What do you expect from a snooker coach ??

[j6uk]

Master Blaster. When i said I hear some coaches repeating the same things i didn't mean to the same student. I meant some coaches seem to just teach the same few things to everyone. It doesn't matter what the student wants or needs they just seem to have a limited amount of knowledge which they repeat to everyone.

yes, and experience. this should mean that the coach would be able to spot details and help the player to help them selves

[pottr]

I meant what Gavin meant also.

[Ramon]

That's a load of nonsense. Next you'll be telling me Del Hill should have landed 5 world titles to be able to coach Ronnie? There are no written rules in coaching but there is best practice. A coach will adapt technique and playing advice to the suitability of the players, e.g. foot-in-line for some, boxer for others and maybe JT for the really talented.

to be honest, I do'nt think you can compare snooker with other sports !! For example, football is a group sport / team sport !! Snooker is a solo sport !! It's True, DH does'nt need 5 W titles to coaching ROS !! but you should see it this way, ROS is a talented player and able to learn what he's been told and he knows the basic of the game !! In case of a beginner, I think a coach should be able to play few shots and show the student what he's talking about !! it is also important to gain trust from the student !! Of crs ,, this is the time of internet / video / and that kind of things !! So , you never know , maybe a Video would be enough ??
But most of the players I have spoken with prefer a coach who is able to play the game !!

[Byrom]

What would I expect off a snooker coach -----?

Thinking about it if you did get coaching off Terry Griffiths or Nik Barrow one thing I would expect off them two is a lift home afterwards because the amount they charge for their hourly rate I don't think I would be able to afford to put any petrol in.

[Master Blaster]

Master Blaster. When i said I hear some coaches repeating the same things i didn't mean to the same student. I meant some coaches seem to just teach the same few things to everyone. It doesn't matter what the student wants or needs they just seem to have a limited amount of knowledge which they repeat to everyone.

Fair play mate, I understand you now. Yes, advice does need to be personal, people have different bodies, coordination, sighting, muscle control and feel, natural ability, you name it. They're not robots and robots don't need teaching. But any advice still needs to revolve around good basics for me. When you say coaches repeat a lot, what level are you suggesting, ISBF, WS?

[Master Blaster]

What would I expect off a snooker coach -----?

Thinking about it if you did get coaching off Terry Griffiths or Nik Barrow one thing I would expect off them two is a lift home afterwards because the amount they charge for their hourly rate I don't think I would be able to afford to put any petrol in.

You're more in the market for a coach per se then.

[vmax4steve]

But a coach has to say some things over and over if the student doesn't listen or if they have persistent problems, e.g. not cueing properly, using the upper arm not the fingers, crap walk-in, not sighting well and not standing properly. If this occurs, the coach has no choice but to drill the student over and over and over again with the same routines. It happens in horse riding in the ring. Best practice given the student's choice of set-up is crucial. Remember, it can take two years or more just to learn how to cue properly. Add in 3 mths for each of stance, bridge, grip etc and you can see why coaches have to spend so long on the same exercises and this doesn't include the time correcting bad habits creeping back into a student's game.

If this is the case then the coach should send him on his way with a kind word about taking up something that he can do rather than milk a lost cause for years.
Anyone without a semblance of naural talent will not progress at this game, the basics of hand/eye cannot be taught, they can be fine tuned I agree, but if they're not present then it's hopeless trying.

[Master Blaster]

to be honest, I do'nt think you can compare snooker with other sports !! For example, football is a group sport / team sport !! Snooker is a solo sport !! It's True, DH does'nt need 5 W titles to coaching ROS !! but you should see it this way, ROS is a talented player and able to learn what he's been told and he knows the basic of the game !! In case of a beginner, I think a coach should be able to play few shots and show the student what he's talking about !! it is also important to gain trust from the student !! Of crs ,, this is the time of internet / video / and that kind of things !! So , you never know , maybe a Video would be enough ??
But most of the players I have spoken with prefer a coach who is able to play the game !!

