Starting to think it isn't object ball

[Hello, Mr Big Shot]

Starting to think it isn't object ball

yeah, it has bollock-all to do with eyesight. you miss over longer distances because your fundamentals aren't right. distance amplifies your lack of technique.

[GeordieDS]

yeah, it has bollock-all to do with eyesight. you miss over longer distances because your fundamentals aren't right. distance amplifies your lack of technique.

If this true how come my long potting is very good but i struggle with simple blacks off the spot?

[tedisbill]

If this true how come my long potting is very good but i struggle with simple blacks off the spot?

I'd suggest that's because of two things:

1) your long potting isn't necessarily as good as you think it is...
2) you're not actually completely sure of the potting angles of blacks off the spot

[tedisbill]

Oh and number three...

You can hit a long shot really positively and allows you to really drive the cue through. On shots around the black spot, that's where a little more finesse is required.

[GeordieDS]

Oh and number three...

You can hit a long shot really positively and allows you to really drive the cue through. On shots around the black spot, that's where a little more finesse is required.

So rather than me not knowing the angles of potting a black off the spot it's more likely to be trying to control the White is why i miss

[j6uk]

this fine post wafts away all the gas, and one that eco's through most threads in the coaching area

yeah, it has bollock-all to do with eyesight. you miss over longer distances because your fundamentals aren't right. distance amplifies your lack of technique.

[vmax4steve]

I do have better than average vision...

Perhaps I take for granted the importance of where you look... I can concede that.

I just feel I know in my bones that you really don't need to worry about it when you're analysing a cue action... I have no more proof than that unfortunately.

Don't take this wrong pottr, but this is the reason why so many good players can't put across what they do as it all comes naturally and they just don't know the crucial thing/s that they do, what the most important thing is.

To simply say that one doesn't have to think about where one is looking, because you don't, is telling those who either knowing or unknowingly look at the cue ball or the pocket and play badly as a result, that they can carry on as they are.

I have turned around some pretty poor players simply by watching their eyes and putting them straight. Now none of them are going to be world beaters, but they can now make some decent sized breaks when they put their concentration into looking at the object ball, but as this doesn't come naturally to them they are always going to be hit and miss, but when they knock in the odd 50 break, whereas before they struggled to make a 20, it's quite gratifying to me and a huge pleasure to them.

This always of course goes along with the other fundamentals of sighting and stance, keeping still on the strike and what the cue ball does when certain spins are applied.

[guernseygooner]

So rather than me not knowing the angles of potting a black off the spot it's more likely to be trying to control the White is why i miss

Probably because on long pots all you are thinking about is the pot. Maybe you don't cue blacks as well when doubts creep in about position, shot strength etc.

You can't beat the blacks off the spot routine

[ace man]

There are long pots and then there are also long pots. Depends on what you mean by them.
With many reds on the table, there could be so many obstacles. To get position or even play a shot to nothing, many times you need to be able to force an angle that isn't really there naturally. This might require power stun, slow roll, screw, drag, top, side even...etc. In short, you need full range of shots on long balls. I doubt many club level amateur players can get even close to that, no matter how sharp their focus on the object ball may be.
With natural angles available things get much simpler and only plain ball might be enough. Still hard, but plenty of players can at least look good attempting those.

[vmax4steve]

yeah, it has bollock-all to do with eyesight. you miss over longer distances because your fundamentals aren't right. distance amplifies your lack of technique.

Yes of course, I don't even need to wear specs, simply perfect a straight cue action with practise along the baulkline, looking at my cue as I do so, take that to the match table and everything will be hunky dory

[tedisbill]

So rather than me not knowing the angles of potting a black off the spot it's more likely to be trying to control the White is why i miss

Possibly. It's hard to know without seeing somebody play.

[Master Blaster]

Yes of course, I don't even need to wear specs, simply perfect a straight cue action with practise along the baulkline, looking at my cue as I do so, take that to the match table and everything will be hunky dory

Good vision helps but as Mr Big Shot says, so do fundamentals. Players with laser straight cue actions are always more likely to pot long balls. We can magnify this test by putting the cue ball in the jaws and then attempting to pot the long blue with just the top of the ball. You can have 40/40 vision, if your cue action ain't dead straight, you won't make the pot.

[Terry Davidson]

I didn't want to get involved in this as I have analysed it and watched my own eye movement on video and also Nic Barrow checked my eyes when I had a coaching session with him about 5 years ago.

For me, I focus on the object ball at the front pause and keep the eyes on the OB during the backswing and delivery. This is likely the reason I've never been able to develop a decent rear pause unless I force it. I have experimented with different eye rhythm (which really screws you up by the way) and I have found in order to pot anywhere near consistently I have to be focused on the OB at the time of strike. In addition, since I am older than most my eyes take longer to focus on an object as compared to some 20yr-old hotshot or even pottr.

Take this to the bank also...a lot of the pros when younger will focus on the cueball at the front pause, raise their eyes to the OB near the end of the backswing or at their rear pause, then start the delivery and flick their eyes back to the cueball for just a millisecond and then raise them back to the object ball so they are on the OB at time of strike. I believe this little 'flick' back to the cueball is where a lot of people are getting the idea they have their eyes on the cueball at the time of strike. I believe this just isn't so and even though I rarely agree with vmax kover some of his ideas I do agree with him on this one.

As for aiming and sighting and visual acuity and eye rhythm and how it affects potting I believe as long as a player has decent visual acuity in his ONE sighting eye he will sight a shot correctly. Where the unknown comes in is with cut-back shots to closed pockets like for instance a black off the spot with the cueball somewhere on the top cushion. I believe a lot of this type of pot is missed for 2 reasons, the first being there is very little room for error when potting to a closed pocket and secondly because a player is not sure of the correct sighting angle and may get down on what he believes is the correct line of aim but it really isn't because he isn't lined up to the inside jaw on the side cushion.

Also, I have always insisted that, barring kicks, 99.9% of pots are missed because the player didn't deliver the cue straight down the line of aim and with no unintentional side. I still believe the biggest factor holding back players is the inability to deliver the cue perfectly straight since without that it's not very helpful to start attempting to play position well and also to be using side. In addition, the reason long pots are missed is because there is less room for error over 10ft as compared to a 3-4ft shot, many of which even in pro matches will slop in hitting one of the jaws or maybe 1/4" off centre-pocket but with a longer pot that 1/4" of 3ft turns into 1/2" error and he jaws the pot and misses. Nothing to do with being unable to sight the shot.

That's my 2 cents worth.

[pottr]

Also, I have always insisted that, barring kicks, 99.9% of pots are missed because the player didn't deliver the cue straight down the line of aim and with no unintentional side. I still believe the biggest factor holding back players is the inability to deliver the cue perfectly straight since without that it's not very helpful to start attempting to play position well and also to be using side. In addition, the reason long pots are missed is because there is less room for error over 10ft as compared to a 3-4ft shot, many of which even in pro matches will slop in hitting one of the jaws or maybe 1/4" off centre-pocket but with a longer pot that 1/4" of 3ft turns into 1/2" error and he jaws the pot and misses. Nothing to do with being unable to sight the shot.

What that man said.

[tedisbill]

What that man said.

Yep. What Terry said.