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  • Ssb - williams blasts williams

    Mark Williams has blamed referee Eirian Williams for his Shanghai Masters final defeat to Mark Selby.

    Williams claimed the incident in the 17th frame (which I detail in the post below this one) had cost him the title.

    He said: “I was robbed. The referee made such an appalling decision.

    “I was right behind it and 100% it hit the pink first. He said it did then he turned around and said he didn’t see it.

    “It’s an absolute joke. It cost me the tournament. The balls should have gone back. I don’t mind losing to anyone but the ref has cost me the title, no question.

    “It was plain to see that he hit the pink. We didn't need to play it back. We should get Stevie Wonder to referee next time.”

    Strong stuff, then. But if you watch the footage, (Eirian) Williams calls the miss after consulting with the players and walks over to (Mark) Williams to ask him if he will take it, which he could have done immediately. Selby, after all, had accepted the decision.

    (Mark) Williams appears to ask for the freeze frame, only to be told that World Snooker do not have that facility at this tournament.

    Selby then comes over, someone mentions a replay on an arena TV monitor and they turn to study it. At this point the earlier certainty it was pink first dissipates.

    It was hard to tell on the replay but it looked like red first to me watching at home. However, Mark Williams was obviously a lot closer than I was and isn’t usually the sort to blame anything other than himself for defeat. TV replays are sometimes misleading.

    I understand his frustration. Remember, these quotes were taken down literally minutes after the defeat.

    There was no doubt his general demeanour changed dramatically after the incident and he was still seething at the end, which is very unlike him.

    But it was a very difficult call for the referee to make, even after they had consulted the replays.

    All a referee can do in that situation is give an honest opinion: which is what Eirian Williams did.

    He also did his best to come to a decision that was agreed on by both players, although obviously Mark Williams sees things differently and, of course, the miss had been given and then retracted, which further confused matters.

    I've known Eirian for a long time. Indeed, he had a cameo role in what remains one of the funniest things I've ever seen on the snooker circuit - in Shanghai nine years ago when Selby, jetlagged and confused, tried to hail a taxi to the venue at 1.30am, believing it was the afternoon. Eirian had to point out it was, in fact, pitch black outside.

    He is a referee of integrity. Whether it was red or pink is a debate that, I suspect, will never be solved to the satisfaction of everyone.

    If Eirian made a mistake it was perhaps in taking so much time but, again, all he was trying to do was come to the right decision.

    However, he did actually originally call a miss, which (Mark) Williams could have taken without himself asking for further evidence.

    I know (Mark) Williams doesn't see it that way and I respect that too because it was a strange, frustrating incident which had a huge bearing on the result, and the match arena at a key stage of a major final isn't always the best place for clear thinking.

    Who is to say if they had put the balls back Selby wouldn't have fluked one and cleared up? Stranger things have happened.

    This was an unfortunate incident at a vital time in the final. It reminded me a little of the John Higgins/Ronnie O'Sullivan UK Championship semi-final two years ago, which also threatened to turn on a difficult rules decision.

    All in all a rather unedifying end to a gripping contest.


    More...

  • #2
    Red first definitely. From the angle it was approaching the balls, If it had hit pink first, it wouldn't of hit the red at all.

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    • #3
      red first.

      watch video below (5:58)
      http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ISOq3...&feature=share
      :) :) :)

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      • #4
        red first for sure. the way the white was going after the hit proofs it imho.
        mind control > body control > cue control > ball control

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        • #5
          I think it was red first because if he had hit the pink the red would not have moved.

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          • #6
            Tough call, but for me the only reason the red moved was because of the contact on the pink but it is close
            I think if the red was hit first the angle to where the red was moving would have been more straight down towards black cushion this seem to head slightly different as if the contact of the pink pushed the white
            Wow is tough
            Last edited by MasterBreak147; 12 September 2011, 06:56 AM.

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            • #7
              “It’s an absolute joke. It cost me the tournament. The balls should have gone back. I don’t mind losing to anyone but the ref has cost me the title, no question."
              It's a good thing that blowing it in the final when only needing one frame to win for the third time in a row had nothing to do with it then. I mean from 9-7 down Selby gave Williams no chance at all did he, with all those clearances and not missing a single ball. Oh wait..

              I do understand the situation frustrates Williams, I even understand if he feels robbed, but there's no need for outbursts like this, it just makes him look like a very bad loser. I think his opinion about this incident will change once he calms down a bit.
              Last edited by rivercard; 12 September 2011, 08:37 AM.

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              • #8
                I think the crucial shot he missed was the resonably easy green. He needed only green, brown blue and pink to win, all are at easy positions.

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                • #9
                  Originally Posted by rivercard View Post
                  ....I do understand the situation frustrates Williams, I even understand if he feels robbed, but there's no need for outbursts like this, it just makes him look like a very bad loser. I think his opinion about this incident will change once he calms down a bit.
                  I am sure his mind will be different in a few days time. However what happened to him was very cruel, hard luck.
                  :snooker: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ERnqd...4&feature=plcp

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                  • #10
                    Originally Posted by MasterBreak147 View Post
                    Tough call, but for me the only reason the red moved was because of the contact on the pink but it is close
                    I think if the red was hit first the angle to where the red was moving would have been more straight down towards black cushion this seem to head slightly different as if the contact of the pink pushed the white
                    Wow is tough
                    there was 2 much of a gap playing run through for contact on the pink to move the red.

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                    • #11
                      I don't know guys, it seems to me that he has hit both balls at exactly same time. Tough call for sure.
                      ...cue is our weapon, and we know how to kill...

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                      • #12
                        Even with the slow mo its very difficult to call, but to me, with the angle the white comes in at, if it had hit pink 1st, the red wouldnt of took line it did.

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                        • #13
                          my 2-penneth worth.
                          imo Red first; from the slo-mo the cue ball skims the Red just enough to get it moving, THEN the majority of the cue ball force move the pink nearly full ball.
                          If the cue ball had hit the Pink first, I don't think the angle was correct to hit the Red in the way the Red moved.
                          endeth my opinion
                          Up the TSF! :snooker:

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                          • #14
                            It a tough call to make but i tend to believe Mark Williams....he was the one who asked for a replay when Selby and the ref said it was a foul and a miss. He did that because he was so sure of what he saw. If not he would have accepted the call and put Selby to play again.
                            "There has only ever been Alex Higgins, myself and now Ronnie O'sullivan who play the game the way it should be played with such excitement - I know the fans love it this way" - Jimmy White

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                            • #15
                              Originally Posted by attilahun View Post
                              It a tough call to make but i tend to believe Mark Williams....he was the one who asked for a replay when Selby and the ref said it was a foul and a miss. He did that because he was so sure of what he saw. If not he would have accepted the call and put Selby to play again.
                              Doesn't make sense that ???
                              If Williams believed it hit pink first, and both the ref and Selby were prepared to accept it was a foul and a miss then why would he ask for a replay ????

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