I agree, most coaches hit tons but I don't think we should expect them to hit maxis every week. However, I do know a coach who has hit hundreds of maxis and thousands of tonnes, former pro. But this is rare amongst coaches I know. A lot of technical coaching in sport (football, cricket, snooker, tennis) is done by folk who haven't achieved the greatest honours in sport. Which is fine if they are expert in what they teach. I'd rather have time with Nic Barrow than Terry Griffiths at any price if you know what I mean?

[Master Blaster]

If this is the case then the coach should send him on his way with a kind word about taking up something that he can do rather than milk a lost cause for years.
Anyone without a semblance of naural talent will not progress at this game, the basics of hand/eye cannot be taught, they can be fine tuned I agree, but if they're not present then it's hopeless trying.

I see where you are coming from but the student's attitude is key. If a student wants to improve a great deal, change everything that is awful in their game and really put in the hours, I can see even a poorly talented student doubling their acumen of the game. A poorly talented student can achieve a lot more than a sloppy, talented student. It's not all genetic. Having the right genes will always lift your potential ceiling but training can improve what folk have a great deal. If the students enjoy the coaching, it is a winner in itself.

If folk want to improve hand/eye, I would recommend juggling as a tool. If they can move from three balls to three clubs, it will do them a world of good in most sports.

[pottr]

You're more in the market for a coach per se then

I like that

[Ramon]

I agree, most coaches hit tons but I don't think we should expect them to hit maxis every week. However, I do know a coach who has hit hundreds of maxis and thousands of tonnes, former pro. But this is rare amongst coaches I know. A lot of technical coaching in sport (football, cricket, snooker, tennis) is done by folk who haven't achieved the greatest honours in sport. Which is fine if they are expert in what they teach. I'd rather have time with Nic Barrow than Terry Griffiths at any price if you know what I mean?

fair enough,,
But I did'nt say that a coach has to hit max every week !! Just would be nice if he has sum experience in the game and can play few shots and is able to make sum dct breaks !!
Btw, I agree with Vmax 100 prct !! Not saying you do'nt have to try ,, But the fact is , Not every one has talent and is able to learn this game !! ( especially when we talking about the game in higher level ) !! And that goes for everything !! I mean let's face it , not every one re going to be a good Doctor Or a good baker Or a good teacher and so on .... !!!
Well, the same goes for snooker !! Not every one can learn this game and re going to be a good snooker player !!
especially for people who have high expectations of themselves !! In that case , would be Nice if the coach can explain that in fair way and let that person know : what you want to achieve ( given your talent, age,, Or whatever ,,,, ) is impossible !! instead of giving him false hope !!

[vmax4steve]

I'd rather have time with Nic Barrow than Terry Griffiths at any price if you know what I mean?

I'm the opposite, going on the simplistic condescending videos of his I have watched, I think Barrow would take your money for years rather than tell you the truth.

[Master Blaster]

I'm the opposite, going on the simplistic condescending videos of his I have watched, I think Barrow would take your money for years rather than tell you the truth.

Ooooooh, that's a bit mean. Nic took Ding to the heights of world number 1 didn't he?

[vmax4steve]

Ooooooh, that's a bit mean. Nic took Ding to the heights of world number 1 didn't he?

Really ? how come he's not there now then, has he forgotten all that M. Barrow taught him, does what Mr. Barrow teaches only last for twelve months ?

These top pros don't need any coaching, they only need confidence, and that comes from within, and I'm afraid Ding lacks in that area. Once that eye starts twitching you know you've got him.

[Csmith]

If this is the case then the coach should send him on his way with a kind word about taking up something that he can do rather than milk a lost cause for years.
Anyone without a semblance of naural talent will not progress at this game, the basics of hand/eye cannot be taught, they can be fine tuned I agree, but if they're not present then it's hopeless trying.

If the student isn't getting it, the coach should look at a different approach. Sounds rather harsh to give up on a student because they're having a rough time. As long as the student is putting in the effort (and paying) they should both continue to do their best. Though the instructor may need to give an honest assessment of the students outlook.