt holes .
The legs are also not a K & Hillman design , although I can forgive people for mistaking it for one as scrolls look the same , a better photo in more light will show up the differences.

And that is why you are a legend Geoff, lol, I just looked at the buttons to hide the bolts and the leg shape.
Can you tell what this table is, and is it any good? £650 seems a very good price for a 10 footer.

[Geoff Large]

I think I had a phone call about this table the other day but cannot be 100% it is the same person , If it is the same one then Beware !

The enquiry on the phone was we have a hand made antique snooker table made by Gibson a table manufacturer close to Newark Nottingham.
Antique design maybe but nowhere near 100 years old , as Gibson was making tables from the 1980s up to around the year2000 ? , when he lost two finger on a saw blade on his woodwork equipment . I do not think he is in the Billiards and snooker maintenance and manufacture anymore.
He was better known for making Billiard dining tables up to 8ft , which was his main line of work .
I have met him at least twice over the years , and he was a nice Guy , but his larger tables made with just wood screws where in my honest opinion not good, but his Billiard diners from 6ft to 8ft are ok .
Gibson made tables using woodscrews only into the under slate tack lining on his 9ft tables and maybe on 10ft ones ? , there a few of his tables around and the bounce in the cushions are not good because they are not bolted securely into the slate .
they look the business but are not a good buy .

please make sure this is the same table before you label it as a Gibson wood screw on cushion one , I have just done a search and he has a web site that looks to be an information web site , I do not know if he is still manufacturing but heard he was not , here is a link to his web site. http://thecueball.co.uk/cuesports-su...-c-gibson.html

The last Gibson 9ft with wood screw on cushions I worked on was located in /middle Street Beeston Nottingham at a Disabled call in centre. they got rid of it for a full size after just two years of use.

make an enquiry about this 10ft and if he says it has wood screws behind those cushion buttons then walk away , a 10ft should have 5 bolts in the side cushions although you may get one with 4 , a 9ft may also have 4 bolts in the side cushions .
ask for a photo of the cushion fixing bolt when he takes a button off . Make sure the bolts go into the slate and not into a claw nut fixing on the other side of a thick slate lining as this is also a cheaper way of doing it .

If anyone requires a 9ft K&Hillman square leg we may have one coming up for sale on my web site direct from the owner , in Devon which has to be out of a house due to house sale so may come up at the right price.
Please be aware the sales on GCL Billiards web site for tables are not commercial , they are genuine Private sales with direct contact to the seller on email enquiry to protect from Dealers pestering them . GCL Billiards do not buy and sell tables , although we try to relocate them for people , and hate scrapping them if any good .

[itsnoteasy]

Again thanks Geoff, you have to have your suspicions, just with the price of it I suppose.

[itsnoteasy]

Turned out to be screws Geoff.

[Geoff Large]

I have another bit of information you should know about this so called 10ft table .

It is a 9ft not a 10ft .....Dan the seller was measuring the total length including the wood cushion overhang .

I had a feeling it was the same table that I had emails about around the 22nd of July.

He does know it is a 9ft so should have changed his advert and told you himself if you have enquired about the table after the 22nd of july .

I declined to offer a free advertisement of this table on my web site due to the screw on cushions and told him my reputation as abilliards fitter could be damaged if I put it on my web site , by placing it on the web site people may think I recommend it .
I do often ask questions about snooker tables that are advertised on there and if I am not comfortable with it , I tell them so , as I did with Dan

his replay was Wow your professionalism is on another level .

I don't see it like that , I feel it was a duty to point out to him and any buyer the pitfalls of buying or selling this table .

[itsnoteasy]

No he didn't tell me Geoff, cheeky rascal.
You are right not to advertise this, as I would think anything on your site, you know about and have given it the ok.

[philip in china]

What sensible stuff we get here. It is great to see a reasonable discussion on a point like this.

I have little sympathy for people who think they are going to get a top quality anything at a rock bottom price. It just doesn't happen- at least not many times in a lifetime.

Those looking for a table are well advised to contact experienced fitters and ask. They will often know of a good deal going. This is especially the case where the buyer wants something a bit "oddball" such as a 10' table or a particular type of wood.

Table fitters want as many people as possible to own and use tables. They will generally help you because they get their business that way. One exception to this rule is a fitter in Derby. I won't name and shame him. He got me my table although he knew there would be no repeat business as it was for export. That really was above and beyond the call of duty.